Business
S2 EP2 Joe Brough | Hive Plastics
In this episode of the Explore Local Podcast, host David Johnson welcomes Joe Brough, owner of Hi-Plastics, to discuss the unique process of rotational molding and its advantages over other plastic ma...
S2 EP2 Joe Brough | Hive Plastics
Business •
0:00 / 0:00
Interactive Transcript
spk_0
This episode is presented by Visit Cedar City Brian Head Tourism Bureau.
spk_0
Discover the art of adventure at Utah's Gateway to the Parks.
spk_0
Cedar City is within a few hours drive from six different national parks and monuments,
spk_0
and only 30 minutes from Freschno at Brian Head Resort.
spk_0
Check out VisitCedarCity.com to plan your next trip.
spk_0
This episode is sponsored by the Cedar City Business and Innovation Center.
spk_0
Dedicated to supporting local businesses and entrepreneurs,
spk_0
it provides resources and services aimed at fostering business creation, growth, and retention.
spk_0
To learn more and get involved, visit innovationcenter.cc.
spk_0
Hello and welcome to the Explore Local Podcast presented by Visit Cedar City Brian Head,
spk_0
in partnership with Cedar City Iron County Economic Development,
spk_0
produced by Dallas Smith Media, and I'm your host, David Johnson.
spk_0
Today we have a special guest that I'm excited to have on the podcast.
spk_0
It's Joe Brooth, who's with Hi-Plastics.
spk_0
He's the owner of Hi-Plastics, which is a new company that has just come into Iron County,
spk_0
and they're about to get rolling.
spk_0
So Joe, welcome to the show.
spk_0
Thank you very much. It's good to be with you, David, and we're glad to be here in Iron County.
spk_0
Awesome.
spk_0
So you and I started talking, I don't know, probably a year, maybe more.
spk_0
A year and a half or something ago.
spk_0
And you were looking to bring Hi-Plastics potentially to Iron County.
spk_0
Now, I guess before we dive into what made you decide to come here,
spk_0
let's give us a high level of what is Hi-Plastics and what do you guys do?
spk_0
Well, we're a rotational motor, which is kind of a unique plastic process,
spk_0
where you build large hollow products generally.
spk_0
Most people know about blow-mole-ing and injection-mole-ing in those type of plastic processes,
spk_0
but ours is unique in the fact that it's slower, it builds a stronger product.
spk_0
It is more labor-intensive than the other processes.
spk_0
The size of the machinery is substantially larger physically.
spk_0
And I started in business in 1992 doing this with another partner.
spk_0
And we sold our business in 2021, and I thought I was retiring to Hurricane.
spk_0
And enjoyed World War At, and it was very much a bit of a transition time.
spk_0
But that's a unique business, it's a fun business, it is labor-intensive, takes a work ethic.
spk_0
So that's kind of where we were at in 2021.
spk_0
And then just some customers and some other reasons have come up where I thought,
spk_0
I feel too young to be retired, not sure what I'm going to do when I grow up,
spk_0
but we just looked at it and said, let's go back to business.
spk_0
So that's where we're at.
spk_0
That's awesome.
spk_0
So now, talk more about rotational motor, you kind of dove into it a little bit,
spk_0
but how does that process look like?
spk_0
So you mentioned other forms of plastics, manufacturing.
spk_0
Give us the comparison for the lay person who has no clue what is rotational molding
spk_0
versus some of those other things and what happens.
spk_0
And that process you just talked about, it's more slow in the process and more sturdy.
spk_0
Let's give just some examples of some of the other things that people might be familiar with.
spk_0
Blow molding tends to, it's just what it talks about, uses air and liquid plastic
spk_0
and blows it into some type of form.
spk_0
It's fast.
spk_0
It's structurally not nearly as strong as our process.
spk_0
And things should be known for that or bottles, you know, your milk jugs.
spk_0
Some of the products like the smaller kayaks are blow molded.
spk_0
I was going to ask about kayaks.
spk_0
And so there's a lot of different products that you can blow mold.
spk_0
And some of those overlap with rotational molding.
spk_0
They can do both ways.
spk_0
So there's some advantages.
spk_0
Blow molding, your molds are very expensive.
spk_0
Rotational molding and comparison molds are relatively cheap.
spk_0
Is that because the blow molding is just like custom molds that you just stir up plastic?
spk_0
They're all custom molds.
spk_0
So with blow molding, you typically are literally blowing in a stream or a circle of plastic
spk_0
and the molds will grab it.
spk_0
And it cuts off the plastic and it cools real quick.
spk_0
Open up part comes out, grab it and you're talking anywhere between like three to two and a half to maybe six or seven minutes cycle times.
spk_0
Oh really?
spk_0
Really really fast.
spk_0
As you blow plastic into something, say if you're blowing it into a corner,
spk_0
realize it's stretching all the way to the corner.
spk_0
So corners are not exaggerating, but they're weaker.
spk_0
Injection molding, which is the most common thing,
spk_0
will be usually smaller solid plastic stuff that have a metal tool that you push liquid into it.
spk_0
And then it holds it and it pops it out.
spk_0
There's lots of things that are made that way, most of your smaller plastic things are made that way.
spk_0
Strong, fast, and things like your covers over your water sprinkler things outside.
spk_0
Those are injection molded.
spk_0
They tend to not be hollow on the inside because you can't make a hollow product on an injection molded process.
spk_0
So those are some of the processes that rotational molding is you build a mold and you pour a powder inside of it.
spk_0
It rotates dry.
spk_0
Just dry powder.
spk_0
And it rotates on two axis.
spk_0
So it's spinning both this way and this way at the same time.
spk_0
And you never take the plastic to liquid form.
spk_0
Really?
spk_0
It just gets to a temperature that you know and you've controlled it to a gets to a call attack estate.
spk_0
So it starts just sticking to the outside of the mold to where the heat is hottest at first.
spk_0
Is that because it's just through centrifugal forces just like flinging to the...
spk_0
Well, it's not flinging.
spk_0
It's really just slowly rolling around the mold.
spk_0
Oh, so...
spk_0
And stick into the sides.
spk_0
It's a slow spin.
spk_0
It's not some fast.
spk_0
No, it's slow.
spk_0
Oh, okay.
spk_0
And our process, an oven cooked time will be between, you know, fastest ones are probably 16, 17 minutes.
spk_0
The long ones could be 40, 45.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
So minimum about still three times the amount of time that the the blow molding that is.
spk_0
That's at least three times.
spk_0
Oh, okay.
spk_0
And it builds up on the outside walls where the heat is the most.
spk_0
So you think about it.
spk_0
If you've got a 90 degree angle, the heat here is not the same as the two metal parts coming together at the bottom.
spk_0
Gotcha.
spk_0
So it's just the opposite.
spk_0
Corners are built stronger.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
And then you can get thicknesses that you usually can't blow mold.
spk_0
And you can do parts a half inch thick.
spk_0
Because it just keeps putting the plastic on the outside as you get, you know, as it gets hotter and hotter or holds the temperature at the point that it sticks longer and longer.
spk_0
So when we say a 40 minute cycle time on something, that's usually something that's pretty thick.
spk_0
Wow.
spk_0
Because it's going to keep laying it up as it rotates on the two axis.
spk_0
What are some of the common things?
spk_0
Most of the big refuge containers for garbage are rotationally molded.
spk_0
So you look at a big plastic dumpster at a park or something like that.
spk_0
Those will be rotomolded.
spk_0
The dumpster itself are just the lids or both.
spk_0
Well, both.
spk_0
But you'll see dumpsters or plastic ones.
spk_0
You'll see metal ones as well.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
The plastic ones are almost, well, not almost.
spk_0
They're always rotomolded.
spk_0
A lot of your home, 100 liter or 100 gallon garbage cans that are outside that the trucks pick up automated, they're all rotomolded.
spk_0
So big kayaks, heavy duty kayaks, we used to build those in my previous life in Brigham City, they're rotomolded.
spk_0
If people need specialty barrels that need real strength to them, they're rotomolded.
spk_0
So for example, storage tanks for water in your home,
spk_0
there are blow molded products out there, but who wants something that's got weakness in the corners?
spk_0
You want something strong.
spk_0
Our product is more expensive than the competitive rotational, I mean, the competitive blow molded home storage products.
spk_0
But we're going to do, we do, you know, 30 gallon tanks, 55 gallon tanks, 300 gallon tanks that are for home water storage.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
So when you were talking about the molds, excuse me, spinning around, are the molds themselves acting as a heating element, or are they in some sort of chamber that's being heated?
spk_0
Very large chamber.
spk_0
Our first chamber is 16 feet by 16 feet.
spk_0
And so an arm pivots into the chamber that's holding the molds on.
spk_0
The molds are just made out of, they can be made out of aluminum, stainless steel, metals, but they're metals.
spk_0
And the oven is literally an oven.
spk_0
We could bake the biggest marshmallow roast you ever thought of, you know, so you figure an oven that is 16 feet by 16 feet.
spk_0
And you're pivoting an arm in there and then it starts spinning on those two accesses inside that oven.
spk_0
There's two cooling chambers when it comes out.
spk_0
A pre-cooled station where you're blowing a lot of air across the mold.
spk_0
And then it goes into a station where it's in the summertime, we missed it.
spk_0
So it's, you know, it's literally a, you know, mist water that's blown in there.
spk_0
It's amazing.
spk_0
The floor will stay dry.
spk_0
You'll never even see it hit the cement because it hits the molds and it's just cools right then.
spk_0
In a winter time, it's not needed.
spk_0
So we'll have two just air cooled stations during the winter time.
spk_0
You talked about when you put them in the molds, it's in a powder form.
spk_0
So I was picturing like a little plastic beads.
spk_0
So it's truly like almost like flour type of flour.
spk_0
spk_0
I'd say it's in between in terms of granular size, sugar and flour.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
But it's a powder.
spk_0
Is there a specific name for that type of powder?
spk_0
Well, there are lots of different types of powders that you can run in rotational molding.
spk_0
Some people run nylons, some people run, you know, different, like I say, different.
spk_0
We are, the olefins are the most common and we are almost 100% polyethylene.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
So it just depends the densities.
spk_0
We'll go all the way from what they call a three melt to, you know, nine or ten melts.
spk_0
And those have just different characteristics.
spk_0
But polyethylene are a very strong plastic.
spk_0
They have memory, which means you punch them in the end and then go back to their shape.
spk_0
Gotcha.
spk_0
And they have a lot of tensile strength so they don't get punctured.
spk_0
You're gripping water tanks outside storage.
spk_0
You're, you know, 1500 to 5 or 10,000 gallon tanks are usually rolled up all the time.
spk_0
Gotcha.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
So you're going to have to forgive my, my childish mind is going to, if I had a factory like that in your previous life,
spk_0
I would be scheming all the things that I could create a mold for and make for myself or my kids or something just crazy fun that I'm not also selling on the market.
spk_0
Did you ever do anything fun like that?
spk_0
We were like, oh, I'm going to mold something just to have it the house.
spk_0
I'm sure it'd be expensive.
spk_0
They are expensive.
spk_0
But you have your, your things that you hobbies or things you like.
spk_0
So there was one product that we looked at.
spk_0
I'm, I'm avid outdoors.
spk_0
I'd love to hunt and down here in Cedar City, you deal with drought and, and there's a lot of people like the outdoors.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
So if you look at the water collection systems,
spk_0
on guzzlers that they put in the, in the mountains and so forth, to try and capture rain for wildlife,
spk_0
we did develop a product.
spk_0
It's like a great big inverted umbrella.
spk_0
The capture rain, we had one that per one inch of rain, I think was captured in 52 gallons worth of water.
spk_0
Wow.
spk_0
We would put it into a storage tank and then we had an opening at one side so wildlife could come and drink out of it.
spk_0
Expensive hobby project.
spk_0
We never made any money on it.
spk_0
But yeah, we built that mold and we sold several to the state of Utah.
spk_0
You know what?
spk_0
I've been out hiking before and seeing those exact things.
spk_0
And I'm wondering what they were in dirt biking and forewheeling.
spk_0
I've seen some of those out in the middle of nowhere and I thought, what is this?
spk_0
Somebody told me, oh, that's for wildlife, it collects water for them.
spk_0
So I had no idea.
spk_0
That was one of our hobby projects that we just did and say, yeah, I mean, you wouldn't do it very often.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
We did have one person that created like literally a hand chair.
spk_0
You might have seen him.
spk_0
Oh, yeah.
spk_0
It's just like a hand.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
Those were rolled in molded.
spk_0
I'm sure he never made any money on those.
spk_0
We ran a few for him.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
But yeah, those are some of the fun things.
spk_0
But our customers, I mean, we sold to the state of Utah.
spk_0
They were buying, I'd say, between 30 and 50 every year to put out.
spk_0
Really?
spk_0
They would helicopter them into areas where they could drop them and it was a good way to collect water for wildlife.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
I'm sitting here trying to think.
spk_0
Our memory was kind of the one particular area that I remember.
spk_0
It was kind of like a desert is sharing.
spk_0
We drove for a long time to go in this random hike and with some friends.
spk_0
And I just remember seeing those out there thing in.
spk_0
I've never seen anything like this before.
spk_0
That is so funny that I've seen that product out there.
spk_0
And they're usually, I mean, the colors we did were to blend in with nature.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
So we did what we were called granites.
spk_0
So they're speckled like rocks.
spk_0
Uh-huh.
spk_0
And we did gray and sandstone ones.
spk_0
So if they put a sandstone one out in our desert here,
spk_0
unless you knew what you were looking at, a helicopter wouldn't say them.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
I mean, they really blend in well.
spk_0
Oh, that's cool.
spk_0
Okay, tell me what's one of the funnest projects you've worked on.
spk_0
I mean, you're talking about like dumpsters and things like that.
spk_0
Nothing to, uh, I don't usually use this word, but in world leave inacular.
spk_0
Nothing too sexy going on here with rotational molding.
spk_0
But what's some of the cool projects you've worked on?
spk_0
You talk about that handchair, I don't know.
spk_0
You talk about that.
spk_0
And that's one of the fun things that we always like to joke about.
spk_0
But yeah, you ask my son, you know, what does he do?
spk_0
He's like, I built garbage cans for living.
spk_0
People are like, well, that sounds like real fun.
spk_0
Well, you need garbage cans, right?
spk_0
spk_0
But it is, I won't say it's a romantic industry at all.
spk_0
We did some big projects before for like Boeing and Lockheed Martin,
spk_0
where what you would do is build literally hundreds of mold, not hundreds,
spk_0
but probably 50 to 60 molds that they're going to run in maximum of 10 or 15 parts out of each one.
spk_0
And it's to build different types of planes.
spk_0
Oh, wow.
spk_0
And so what they would do is these are really just forms.
spk_0
They have to fit together with taunts and then they would spin parts of surround them
spk_0
to build, for example, fuselage.
spk_0
This is special fuselage.
spk_0
And then they literally pop our big plastic membranes and suck them out of what they had just built.
spk_0
Really?
spk_0
And so, yeah.
spk_0
And so those were some of the interesting ones where really it wasn't, I mean, to me,
spk_0
it was a way for them to create their own molds.
spk_0
Yeah, that's what I'm saying.
spk_0
It's almost like you're molding a mold for that.
spk_0
Yeah, that's what it sounds like.
spk_0
So instead of our molds is always the outside.
spk_0
What we were building for them was the inside.
spk_0
Interesting.
spk_0
And we did that for a few tank manufacturer that was building the natural gas tanks for vehicles.
spk_0
So we built something also that then they filament bound around the outside and then they'd suck our part out of it.
spk_0
So literally a very interesting, different process.
spk_0
I'll be honest.
spk_0
I hope we don't get into doing a lot of that here.
spk_0
It takes a ton of engineering.
spk_0
And the precision is really, really technical and difficult.
spk_0
But now those were some fun, very unusual projects.
spk_0
We were one of the very first to spin camouflage in kayaks.
spk_0
Really?
spk_0
And so that was kind of an interesting process.
spk_0
I learned how to do that.
spk_0
To get it to make the patterns of camouflage.
spk_0
Yeah, you think about it.
spk_0
You're just putting powder in there.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
And I'm not painting it.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
And so I mean some of them paint nowadays.
spk_0
Right.
spk_0
And they got paint still here to plastics.
spk_0
Well, not but when we started, no.
spk_0
Right.
spk_0
So we did some interesting things.
spk_0
You'd put instead of spinning on the, you think if you're spinning on two axes,
spk_0
you're mixing up all the colors on the inside.
spk_0
Right.
spk_0
That's what I want.
spk_0
How do you even make the pattern?
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
So what we would do is we would preheat the mold.
spk_0
So we'd stick them in the oven without rotating heat it up.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
And then start spinning on just one axis for maybe three or four minutes.
spk_0
And so on just one axis, you could get the different, if you put the materials in each line,
spk_0
you could get it spinning and you could get a tan line and dark green line and black line.
spk_0
But they're spinning so they're kind of mixing together on the edges of the color.
spk_0
So there's no two kayaks that ever were identical.
spk_0
Oh, that's cool.
spk_0
And then as soon as you feel like you had the skin, you turn on the other axis for the strength.
spk_0
So if you looked on the inside of it, it's just a conglomerate of different colors.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
But on the outside it was a camel.
spk_0
Really?
spk_0
That is so cool.
spk_0
For like fishing hunting kayaks.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
A lot of fishing kayaks.
spk_0
Interesting.
spk_0
Well, I don't know.
spk_0
I've never, I've never duck hunted.
spk_0
Do duck hunters shoot off a kayak?
spk_0
It's probably not.
spk_0
No, but we do.
spk_0
You maybe have seen we did for a customer build the things that the duck hunters would lay in on the sides.
spk_0
Oh, that's true.
spk_0
And then they sit up.
spk_0
We built some of those.
spk_0
Oh, really?
spk_0
And that wasn't our product that was theirs.
spk_0
Oh, gotcha.
spk_0
That is cool.
spk_0
Well, okay.
spk_0
So take me back even further in history.
spk_0
You kind of, I think, made a brief mention of it at the beginning when you're kind of doing the intro.
spk_0
What got you into rotational molding first and then what made you go and take the lead to open up your own business originally?
spk_0
Well, it's 1992.
spk_0
And at the time I was looking, my education was an undergraduate and finance and MBA.
spk_0
And I have entrepreneurial blood in me.
spk_0
So I was looking to say I'm going to start my own business.
spk_0
At the time, I had worked for other employers and just started looking at different things.
spk_0
One of the counsel I received is, as I go to the banks and ask them about interesting projects that they wouldn't fund.
spk_0
Heal me.
spk_0
And so I went and met with an individual, couple of individuals and said, hey, if there's some really good ideas that come along,
spk_0
that you're not willing to fund, send them my way.
spk_0
And so I had a lot of crazy projects that I won't mention, but along came an individual that had had some reasons why banks wouldn't finance him.
spk_0
But his idea and concept was, look, rotational molding, you're shipping air, which is true.
spk_0
He says, so most of the businesses are regional.
spk_0
You can't really be national.
spk_0
You can't afford the freight cost of it.
spk_0
So he had a business plan, had it all laid out.
spk_0
And yet, no bank was going to finance him for some historical reasons that had happened.
spk_0
So I looked at the plan and thought, wow, this is really true.
spk_0
You know, the closest roller molders at that point in time were really California.
spk_0
There was one there being Nampa Idaho.
spk_0
But what we said, custom motor molders, building product for other people.
spk_0
From Brigham City, we had a 500 mile radius where there really was no competition.
spk_0
So all the big, all the roller molder product that was coming into Utah was being burned with freight.
spk_0
And so we just kind of looked at that niche and said, okay, here we go.
spk_0
And so that was the decision three very painful years at the beginning.
spk_0
I can remember pulling out of my personal savings, everything I had to meet a couple payrolls.
spk_0
I was just going to ask, how did you get your startup fund?
spk_0
Well, we bought, I bought some personally, but the rest of it was, we just put money in.
spk_0
And it wasn't a lot, but it was scary.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
And so I eventually, in 2007, I bought my partner out at that point in time,
spk_0
my younger brother invested with me.
spk_0
And so he was my partner as we kind of grew from there.
spk_0
And your original partner was the gentleman with the original concept?
spk_0
Correct.
spk_0
That's correct.
spk_0
So you were able to figure out a way without giving any of your proprietary secrets.
spk_0
I guess you were able to figure out a way to mass produce and ship beyond just locally without pain.
spk_0
Like you said, for air to ship air, what?
spk_0
Tell me a little bit more about that.
spk_0
Can, I mean, you still got to find your main alleyways.
spk_0
And there's some, for example, because of strategically what we're at and costs,
spk_0
I can compete with the Southern California road of molders, because with my costs here,
spk_0
I can afford to fray and go into Southern California and be competitive.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
We really before, and then you get to where you have certain customers that really from a geographic company,
spk_0
standpoint, they got to pick, you know, two or three road of molders and say we can be here.
spk_0
We can be there to try and spread out freight all over.
spk_0
So we networked with other people.
spk_0
We could say use that road of molder that's in X place.
spk_0
Oh, no.
spk_0
That road of molder that's in Y place.
spk_0
Now we'll take your business in as long as you have enough molds.
spk_0
We'll send them there.
spk_0
We'll send them there.
spk_0
Wow.
spk_0
And then you get others that have a proprietary product or a need.
spk_0
They want just in time service.
spk_0
That you meet those type of needs and freight's in material to them,
spk_0
especially like in the pharmaceutical industries.
spk_0
They look at it and say we're producing a $300 barrel that they're putting $90,000 worth of product inside.
spk_0
The barrel is a immaterial cost.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
But if you don't have the barrel on time or if it has a quality problem with it,
spk_0
that's devastating to their process.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
So you just have to become good at different things to be able to reach out beyond your area.
spk_0
And we always felt that we were pretty good at that.
spk_0
And historically I think it would say that we were.
spk_0
Do you engineer design build the molds for the clients?
spk_0
Or do they come with pre-made molds?
spk_0
Or how does that work?
spk_0
spk_0
You know, both.
spk_0
But we do, we have our own product lines too.
spk_0
I mean, obviously that the home storage water tanks you'll see here in the near future.
spk_0
And you can even find it now.
spk_0
It's called emergency water tanks, EWT.
spk_0
We are going to be out selling those.
spk_0
And so we take that product from the ground all the way up.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
And if you look on the internet and I can say you can find them right now,
spk_0
we're trying to go slow because we're still perfecting some things with that.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
But so we do have in-house engineering.
spk_0
Gotcha.
spk_0
And we design everything up to the point of sending them out to mold makers.
spk_0
There are mold makers you make them different times.
spk_0
You do fabricated, you do cast aluminum.
spk_0
Depends on what you want in the final product and the cost inside of it.
spk_0
And so, yeah, we handle all of that for a customer.
spk_0
If they come in and say this is the product we want.
spk_0
And we'll coach them because sometimes they walk in and we have to say,
spk_0
well, that's really a blow molded product.
spk_0
Oh, okay.
spk_0
That's not a roto one.
spk_0
And in the past, we had some blow molders that we'd even refer them to and say,
spk_0
here's where you go.
spk_0
But we'd sit down with them and make sure that they look at it and say,
spk_0
this is some rough costing.
spk_0
Is it something you really want to do?
spk_0
Because I mean, still, even though our molds are substantially less,
spk_0
you can still be looking 30, 35,000 for a mold.
spk_0
Really?
spk_0
And in blow molding, that same mold probably be 150 to 200,000 dollars.
spk_0
But it's an investment.
spk_0
So we try to coach them through and really talk to them about their products that they have ideas on.
spk_0
We don't want to see anybody fail.
spk_0
So there have been a few times when we say,
spk_0
we really don't want to do that for you.
spk_0
We don't think that's going to work.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
And we know that, you know,
spk_0
there's a couple of the occasions they've gone to other roto molders and had it produced anyway.
spk_0
And I would say our run rate was pretty good on those.
spk_0
I only know of one of them that ever succeeded.
spk_0
I know of several of them that still failed.
spk_0
So we feel like we owe it to them to be a good business partner too
spk_0
and say, here's what we think the challenge is what that product will be.
spk_0
Oh, that's awesome.
spk_0
So those molds are, maybe you said this,
spk_0
what kind of materials the mold itself made out of?
spk_0
It's usually made out of one of three different types of material.
spk_0
Aluminum is common, common, both cast and fabricated and machined.
spk_0
Aluminum.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
Stainless steel is another one.
spk_0
A lot of the really, really big products, the molds, you can't afford to store them indoors.
spk_0
So they're outdoors.
spk_0
So you want stainless, so you're not getting rust and so forth.
spk_0
So fabricated stainless steel is another really common one.
spk_0
Your soft metals are also very common to be used.
spk_0
Do you store all the molds for your clients or do they take them?
spk_0
No, we might end up store them on them.
spk_0
And so it sounds to me too, like with your business model,
spk_0
you have a base of products that you form and sell as well as taking on clients.
spk_0
It's not just all 100% in my base.
spk_0
No, correct.
spk_0
In our previous life, I'll say the company that we own for 29 years,
spk_0
we were probably 80% custom.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
And it will still be strongly custom.
spk_0
Gotcha.
spk_0
But there are product lines that in the long run, you have vision and say,
spk_0
I want to be here, I want to be there.
spk_0
And you know, you wait because some of those are expensive processes.
spk_0
There's a lot of testing and engineering, you want to do them right.
spk_0
So we'll see here, but we were very good at custom.
spk_0
And we plan on doing that again, but yes, we will have our own product lines.
spk_0
Do those own products help maintain the level of stability?
spk_0
In fluctuations with clients?
spk_0
Yes, it's a lot of the answers.
spk_0
Honestly, the market's really competitive out there for custom road and molding.
spk_0
So a lot of proprietary is where you actually are working on trying to cover more costs.
spk_0
Oh, gotcha.
spk_0
Because you're taking out usually a third step or a third margin in it.
spk_0
But you've got to be careful too, because you don't ever want to hurt one of your customers.
spk_0
So you don't want to build a product that's going to take away from their sales.
spk_0
Right.
spk_0
So, yeah, so it's a fine line.
spk_0
And so you choose some specific areas you say, I'm going to do this for ourselves.
spk_0
And home water storage is one that, you know, for the homes.
spk_0
If someone was to come and say, hey, I want to build a water tank for home storage and sell it.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
We would know that we're competing already and we can price them out.
spk_0
So it's not really fair for us to take that on.
spk_0
Gotcha.
spk_0
But if it came and said, you know, I'm doing this other type of tank or that tank that's for different industries.
spk_0
Yeah, we understand that and we're good at custom.
spk_0
And that's what we did a ton of people.
spk_0
That's awesome.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
Well, now let's dive in to hive plastics.
spk_0
You know, I think, and thanks for indulging me on the processes on your past and how you got into it.
spk_0
Tell us about, let's start high level.
spk_0
Well, what's, tell us about the building, the location, the capital investment.
spk_0
Talk a little bit about that and I'll pick your brain from there.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
Well, about, well, I think it was May of last year.
spk_0
I had been thinking about it and that's kind of when I think we probably met about that.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
Is I felt like, no, I want to do this again.
spk_0
And just in thought process of our old customer base, going through the geography again sin, where are the other road of molders that are custom?
spk_0
Right.
spk_0
spk_0
Where strategically would be a good place for us to physically be.
spk_0
And we had determined that the I-15 corridor, I want to say we, which was just myself.
spk_0
And in studying, I thought I-15 corridor somewhere between basin and Las Vegas.
spk_0
Okay. That was kind of where I'm looking at saying geography wise.
spk_0
We had a lot of customer base in Southern California, a lot in Northern Utah from our old businesses.
spk_0
So some of those clients who encouraged me to get back in business, I'm saying, okay, freight wise for them, this is kind of where we want to be.
spk_0
So we started looking and I looked to just try and buy a building, to be honest.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
Thought it would be faster in, be easier, and found two buildings.
spk_0
Both of them are very old.
spk_0
I mean, we're talking 1980s that they were built, 1990s, early 1990s, and they really didn't meet what we needed.
spk_0
And so I looked at and said, oh my word, I'm going to dump a fortune in them to make them what we need them to be.
spk_0
And that's in the whole region that you were looking in between.
spk_0
Pumpay, send in Las Vegas.
spk_0
That's crazy.
spk_0
I found two.
spk_0
I actually often get business requests for existing buildings in a rural area and I often say that's really hard to find.
spk_0
It is hard to find.
spk_0
And they really don't exist.
spk_0
I tell some of these developers, you know, there's some hesitation of building kind of spec buildings and things, but I tell a lot of developers, I get this request all the time.
spk_0
There's value in building some of these spec buildings for exactly what you're talking about because otherwise companies are just looking at some old buildings from the 80s that are going to cost as much to renovate as they would to just build your own.
spk_0
And that's kind of where you were sitting.
spk_0
Yeah, that's why I said, you know, and I understand that the concern of the developer, I do think there's a need for it.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
We're such unique from infrastructure standpoint.
spk_0
It would have been hard for them to do that.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
But I agree with you.
spk_0
Even if you could come in and say, retro something that was newer, that was, you could see the vision too is a reasonable request.
spk_0
So no, we looked.
spk_0
And then the second part is you're looking at saying, okay, where's there a good workforce?
spk_0
Where's there some potential benefits to being in a location?
spk_0
Really, those were the things we were started at looking at.
spk_0
And when I think I met you at first, I had kind of got down to where I was really thinking between Mesquite and Cedar City.
spk_0
Yeah, yeah, I remember I was talking about that.
spk_0
And there's pluses and minuses to both.
spk_0
But I'll just talk about it culturally.
spk_0
Cedar City is much more like, like who I am.
spk_0
For Mesquite is.
spk_0
I liked the environment.
spk_0
I liked the fact that it's a hard work in rural community.
spk_0
It's got a university here, which is a nice attitude.
spk_0
And a lot of our workforce will be younger.
spk_0
And so the universities really play into that to be able to pull people.
spk_0
So we got down to those two points.
spk_0
And about July or August, in that time frame, I really had to be making a decision if I wanted to build.
spk_0
Our goal was to be operational in September 1 of 2025.
spk_0
And I had talked to one particular customer that I had really, well, we talked to several.
spk_0
But one I had committed to be in production by that date.
spk_0
So the timeline of building a brand new building, getting everything going in 12 months is a pretty tall task.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
So we finally got down to our work with the Inland Port, which is where you came in and looked at trying to receive some incentives there.
spk_0
And I won't say the incentives made the final decision because in the big scope of things, they're immaterial.
spk_0
I mean, they're just a nice benefit.
spk_0
But comparing what we could get from Mesquite to Cedar City, or reasonably similar.
spk_0
So you look and say, OK, that's nice.
spk_0
But we felt more welcomed here in the end.
spk_0
And just the environment, the culture of who and what Cedar City is.
spk_0
So we determined, OK, here we go.
spk_0
We're going to go to Cedar City.
spk_0
I had been looking at several parcels.
spk_0
We wanted to stay in the Inland Port.
spk_0
Like I said, one of the big advantages to us long run will be the trans-loading facilities.
spk_0
There's two of them there.
spk_0
I mean, I've stayed in touch with both of them.
spk_0
And we will bring in what you talked about earlier, the pellets.
spk_0
And we will actually pulverize it and make the powder ourselves.
spk_0
So I was going to ask that.
spk_0
That's interesting.
spk_0
I didn't know.
spk_0
The day will come, we'll do that.
spk_0
And that's why the trans-loaders were important to us.
spk_0
We did that in Brigham City.
spk_0
We trans-loaded out of Salt Lake.
spk_0
And so there were a lot of reasons saying, look, this trans-loader is five miles down the road from where we ended up.
spk_0
That's a lot different than 80 miles into Salt Lake from Brigham City.
spk_0
Right.
spk_0
So there were things that we looked at and said, no, we're going to go to Cedar City.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
Lots of mention casinos versus the Utah Shake, Spirifestful and National Parks.
spk_0
So they're more enjoyable.
spk_0
And Maldives, and Malson, Huype, and Desert and more desert.
spk_0
We've got our desert too.
spk_0
We do, but you know, it's, and again, work ethics is important to us and this community.
spk_0
I won't say Malskiy doesn't have that, but we felt really good about this.
spk_0
spk_0
So lo and behold, we started building.
spk_0
I think that we are building permits for the end of August last year, somewhere in there.
spk_0
And we really started going September and received occupancy permits in June of this year.
spk_0
And opened up the doors on September 2nd because the first was Labor Day.
spk_0
Yeah, that's right.
spk_0
So yeah, we've been running production just for a couple of weeks and having all of those problems with startups that people know.
spk_0
Sure, working through the keeks.
spk_0
So, you know, a substantial investment.
spk_0
We raised, I won't say we raised them.
spk_0
It's really my capital with the also a couple other partners, one being my son.
spk_0
But all of it is cashing.
spk_0
And at our point, we didn't borrow anything.
spk_0
And so when you look at this substantial investment that we implant on completing at the end of five years,
spk_0
with growth and getting a good workforce going, it's substantial personally.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
So it was a big decision, especially when I thought I wasn't ever working again.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
Well, I know that the state had put out the inland port and put out that you have,
spk_0
that this whole project as a whole will be about a 12 million plus capital investment.
spk_0
That you're putting right here into iron county, right here into Utah.
spk_0
And those incentives that you talk about just for so people who are listening and understand those incentives,
spk_0
those, that's not money upfront.
spk_0
That is incentives based on post performance, based on newly generated revenue.
spk_0
And it's a small, only a small portion of the newly generated revenue.
spk_0
And that's to help make us competitive with other markets like a mosquito or a vagus or a Denver or somewhere else
spk_0
that's maybe offering these incentives.
spk_0
We've got to be able to compete with those areas and then win them out, so to speak, on our quality of life,
spk_0
on our workforce and those different types of things that you mentioned.
spk_0
It's that combination that draws companies in.
spk_0
If I'm putting a little words in your mouth, but now you're really right.
spk_0
But so let's kind of look at the whole picture there.
spk_0
So the incentives at the inland port, depending on your size, is basically 10% as the categor I fit in,
spk_0
have your property tax and your personal property taxes.
spk_0
So you look at that and say, okay, that's nice.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
And it's a good incentive.
spk_0
It's nothing huge.
spk_0
It's not huge.
spk_0
You look at it and say if you're making a $12 million investment and in the course of a year,
spk_0
that means $20,000 that one.
spk_0
spk_0
It's nice.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
And I'm not saying you're short away.
spk_0
But that big decision on that whole investment is driven more by the things that you mentioned.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
Both you and you know that Danny also helps a lot in influencing things, introducing me to Savage and to IBiz.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
And getting out and saying long run here's some vision that helps you.
spk_0
You personally introduced me to someone in town who I won't mention that could be very beneficial
spk_0
to us long run and they have been.
spk_0
And so we started just looking at it and those things come through.
spk_0
You also have some of the rural grants, but you look at it and say in year one,
spk_0
they might get as much as $6,000 total back on an employee salary.
spk_0
Well, if you're trying to be a little bit above the average pay in the state,
spk_0
that's not long run a decision maker.
spk_0
You make a decision because this, I'm going to quote somebody, this is the place.
spk_0
It just felt right in the end to make that decision.
spk_0
We've had to put about half of that full amount up right now just to get running.
spk_0
And then you look at it strategically.
spk_0
One of these big machines are really, really expensive, but strategically you guys see how your product line folds out.
spk_0
Whether you need bigger ones, smaller ones.
spk_0
When does the pulverizer come into play?
spk_0
spk_0
So we're dealing with some of the things that every business is that most of the pulverizers we really like are built in Canada.
spk_0
So with some tear issues right now, it's not that I'm trying to be bio pulverizers.
spk_0
You just kind of play the game that every businessman has to do as to what you're going on.
spk_0
So exciting we think when we put out the projections where we're going to get there are some things automation wise
spk_0
that will make it to or not quite as personnel heavy for the same revenue that we had in Brigham City.
spk_0
But still, we see ourselves at 60-ish employees at the end of five years.
spk_0
Today we have eight.
spk_0
So we started September 1 and we're at 8th and excited to keep going with this.
spk_0
And as shout out to the ones that we've got here locally for right now, they've done really well.
spk_0
It's three weeks, so it's new.
spk_0
It's physical work and one of the young men, he's been really fun.
spk_0
But he's like, I got shin splints, my feet hurt.
spk_0
I feel like I'm part of the plastic pit team.
spk_0
But he's great at it too.
spk_0
He's been really fun.
spk_0
Well, I can make some recommendations on some comfortable running shoes or whatever he may need.
spk_0
Exactly.
spk_0
I said, I got hocus with pads.
spk_0
Yes, exactly.
spk_0
I can teach you, you know, tell him one of the things to strengthen shins, this is the runner coming out, is practice doing the ABCs with your toes.
spk_0
And that'll strengthen your shins every day.
spk_0
Exactly.
spk_0
No, it's been fun.
spk_0
That's kind of the vision where we were hoping to go.
spk_0
We build a building, we take a lot of power and a lot of gas.
spk_0
And it was when you go from just a plan and you go to Rocky Mountain Power, you go to, you know, embridge and say, this is what we need.
spk_0
Well, the first question is, are you sure?
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
And then trying to get the transformer that end up we needed, we really made the decision.
spk_0
And I have to make a shout out to my old issues of first name, but Cameron here at Rocky Mountain Power, he did huge things to try and help us.
spk_0
Yeah, we, we, I mean, Rocky Mountain Power across the state, we were having troubles.
spk_0
We were being told they were 18 months to two years out and getting a year to 18 months to two years on getting transformers and things.
spk_0
There was a, there's a burger shop that's going to open up here.
spk_0
One of my favorites, seven brothers, burgers, who was told the same thing and our local reps with, with Rocky Mountain Power have working with them and having those relationships have come through and helping us figure out how to resolve that.
spk_0
Very much so.
spk_0
So just to give them that, we, we got them to the local ones we were able to put in order and place it for us.
spk_0
Basically August of 24, tell us that we would have it roughly April of 25.
spk_0
spk_0
It showed up at the end of June, really?
spk_0
spk_0
And we were panic.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
But they come through some, for some temperate, we ended up with the permanent solution.
spk_0
But the permanent gear couldn't find it anywhere.
spk_0
It wasn't showing up on time.
spk_0
We'd come up with some ways to temperate, go to smaller gear and it would meet our needs right now and swap out.
spk_0
But in the end, they really came through and, and so did Ambridge, you know, the local employees for both of those entities have been a blessing to us so far.
spk_0
Oh, that's great.
spk_0
I am so happy to hear that.
spk_0
Well, we talked a little bit to before the show.
spk_0
So we might do something a little more exclusive ribbon cutting.
spk_0
You know, we want to be cognizant of your clients and the process is going on in there and the potential, you know, proprietary things that you're working with your clients on.
spk_0
And so hopefully here in the coming weeks, we'll, we'll do something fun when we'll bring out a couple of the elected officials and kind of let them see firsthand and really, really show off why high plastics came to Iron County.
spk_0
I'm just so excited to have you here, so excited to have been working with you the last year and a half or so.
spk_0
Are there other things to about your company that maybe you want to mention or bring up before we wrap up?
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
You know, where we want to be of value to the community as well in terms of providing good opportunities for young people and, and we're not just young people, but anyone in the community that is looking for employment long run.
spk_0
And we're in it to build products that possibly the local community needs to.
spk_0
I do know, I can drive around and look and say, well, there's a rotationally molded product.
spk_0
You know, what can we do here?
spk_0
And so we hope to be of value to the local business community as well.
spk_0
And to brainstorm them, they may have ideas too of things that they need in their industries that that we're unaware of and they come and say, can you do this?
spk_0
Can you help us with this?
spk_0
So we do want to be a part of the business side here, but no, it's a work side to be here.
spk_0
We are a mundane plastic manufacturer.
spk_0
I love it.
spk_0
And we like what we do.
spk_0
And someone needs to do it well and we plan on doing it well.
spk_0
Yeah, well, I'm excited for that.
spk_0
We'll have to get you connected with the Maiden Southern Utah Manufacturing chapter here in Iron County.
spk_0
In fact, they do exactly what you were just describing.
spk_0
They kind of, these different local manufacturers, they help and support one another and build synergies,
spk_0
even sometimes these competitors working together to help keep the business, the community and our workforce going.
spk_0
And so Joe, I'm so grateful to have you here, Joe, owner of Hive Plastics, newly opened manufacturer here in Iron County in the Cedar City area.
spk_0
And thank you so much for coming on and chatting a little bit about what you have happening.
spk_0
Well, thank you very much. It's good to have been with you.
Topics Covered
Cedar City tourism
Utah national parks
Brian Head Resort
Hi-Plastics
rotational molding
plastic manufacturing
business innovation center
local entrepreneurship
blow molding vs rotational molding
strong plastic products
water storage tanks
outdoor water collection systems
sustainable wildlife solutions
Cedar City business support
plastic dumpster manufacturing