True Crime
The Clone Wars Rewatch: “Heroes On Both Sides”, “Pursuit of Peace”, and “Senate Murders”
In this episode of Sky Talkers, hosts Charlotte and Keetlen dive into a rewatch of three pivotal Clone Wars episodes: 'Heroes On Both Sides,' 'Pursuit of Peace,' and 'Senate M...
The Clone Wars Rewatch: “Heroes On Both Sides”, “Pursuit of Peace”, and “Senate Murders”
True Crime •
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Interactive Transcript
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You're listening to a 58-ember production.
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You found the Clone Wars?
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Yes.
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I was once a Jedi Knight the same as your father.
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Since that, one simple sentence.
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Fans have on different levels been obsessed about thinking
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what was the Clone Wars.
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This idea of doing an animated TV series was intriguing to me because it really did allow me to broaden the canvas of what Star Wars is about.
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Hello and welcome to Sky Talkers. I'm your host Charlotte.
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Hey everyone, I'm your other host, Keetlen and welcome to this week's episode where we are back on our Clone Wars rewatch.
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We are here to talk about three episodes from season three, but it's from season three and season two.
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Heroes on both sides, pursuit of peace, Senate murders, and long-time listeners of Sky Talkers.
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I'm talking the OG listeners of Sky Talkers.
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I've been waiting for this episode with us to talk about Heroes on both sides because there was not a week that went by circa 2017 where we didn't talk about.
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It's just hilarious because whatever. We'll get into it. We'll get into it. There's a lot to say.
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I'm really excited to watch these and to talk them through it because you and I really haven't really talked about what we thought about them.
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It's been a fun weekend rewatching, so let's get into it.
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In part one, we're talking about the context of these episodes.
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In part two, we're talking about characters and themes. In part three, we're giving our highs and lows of these episodes.
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Without further ado, let's get started.
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It talks first, you talk first. I talk first.
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Welcome to part one where we're talking all about the context.
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If you're new here, what we do is we do a summary of each of the episodes in case you are not able to watch along, haven't revisited these episodes in a while, etc.
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Charlotte dives deep into the Jedi Council forums to pull real time reviews from people who were watching these episodes in real time.
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We get a look at the immediate reaction from fandom, which I think is pretty fun. I really enjoy our discussions there.
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We haven't given this disclaimer in a little bit. I think it's high time that we do it again.
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Caitlin and I are rewatching these episodes.
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So if you are watching the Clone Wars for the first time, there's spoilers ahead.
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Whatever we talk about, we'll probably reference the future of the series. So just an FYI.
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Yes, that's good. Spoiler's galore for anything that has aired.
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I've been published.
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That's what we'll be talking about.
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Yeah.
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Yeah. Okay. So our summary is again, we have three episodes here. Heroes on both sides, pursuit of peace and Senate murder.
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So I'm going to start with heroes on both sides, which aired on November 19, 2010, and with season three, episode 10, inside the Senate, a bill is on the table to deregulate the banks and Padme is looking for a way to stop it by opening up peace talks with the separatists.
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Of course, it is illegal for her to reach out to any separatist leaders.
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After a request from Anakin to quote, teach or so, about politics, she teaches us, so how to smuggle her to the planet of raxis.
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So she can talk with her old mentor and separatist leader, Nina Bon Terry, while there is so good meets mean as son, luck, spawn Terry, and learns from both mean and lux that perhaps the war is not as black and white as she thinks.
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Padme convinces mean it to put emotion before the separatists to open up peace talks with the Republic and it passes.
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However, the banking plan and trade federation are profiting off the war and with the help of Count Duku, they all conspire to attack Coruscant and blame the separatists.
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The Republic feels they have been tricked by the separatists and passed the bill to deregulate the banks in the end.
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The next episode is pursuit of peace, which is December, which aired December 3, 2010, and is season three, episode 11.
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The cleaning droids who attacked Coruscant have pushed the Senate Republic Senate to open up more lines of credit to fund the creation of more clone troopers.
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The separatists have withdrawn from peace talks themselves with the death of Nina Bon Terry, which they blame on the Republic.
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Padme, Baylor Gona, and Senator Anaconda far work to figure out how to convince other senators to vote against extending the Republic's line of credit for more troops.
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The banking plan and trade federation set their sights on how to eliminate Padme, Far, and Baal, and send bounty hunters after them all.
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Padme barely escapes into daring speeder bike chase. Far as attacked and breaks an arm, and Baal is attacked in a parking garage and is injured so badly he can't get out of the car.
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He can't give his speech before the Senate to vote against the bill. A nervous Padme gives the speech for Baal, and is able to get the Senate to vote against the bill.
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The episode ends with Palpatine frustrated that the bell passed, but decides he needs to buy his time for now and let the wheels of democracy spin.
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And then the last episode is Senate murders, which takes us back in time and aired March 19, 2010, and was season two, episode 15.
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Padme is introducing a bill to the Senate to reduce military spending and is talking with Anaconda, Manmatha, and Anaconda's mentee, Lolo, about how to find support for the bill.
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Her first speech to the Senate is well received, and when the group has celebratory drinks, Ono is poisoned and immediately dies.
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After the funeral, Padme and Lolo are summoned to Palpatine's office to meet with Inspector Chan Zivo, who will lead an investigation on Anno's murder.
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Suspicion is everywhere, and Padme is convinced that a senator who opposes her military spending reduction bill is behind Ono's murder.
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Baal and Padme take matters into their own hands and are attacked by a hooded figure who tries to kill them.
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Able to escape, they race to the antagonistic senator Dichy's office to confront him for the attack, only to find him dead.
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In a final standoff with their other suspect, Kamino and Senator Brutoni, it is revealed that Lolo was responsible for murdering Ono because she leans him for bringing the war to Rodeo.
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She is arrested and a new bill for increased military spending is passed.
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Palpatine finds Padme after the news, and assures her that more troops and reinforcements will surely mean a faster way to peace.
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Great job, Kalen.
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This is one of those crafted trilogies that has happened by adding two episodes in season three that are prequels to an episode in season two, which is interesting.
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I don't think I clocked that this is going to be a prequel when I was watching it live, but I don't know.
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Maybe I'm not giving myself enough credit for that because it is sort of confusing that Uncle Ono is alive and then dead, and then alive again in season three.
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And is a pretty big character, especially after going to the three watch.
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I feel like he shows up a lot as a really close relationship with Padme.
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I notice it. I don't know about you.
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Yeah, he does. And I remember watching this going, wait, we've seen him before.
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And then I go, wait, isn't he dead? Doesn't he die?
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And then realize this is going to be where he dies, even though it was prior to a new to peace.
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Yeah, exactly. So, Kalen, do you remember these episodes and what impact did they have on you?
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I don't remember a pursuit of peace and Senate murders, except for kind of very loosely, but of course I remember heroes on both sides.
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I think you and I both were a Soca in heroes on both sides.
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And we're both, you know, thinking, well, the separatists started the war.
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And then Minabon Terry is there to show us a different perspective.
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And I think you mean a Soca all went, oh, huh.
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Yeah.
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I just, I just, we were teenagers watching this. Like it just makes sense.
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Yeah.
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And I think in the feature at Dave really focuses on the title of this episode, which comes from the revenge of the Sith opening crawl.
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The heroes on both sides, evil is everywhere, which Dave says in that that he, that was never really explored.
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And this is his occasion to explore it. And I think that there's a lot that it happens in this specific episode that is really new for Star Wars as a whole, I think.
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And good for the Clone Wars, which is why we referenced it often because I think it's easy with Star Wars to talk about things in a black away it's sense.
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But what the prequels do and the Clone Wars as a goal, I think, and we're in the midst of it as we're going through this rewatch and we're seeing it in action.
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The goal is to make things way more nuanced to add more depth to the prequels themselves and to add more depth to Anakin's overall turn to the dark side and the rise of the empire, etc.
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And it leaves room for what George really originally wanted to do with the prequels, but there just isn't enough time.
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But there's time the Clone Wars and we're able to explore how at the end of the day, like the thesis statement is that Palpatine is controlling all of this.
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And I thought it was super interesting that in the feature at Dave talks about how if you think about the separatist as separating from the Republic because they think the Republic is corrupt, what Dave says is, yeah, they're right.
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The Republic is corrupt. And I think the Clone Wars maybe starting with this episode begins this journey for the audience, I think, to be like, yeah, that's true.
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And I think a lot of people were there. We're probably already there because I think we all know that Palpatine is the puppet master, but it's so good to show it in these smaller, smaller stages, I think.
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I agree. It's good to see how far reaching it is and people that are, you know, so far removed from Palpatine are still corrupt themselves.
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And I think we've seen that a couple of different instances, especially thinking about the Mandalore plot and kind of all the best interested parties in what was going on there and how in that arc, you know, we had the introduction of Death Watch, but then I think it was two episodes in that arc actually weren't about death watch.
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They were about corrupt government officials and what they were doing the corruption are giving the corruption arc.
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And this corruption 37 times. Yes, basically a corruption arc as well. For sure.
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I think that that Mandalore arc did a really good job of showing, I think one of George's big points with the prequels of, you know, it's not, it's not this dramatic coup that usually destroys a government.
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And it's the keys being handed over. I think that's the phrase he uses in the revenge of death commentary about the keys being handed over to the dictator Palpatine number of Palpatine.
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And I think that the Mandalore arc did a really good job of showing all those political parties more or less within Mandalore operating for their own selfish interests. And then I think this arc as a whole did a really good job of showing that too within the Senate and kind of
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all these points of communication that are getting crossed and all these people working behind each other's back and, you know, the role of the banking plan and the trade federation and what the, the literal cost of the war is.
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And at one point, I think one of the standout quotes from the whole arc was the banking plan.
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And when the banking plan and the trade federation are plotting, they say the banking plan and trade federation are about business, not violence.
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And then one of them responds, our business is violence. And that's really what it all comes down to. And even though they're working with Joukou through all of this, they're still pretty far removed from Palpatine.
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Like they obviously have no idea that Palpatine is involved in all of this. And it's just, I don't know, it's, it's, it's messy and it's corrupt.
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Oh, yeah, it's very corrupt. For me, I definitely remember these episodes, but they don't really stick out in my mind. I, everyone knows I love Padme. So I'm here for the Padme arc. Yeah, this is a very politically heavy episode.
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Also, we should note that heroes on both sides is the first, first iteration of a new character model that we're exploring in the Clone Wars. And there's a lot of excitement around that.
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We'll get into that when I talk about the Jedi Council forums, but I remember that too. And everyone being pumped about that.
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Yeah, I really remember that. Assoca's new outfit was such a huge, yes, a huge moment, a huge press moment of what she was wearing now.
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Totally. Yeah, I completely, it really was everywhere. And I think that they look great. And I remember thinking, wow, everyone looks really great. The animation looks great. The Assoca new outfit looks awesome. Padme looks good. Anakin looks good.
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Yeah, we'll talk it through about what people thought in the Jedi Council forums, but I just wanted to ask just like I did last episode, what do you think people thought about these episodes?
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I don't know. I think people probably liked heroes on both sides for what it had to say. And I think people, I think generally overall there was really positive feelings about Assoca's character model update and her new outfit.
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I think no matter where you stood on her character, especially then you were very anti-tube job. So I think any, I think the matter of sides of the aisle.
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Yeah, the pie part is a weird choice.
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Pie part is in the person.
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And Cleveland.
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The two top had to go. So I remember that people feeling really positively about that.
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I really, I don't have a lot of memories of watching pursuit of peace and Senate murders. So they're very politically heavy like that it's all about getting bills passed or preventing them from getting passed.
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And they definitely sprinkle in a lot of action, especially with pursuit of peace, but sometimes I think about 13 year old, 14 year old me watching this.
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And I, there's a reason I don't remember those two bills of it all I definitely was not paying attention to and did not care and understand if I'm being completely honest.
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Now, something you're old us.
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I'm like the military reduction spending.
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Oh my god.
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It's work.
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Better work, Padme.
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I know it's like this is actually so important.
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Yeah.
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Yeah, but I don't.
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It's interesting to think about like what adults thought about these episodes at that time because obviously I think a lot of these people in the forums are older adults, honestly.
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So it's kind of interesting to see their perspective on episodes like this, but people like me personally, I did not remember pursuit of peace and Senate murders was not episodes I was putting on rewatch, you know.
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I will say, what did you think about these episodes upon your rewatch for me? I will, I will start.
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I felt like these were kind of harder for me to get to get through than I thought it took me a longer to get through this trilogy than I would have liked.
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I agree.
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I had the same feeling and I think they're I think they have really important things to say.
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And I think that it's weird because I think they did a lot of good character development, obviously for so good, but also for Padme, like within the Senate.
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Seeing her kind of like crash out about having to give the speech instead of bail at the last minute, I thought was I really liked that character moment for her.
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And I think the role of Palpatine in the episodes are is really good too of seeing I think it's one of the first times we're really seeing him be like explicitly.
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I agree.
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Forknaiving an evil in the series so far and I think they sold it really well.
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So I think it does a lot of good things really well, but they're not I mean coming off the zero arc.
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I'm kind of like I know.
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So yeah, I agree.
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I also.
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It's funny because like these episodes took me longer than I would have liked to get through, but at the same time I really liked what they were doing.
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I love that.
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I thought the intrigue was really interesting.
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I didn't know that it was low low. I forgot that.
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And I'm liking these mini mysteries that are coming up in Clone Wars.
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And I'm not remembering the outcome of them and figuring out the who done it of it all.
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It keeps coming up and it's interesting.
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Yeah, I agree.
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I when I was watching this one and they bring in Bertone and watching I'm watching it going it's not her, but who it's so it's obviously a surprise, but who is it?
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And then everyone looks at low low and I go, oh my god, it's well.
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It's funny because the whole tecla of it all the hand made in.
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Oh, yeah.
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I thought she was a like a guilty of something.
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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And I don't know if it comes back later or if she has a corrupt handmaiden in the future and it's just I can't remember that at this point, but I was on high alert around her.
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Then she became like the crux of Padme's huge speech and they felt bad that I was that you suspected her.
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Yes.
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Oh well.
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She could still turn out to be evil down the line.
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Yeah, I think that she has an evil handmaiden.
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I just don't remember when.
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So let's put a put in that.
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Okay.
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All right, let's dive into the forums and start with heroes on both sides.
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So lots of excitement around the new looks.
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And I also want to say I think it's a really good call out that the probable median age of the people in the forums are adults, not kids.
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So I think that's a really good call out that I don't think we talk about enough about the forums.
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Yeah.
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Okay.
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So people are excited and this quote was really funny to me.
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Okay.
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A soak it looks so awesome.
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Anakin looks great.
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A much more like revenge of the set.
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I agree about Obi-Wan looking skinnier.
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Just like the call out of Obi-Wan looking like spelled was really funny.
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He's more trim.
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Yes.
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So there was a lot of talk before the episode aired around negativity around the premise.
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And if you recall, people are hating season three.
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And they are.
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So.
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And we know what's right around the corner, which is just like pure awesomeness.
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But yeah, so the negativity was creeping into this week's forum, of course, because people are feeling low about season three.
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Quote, Padme and Asoka traveled to the CIS capital.
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Does Asoka not know about the million credit bounty on a Jedi?
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What type of peace agreement are they going to forge?
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Are they even going to allow the CIS to separate and form their own for a lack of a better term quote state?
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Won't this make Padme and Asoka look like separate as sympathizers in the eyes of the Republic, especially since they're sneaking around doing this?
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It's a.
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The right questions.
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I know.
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I love that they come back and Anakin is furious at Asoka for using her Jedi credentials to sneak Padme in.
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Padme's own idea.
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And then Asoka is like, you do this all the time.
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And Anakin's like, well, he said he's so right.
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It's different.
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It's so.
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It's a mistake.
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Yeah.
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Okay, lots of good comments about the character design.
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As I said, quote, I love the new character designs.
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Finally, get Obi-Wan and Anakin looking like themselves.
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I also really like Asoka's new outfit.
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No more midriff open.
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Never understood that dot, dot, dot.
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And she looks a lot more mature.
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Let's pray that this new mature Asoka hasn't turned into a Mary Sue.
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I'm not sure how I feel about the Shoto Saber though.
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Dot, dot, dot, dot, dot.
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Included this since we are yes tracking the term Mary Sue.
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This was an interesting use of the term Mary Sue in my opinion.
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Hasn't turned into a Mary Sue.
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What does that mean?
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They'll.
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You don't turn into a Mary Sue.
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Yeah, she's.
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We're seeing character development and growth in Asoka.
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Yeah, that's.
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She's not a Mary Sue.
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I mean, this is just really showing the infancy of the term and how people are misusing it already.
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Or.
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Yeah, applying it to just women characters who are evolving, I guess.
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Okay, so I felt like the forum of heroes on both sides was the bulk of the conversation
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was a lot of speculation about the future that just really didn't pan out.
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It was a lot of conversation about grievous and I found that to be not productive for our
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podcast.
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So I just wanted to flag that as sometimes these conversations just really, which of course
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they should.
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It's a forum, but I felt like the speculation was just so off that it just like actually isn't
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really even worth pursuing.
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But people liked it, liked the episode liked it more than they thought they would.
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But of course the comments around is kind of boring comes through.
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So I'm just going to read some quotes and they're kind of all over the place.
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Quote, the whole banking issue and political subplot was pretty boring and confusing.
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I thought it was too real world and trying to draw comparisons to America's current economic
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crisis and the issues the banks were having until the bailout, along with other military spending
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and increased deficit.
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Despite the fact that this was a political episode, it worked when it wasn't focusing on the politics.
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The character development for Asoka and introducing the new separatists that are actually people
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instead of droids was interesting.
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Just hoping this wasn't a foreshadowing of an Asoka romance, but she seems not to be interested,
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which sends a good message.
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First majorly political focused episode that actually kept me interested all the way through.
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Kind of disappointed that Asoka walked around with her Sabers the entire episode and never got
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a chance to use them, but I'm definitely hoping the action picks up majorly in the second
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half of the series.
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Oh, it does.
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It does.
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Do you have any reactions to the Asoka romance piece?
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Listen, I've said it before and I'll say it again.
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I was an Asoka and Lux Shipper.
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I don't know what you want me to do about that.
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I know a lot of people have a lot of feelings about Lux.
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I think he's a super interesting character.
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I always have from day one.
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In fact, from when did this air?
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December 19, 2010.
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Yep.
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I thought he was an interesting character.
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And I'm sorry, you put two teenagers together.
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I'm going to ship them.
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You know, it's just it's what's going on opposite sides of the world.
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Like, what could you ask the longer?
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I the whole like she does, she seems to not be interested, which sends a good message.
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Just like it makes me recoil.
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I don't understand why that is a good message, but I do agree that if Asoka is uninterested,
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that's fine for her to feel uninterested, but I still don't really understand how objectively
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that's a good message.
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Yeah, I don't either.
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I think the whole point of the episode is for her to see a different perspective and question a lot of things.
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And that includes the Jedi no attachments upbringing.
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And that's going to come into play with Lux later.
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I've always thought he was an interesting foil to Asoka.
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And what his like the trajectory of his life, how that ended up and how an intersects with Asoka.
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And I think that at different points, I always thought was really fascinating.
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And the question she asks about their relationship and the feelings that she may or may not have.
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And I don't really think she ever even gets to the point where she.
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No, you know, like I don't think she would consider some feelings, but I think she.
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She feels the start of feelings, I guess you could say.
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And I think that, you know, of course, that makes for interesting conversation with Anakin, of course.
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And we'll explore that later on in this series.
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So it has to start somewhere.
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And I think that I think they needed to put some kind of.
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I know you want to say potential love interest because that's not.
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He doesn't really ever become that in a big way, but he's always a possibility in that sense.
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Yeah.
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I'll just read this quote as a pro that someone put down in their list of pros and cons for the episode pro quote.
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The flirt between Asoka and Lux was hilarious.
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This could definitely serve as a plot point to explain Asoka's disappearance.
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What if the Republic attacks Roxas and Anakin kills Lux?
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Asoka starts to see the Jedi is evil different than Anakin.
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Damn, I love that idea.
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Wait.
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Wait, I love that.
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I don't think we've seen enough.
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I think I'm going to request that you need to start pulling in some more wild or so,
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speculation as you come across it because.
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I know I'm here for it.
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That's why I include it.
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I know it just doesn't actually come through that often.
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No, I, but I think it will start to more.
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It's happening.
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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I love this, uh, this, uh, you that this person has created.
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Wow.
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I've never thought about Asoka falling to the dark side or.
spk_0
Starting to see the Jedi.
spk_0
I mean, she does start to see the Jedi as.
spk_0
Evil.
spk_0
You have talked about Asoka turning the dark side because we're supposed to think about Asoka turning to the dark side.
spk_0
When we see her turn to the dark side in Mordus, you've thought about it.
spk_0
I guess I've, I guess I've thought about it, but I never thought to me that was never an actual possibility.
spk_0
I think I was always so focused on like she their dies.
spk_0
Or she doesn't.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
I loved it.
spk_0
So the idea that Anakin kills Lux not even the idea that Asoka leaves the Jedi order to be with Lux,
spk_0
but that Anakin kills him.
spk_0
I also like the concept of the Republic attacking Raxus.
spk_0
And Asoka having a pinpoint of.
spk_0
I actually know people on here.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
On this planet.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
And so it was Padme, who's my friend.
spk_0
That would be actually like I could create this story right now because she even says and here is on both sides, you know, I'd hate to meet you on the battlefield, you know, for years' sake.
spk_0
And it's, it's super flirty.
spk_0
But then if there are public attacks Raxus, that would bring her to Raxus.
spk_0
But now she does know him and they're, they met on the battlefield.
spk_0
Well, this isn't the last time we see Lux.
spk_0
It's not, but I really like the.
spk_0
I really like where this is going.
spk_0
spk_0
Okay, great.
spk_0
Okay, quote, love to Soka's new look and she seems dot, dot, dot different.
spk_0
She really does seem more mature.
spk_0
I really like when the new Asoka more and more than the old one.
spk_0
Not that I hated her anyway.
spk_0
And quote.
spk_0
Yeah, okay.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
There's literally nothing worse than being a 13 year old girl to most of the world.
spk_0
It's so frustrating.
spk_0
I know.
spk_0
Quote, this was a very good episode overall, even if it lacked action.
spk_0
It really flushed out the CIS.
spk_0
The visuals for this episode were amazing.
spk_0
And the new models of Anakin and Asoka were great.
spk_0
The show seems to be getting back on track, IMO.
spk_0
And hopefully they can keep it up.
spk_0
Quote, this episode proves that a political non-action episode can be really good.
spk_0
IMO.
spk_0
Finally, we're seeing some shades of gray in this war.
spk_0
I've been waiting far too long for that.
spk_0
Even I thought it would never come.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
This last quote really takes us into the pursuit of peace.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
Quote, does Padme hate the clones or something?
spk_0
The way she talks about them makes it seems like she just hates the very idea of them.
spk_0
End quote.
spk_0
What do you think about that?
spk_0
I think it's a good question.
spk_0
But I think Padme actually answers in the next episode with Senator Christo.
spk_0
spk_0
When it was, is that in pursuit of peace or Senate?
spk_0
Yeah, it's in pursuit of peace, where she's trying to convince him to vote for or against the bill.
spk_0
She's proposing, I can't remember which way.
spk_0
And they're talking about, you know, getting more troopers or something like that.
spk_0
And she's like, we just can't keep sending them out there to die.
spk_0
And Christo is like, why?
spk_0
That's what we paid for.
spk_0
And Padme is like, they're people.
spk_0
They're people.
spk_0
So I think she, I think she answers that question in the next episode.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
Okay, moving on to pursuit of peace then.
spk_0
So since that takes us into the next episode.
spk_0
So everyone hated this episode.
spk_0
Yeah, I, yeah.
spk_0
You're not sure.
spk_0
I'm not for zero.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
Agreed.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
So I'm just going to read a bunch of quotes.
spk_0
We're going to steamroll through.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
Quote.
spk_0
Have you watched the preview clip on Star Wars.com?
spk_0
This is the, this is where the panic starts.
spk_0
Quote.
spk_0
Quote.
spk_0
This looks like it's in the running, in the running for the worst dot episode,
spk_0
dot ever.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
Quote.
spk_0
This was mine numbingly terrible.
spk_0
All I could do was laugh.
spk_0
Season three has thus far been an absolute bust.
spk_0
Padme's moralistic self righteousness couldn't get any more hand fisted.
spk_0
Oh, what was me?
spk_0
Why am I the one who cares?
spk_0
She laments near the end of her great,
spk_0
vacuous crusade.
spk_0
I don't know.
spk_0
Perhaps because your entire position is like your,
spk_0
your ever changing hairstyles,
spk_0
one minute you're babbling about the fear of bankruptcy,
spk_0
and the next minute you're supporting initiatives,
spk_0
that will eventually dot, dot, dot wait for it,
spk_0
dot, dot, dot, dot, bankrupt the republic.
spk_0
Quote.
spk_0
This show is nose diving fast.
spk_0
Quote.
spk_0
I just can't believe that with the universe,
spk_0
they have to play with.
spk_0
This is the story that they all thought was worth the voting so much money and hard work to.
spk_0
Would have been marginally better without that cartoony speeder chase.
spk_0
And yes, I know it is a cartoon,
spk_0
but it's still canon and that sequence would have looked so ridiculous in live action.
spk_0
Looks bad enough in animation.
spk_0
Though half of that was Padme's hair.
spk_0
Don't dot dot dot.
spk_0
People are so, it's rough, Galen.
spk_0
It's rough in the forums.
spk_0
Okay, this is a very toxic space.
spk_0
Keep going.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
Okay, so there were voices of reason.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
Quote.
spk_0
Wow.
spk_0
With attitudes you guys have,
spk_0
I'm surprised you've been bothered to watch episode three.
spk_0
I mean, you knew Anakin was going to go all set and help wipe out the white belt the Jedi.
spk_0
And there was a lot of people talking about how Padme has had a lot of episodes this season.
spk_0
So someone says, quote, so far counting this upcoming episode Padme has appeared in six out of the 11 episodes this season season one six out of 22 episodes season two four out of 22 season three six out of 11 episodes.
spk_0
So that's a lot.
spk_0
Someone says we don't like to see Padme apparently apparently we don't like to see the mother of Luke and my answer.
spk_0
I don't know the quote says I think that says enough, especially if you consider we're only halfway through the season.
spk_0
So there's just a lot of talk about how they've experienced a lot of Padme episodes.
spk_0
And like I said, I don't know why it's a problem that we have episodes with, you know, the mother of the main characters and the original trilogy.
spk_0
But I also get it because they are sent at heavy episodes.
spk_0
Like I do get it.
spk_0
But sometimes it really does come off as really harsh, misogynistic, okay.
spk_0
It does come off as misogynistic sometimes.
spk_0
So there's a lot of conversation then again about Padme's idealism in what she's fighting for.
spk_0
And I think some of it is valid.
spk_0
I'm just going to read through it.
spk_0
Quote, I just don't understand why stopping production of new clones would disrupt the Republic War effort in any way.
spk_0
New clones would only join the front lines in about nine years by then the war would in all likelihood already be won or lost.
spk_0
In case a drug dawn, it would be plenty of time to set up a recruitment and training program for normal soldiers.
spk_0
Unless the Republic really wants to fight the Clone Wars for another decade, they would be smarter to take the money it would take to spend on new clones and invest it on equipment for the clones that they already do have.
spk_0
Create more advanced vehicles, weaponry and armor.
spk_0
Blah blah blah.
spk_0
Okay. Basically this person is saying this, the bill that is put forth, there could have been a better way to put forth this bill.
spk_0
And I do kind of agree because I think it's a little confusing that they're going to do more, they're going to create more clones, but those clones are going to be ready for a while.
spk_0
Right.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
And I think overall the argument that Padme makes at the end of this episode that I think is a good one is that the amount of money that they're spending on these clones is a diverting resources away from other social programs as seen by Tecla, right.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
And I think that's the problem.
spk_0
And so I think that this criticism here is actually pretty solid because I think the writing could have been a little bit firmer with this, but I do think that there is a want to show that the Republic is eager to spend money with Camino also.
spk_0
Like I think that that's also part of this and they're playing the long game of funneling money into the Camino and clone makers, right.
spk_0
Do you have any thoughts about that?
spk_0
Yeah, I think I think you're right. I think it could have been clear because I think ultimately these episodes are trying to show those profiting off of war and that people like Palpatine and the banking plan and the trade federation.
spk_0
And they'll keep the war going as long as possible because it means money for them.
spk_0
And so even the idea of waiting, you know, nine years or something for the new set of clones, if the trade federation had their way, they would still be fighting the war because they make so much money off of it.
spk_0
And I mean, one of the senators in the the initial Senate meeting, you know, says, we must keep the war going. That's part of their argument. It's not even people.
spk_0
I think the point is that people aren't even talking about peace and that's kind of what comes up in here is on both sides and pursuit of peace and that's ultimately the issue.
spk_0
Yeah, but I think I think that's true. Like they're could if they're going to do heavy handed politics like this with bills passing people vetoing collecting the votes like the whole political thriller.
spk_0
Then we probably should make sure it's really clear why we're going after here.
spk_0
Yeah, and I think, you know, the bad batch did a really good job of showing sort of the political machinations of what was happening in the imperial Senate with the clones.
spk_0
And I think this is obviously the first iteration of them doing this in animation in a lot of ways, right.
spk_0
And it takes a while, I think, to get from here, I know we're in season three and there has been previous political episodes that have been really good too.
spk_0
But when we get to the point in the bad batch, I think that there's I don't know. They did a really good job. And I just.
spk_0
Yeah, it's it's better writing at that point. Yeah, like that episode. I just always think about Omega watching Camino be destroyed in the Senate meeting and like how impactful.
spk_0
And they did such a good job of setting that up. Yeah, yeah, exactly. And her listening to all these people talk about the clones.
spk_0
And the politics of the clones and all of that. And the writing was just really well done. And like everything with Chuchi and Rex, exactly.
spk_0
Like they have multiple arcs that deal with this topic. And it's just really well written and handled really well to talk about what the Senate is voting on.
spk_0
And I think this is good. And I think it has good things to say, but it's not as it's a little bit more clunky right now.
spk_0
But the point is is that I think we get to that place. I think we get to the place of.
spk_0
And I think maybe it takes a little bit for us to get there because we need to still like lay the seeds of all of the different forms of corruption.
spk_0
spk_0
And so the reason why we have the bad batch is maybe because of seeing the Camino and Senator in this who's also lobbying for more clones.
spk_0
Like is there a direct line? I think there could be drawn a direct line. You know between.
spk_0
I think there is how. Yeah, how we get to clear a storytelling and better storytelling.
spk_0
Yeah. But the forum continues to talk about like I said in the for here is at most sides.
spk_0
There's a lot of people who are like, what is up? Does Padme even care about the clones? You know, so here's a quote from that quote.
spk_0
Does Padme know any clones personally? The only time I can recall is during mystery of a thousand moons. Does she not care that these are living breathing men?
spk_0
Even if this bill is to stop the production of more clones confronting it is a slap to their faces.
spk_0
And someone replied to that and said quote, this is one of my biggest standing issues I have with the show.
spk_0
They keep showing us how individualized the clones are becoming, but apparently no one apart from the Jedi is noticing.
spk_0
And they consistently dodged dealing with any of the ethical implications.
spk_0
I don't know if I think that's true or if I've just watched so much Star Wars that I think that they reversed a lot.
spk_0
I think it's kind of true right now. I mean, I think we started this clone was rewatched like fully ready to pick a favorite clone.
spk_0
You know what I mean? And yeah, we really haven't had that many true.
spk_0
In a while. I feel like it's been a while since we've had a clone focused episode or time to.
spk_0
We haven't spend any quality time with Brex in a while in the show.
spk_0
True. Yeah. And I think you would you might assume that Padme knows clones personally because Anakin knows knows close clones personally.
spk_0
But at this point, I don't think she does, you know.
spk_0
And I think that we will get there. But maybe not.
spk_0
Yeah. I don't know. I don't know if Padme spends a lot of time with any clones specifically.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
Okay. The last quote for pursuit of peace is this one quote.
spk_0
I've been waiting about the entire show to see Palpatine start behaving like well Palpatine.
spk_0
And I'm ridiculously glad that we're going in that direction now.
spk_0
Overall, I liked this episode quite a bit. It addressed a ton of little things I've been on in various capacities.
spk_0
Probably going out to watch this one again to make sure that I got all the implications.
spk_0
I think it was the most political episode we got so far with Padme actually running around trying to accumulate votes.
spk_0
She's doing a lot of that.
spk_0
There she is.
spk_0
Okay. Let's move on to Senate murders.
spk_0
We're out of season three. Now we're back in season two. Okay. Mindset shift in the fandom.
spk_0
Okay. Quote. I actually really liked this episode loved it even.
spk_0
The fact that this was completely void of the Jedi and Separatists and Sith was a strength for it.
spk_0
Quote. It was great to see Mon Mothma and Baylor Ghana get developed a little more.
spk_0
And I thought they did a good job with the suspense, maybe until a chase scene through the docs.
spk_0
Quote. I did really like this episode. I really liked how Padme, Organa and Mothma wanted to end the clone production and end the war.
spk_0
It seemed to tie in with the Padme, Organa, Mothma, rebellion deleted scenes from Revenge of the Sith.
spk_0
It kind of seemed like a prequel to those scenes, which I think is a little odd since Lucas deleted them from the first film from the film.
spk_0
I always wished that Lucas hadn't cut them though. They're great scenes and make three of those characters much stronger.
spk_0
Maybe Lucas changes mind about those scenes. Sure wouldn't be the first time he changed his mind.
spk_0
Okay. Next quote. When I first heard about this episode, I thought I was going to hate it.
spk_0
But after buying it on iTunes and watching it, I basically could have written it.
spk_0
And watching it, I found myself liking the episode. The whole episode until the end, I wasn't sure who the murderer was, but I finally kind of knew who it was in the end.
spk_0
The police officer was hilarious and I found myself chuckling at him.
spk_0
Next quote. Not a bad episode. Mandelor Saga was better, but this was all right filler.
spk_0
Okay. Next one. And I think I have a comment after this one.
spk_0
I enjoyed this episode very much. Smiley face. Nice filler episode. Padme was very tolerable and finally wasn't the damsel in distress.
spk_0
I knew for the beginning who the traitor was. All the new characters were definitely a plus. Overall very good.
spk_0
I can't wait for the next new episode. Seeing the Senate guards in their proper uniform was a nice change and it looked more and more and more like the films.
spk_0
Okay. So I this is my first time I've ever seen someone compliment filler in a good way.
spk_0
And maybe I just like someone says it was all right filler. Then someone goes nice filler episode.
spk_0
Caitlin, when was the last time you heard someone say filler in a sort of neutral depositably?
spk_0
Really never.
spk_0
Today.
spk_0
I know today. It's interesting. And this speaks so to the conversation we've had throughout this rewatch so far of having having long seasons and having
spk_0
like type for a show to grow and develop and improve over multiple seasons. And now we just get stuck with like one off eight episode season that end on cliffhangers and
spk_0
yeah, if you don't like something you call it filler and when your season has eight episodes, if you deem something filler, it's a wasted episode.
spk_0
But when you have a 22 episode season, filler isn't as bad really because you get you get the weird musical episodes you get hung for zero you get so much gold in some of these filler episodes.
spk_0
Senate murders is obviously not hung for zero. I'm not I'm not saying that.
spk_0
I guess it is a nice filler episode agreed.
spk_0
I just think it's an interesting thing. Of course, my you thought I was probably going to comment about how the dams on the top of me isn't very tall.
spk_0
And finally wasn't a dams on distress.
spk_0
Just roll my eyes and have to move on. But I think that it's interesting the whole filler of it all.
spk_0
And I think that maybe in now in 2025, we've gotten so far away from what we will.
spk_0
What we are used to and like you said in terms of the length of a season that yeah, filler can be fine.
spk_0
Just just be fine, right? Yeah, because it doesn't it doesn't feel like you're quote unquote wasting an episode because you only have eight episodes eight to 10 episodes in a season.
spk_0
Yeah. Okay, next quote.
spk_0
Yeah, it didn't have sweeping space, but battles and Jedi wielding their lightsabers or bad guys with blasters. Oh wait, but it had its own brand of excitement in the way the suspense was played out.
spk_0
I mean, it wasn't the best episode of the season thus far, but it certainly wasn't the worst IMO.
spk_0
Okay, so someone commented not one line from Anthony Daniels and it just reminded me about how I think the episode before hunt for zero that well in the zero the heart arc.
spk_0
There's a lot of people excited about the droid and Anthony Daniels getting more lines.
spk_0
And I think it plays into the fact that there are people in season two tracking about how little the droids were actually talking right, right.
spk_0
So it's interesting that people are upset around that there's no lines from Anthony Daniels despite the fact that he that see through PO is in the episode.
spk_0
It's coming. My guy. Don't worry. Okay, I'm just going to read the grossest thing ever.
spk_0
Okay. Okay.
spk_0
Quote, I can't be the only person who was surprised to find out that mon mothma was hot when she was younger.
spk_0
I am not shame to admit that I would tap that in a most respectful and dignified manner.
spk_0
Oh, it's not that bad. It's not that bad. It's not that bad. It's not that bad. She is good looking.
spk_0
I just don't I don't know the tap that in the forum is just like no.
spk_0
Let's just dignified.
spk_0
Just full and dignified. All right.
spk_0
We were talking about hear me out last episode.
spk_0
Yeah, you're right. You're right.
spk_0
You're right. Also, everyone is spelling mon mothma wrong.
spk_0
I know. I keep noticing it in the comments. You posted. It's just Martha.
spk_0
Yeah, it's just Martha. It's so funny. Everyone's spelling her wrong.
spk_0
It wouldn't dare to do that in 2025. I guess I would never coil at this because we have maybe one of the most powerful and intricate and well written characters in mon mothma post and door.
spk_0
So I see that I was just like, oh, this is a blast from the past.
spk_0
Also, people really loved divo.
spk_0
Who divo I believe you know who wrote you know who wrote that comment.
spk_0
I mean, parent, parent, parent, parent, parent.
spk_0
So it's fine.
spk_0
That's so funny.
spk_0
Anyway, okay. People love divo and divo.
spk_0
People were talking about this, but I'll just say it here.
spk_0
Divo is I'm pretty sure based off of Peter Laurie and the cartoon version of Peter Laurie in loony tunes.
spk_0
And it because he's so specific, but people really liked him.
spk_0
He's voiced by Smudge Bob.
spk_0
Wild.
spk_0
I know once I once I heard Dave say that because I know that until I watch the future it and then I couldn't unhear it.
spk_0
It's like, oh, it's just a it's a different pitch.
spk_0
Smudge Bob's clarifying every time Dave talks about Spongebob.
spk_0
I think about his original story about oh, it's just the Spongebob guys making a joke playing a prank on me.
spk_0
Like how we got the job.
spk_0
Yeah, the Spongebob guys. So like now he's bringing his Spongebob guys into.
spk_0
He's bringing Spongebob.
spk_0
Star Wars.
spk_0
Yeah, just Spongebob.
spk_0
The Spongebob guy.
spk_0
The Spongebob himself.
spk_0
And I just did this was this brought up in this episode.
spk_0
Someone said that they liked the idea of how accelerated growth with the clones equaled lower quality clones.
spk_0
Yeah, and someone said quote, it would certainly lend credence to why stormtroopers seem to adopt a tradition of awful marksmanship compared to their attack the cloned's predecessors.
spk_0
Obviously, that's not where the story ended up.
spk_0
Okay, because stormtroopers, I don't think are clones.
spk_0
But was this brought up that accelerating the growth means in this episode?
spk_0
I just don't speak.
spk_0
I don't recall.
spk_0
Yeah, I recall either.
spk_0
But it would paint pad the comments about Padma hating the clones in like the nine years and everything in a different light of having.
spk_0
Right.
spk_0
And it like if that nine years was actually three years or something like that.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
Okay, well, those are the forums.
spk_0
Any thoughts?
spk_0
Kind of what I expected.
spk_0
A little bit of what I didn't.
spk_0
A typical forum experience.
spk_0
Honestly.
spk_0
I'm going to be honest.
spk_0
I'm still thinking about that.
spk_0
Lux and Ahsoka, a you of Anakin killing.
spk_0
Lux.
spk_0
And a battle being fought on Raxis and Ahsoka forced to make a decision between following the Jedi Order and.
spk_0
Killing her, attacking her friend.
spk_0
Lux in his right.
spk_0
The fanfic you want to see in the castle on Raxis.
spk_0
Yeah, it's a good idea.
spk_0
It's a good.
spk_0
All right.
spk_0
Let's move on to characters and themes.
spk_0
Let's go.
spk_0
So welcome to part two where we're discussing characters and themes.
spk_0
So I think we've talked through a lot throughout the forums and everything in part one.
spk_0
Is there a good place for us to start?
spk_0
Yeah, you know, I think maybe I'll read the quote from Dave about Ahsoka and heroes on both sides.
spk_0
He said in the feature at.
spk_0
Quote on this adventure, we thought it'd be very exciting to start to hint at a problem for Ahsoka, which would be contact with a boy of her age that has nothing to do with the Jedi Knights.
spk_0
And it's different from Anakin Skywalker in every possible way.
spk_0
This boy was Lux, Monterey.
spk_0
He interests her because he gives her a different way of thinking a different perspective on her world.
spk_0
What I really like about this episode is how the beginning of the episode Ahsoka thinks one way.
spk_0
And by the end of the episode, she thinks another.
spk_0
And that's really what our character is all about.
spk_0
She stands in the middle of this entire galactic conflict.
spk_0
She's witnessing it as a person with an open mind.
spk_0
And now she has a critical perspective that she's gained from the other side of the war.
spk_0
And I think I really like Dave's kind of summary of Ahsoka of her standing in the middle and witnessing it as a person with an open mind.
spk_0
Because I do think that's who she continues to become throughout the Clone Wars.
spk_0
And I think what we see happen with her in season five.
spk_0
And then even into season seven with the Marta sisters of hearing about.
spk_0
I'm sorry, the Martinez sisters, right?
spk_0
About their opinion of the Jedi throughout this war.
spk_0
I think she's really receptive to that even while she still has complicated feelings about the Jedi herself and her own experience.
spk_0
And the cost of the war.
spk_0
I think she really does become someone with an open mind throughout it.
spk_0
And this is really kind of her introduction as, you know, I hate to say what the commentators are saying, but like as a more mature Ahsoka.
spk_0
I've really liked the concept of Dave saying that Ahsoka, that's what her character is all about, is being among it all in the middle of everything.
spk_0
And learning throughout it.
spk_0
I think that Ahsoka is us, Ahsoka is the audience.
spk_0
You said that earlier in the episode two.
spk_0
And I think that here on both sides is all about just challenging that binary.
spk_0
The Jedi equal good.
spk_0
Republic is good.
spk_0
Separatist bad.
spk_0
You know, that I think is what the prequels are trying to do too.
spk_0
But I think the Clone Wars do a much better job of doing that.
spk_0
And Ahsoka learn, having Ahsoka learn that through Padme too, which I think is really important that it was this female friend that teaches her this concept of ambiguity is really important.
spk_0
Because it's clear.
spk_0
Anakin's not going to do that.
spk_0
I think Anakin can do some of that, but that's not right for Anakin's character to do it, but it's so right for Padme's character to do that.
spk_0
I think the good in everyone, it no matter what side they're on, when we know that everyone's being played.
spk_0
But we also know that Padme's heart is so true.
spk_0
So her perception of everything and everyone around her is hopeful in itself.
spk_0
So I would say that Ahsoka learning from Padme is so important for her character too.
spk_0
Yeah, and I think the thinking or sorry, having challenging the binary of, you know, republic is is good separatists are bad when the leader of the republic as the audience knows is bad himself.
spk_0
So if you have this bad person leading this quote unquote group of good people.
spk_0
What does that really mean ultimately for the morality of what everyone is doing here?
spk_0
And obviously that's very complicated because they don't know that Palpatine is bad and that he's leading them astray or anything like that.
spk_0
But I think when you really start to look at the big picture of, you know, what Palpatine is doing here with him as the leader of the quote unquote good side.
spk_0
I think that makes you start to question what really are my definitions of good and bad here and you know the threat of the banking plan and the trade federation throughout these episodes really hammers that home too.
spk_0
And what someone in the forums talked about this and I think I did too at the start of the episode, but we really get to see Palpatine.
spk_0
I mean, being pretty politically evil here for sure.
spk_0
Definitely seen him, you know, in his city as robes on the hall of the hologram and also just like grinning in the background at the weirdest times like we've seen that but we haven't seen it in this way.
spk_0
Yeah, this definitely felt like a page turning on Palpatine in the Clone Wars.
spk_0
I mean, when Padme is telling him that she met with Mina Bon Terry, I was, you know, on the TV, don't tell him, don't tell him Padme.
spk_0
Meena, you know, and you just they zoom in on his face as he, you know, has that evil look in his eye and the next thing we know Mina Bon Terry is dead.
spk_0
And you know exactly why.
spk_0
Yeah, exactly why.
spk_0
Well, I knew she died, but I forgot that she died so soon.
spk_0
I completely forgot really.
spk_0
Yeah, and I was like, oh no.
spk_0
Well, yeah, she gone, she gone, gone too soon.
spk_0
I got to say I, she kind of her voice kind of reminds me of duty drench.
spk_0
Hmm, I think that's true.
spk_0
Yeah, probably supposed to.
spk_0
Yeah, yeah.
spk_0
And the same voice actress plays Mademafima in these episodes.
spk_0
So then Mademafima also sets a little bit like duty dutch.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
True.
spk_0
That was funny.
spk_0
Yeah, I think just speaking to your point about seeing Palpatine as the evil war maker that he is.
spk_0
I think what these episodes show and specifically with Senate murders from season two is the true fragility of democracy.
spk_0
Because the moment.
spk_0
People start getting murdered and I think we saw this in the hostage episode two previously.
spk_0
But the moment you know violence is on the table.
spk_0
Inside of their own ranks within the Senate.
spk_0
People are, things are suddenly able to be passed through government.
spk_0
spk_0
And it's like Palpatine is pulling the strings there, able to make it make things happen.
spk_0
The moment people are murdered and people start dying and they're just able to push things through.
spk_0
Even after Padme's great speech from before.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
On the home, on, you know, on their own home, the banking clan talks about this with their planning the cleaning droids to come into the attack.
spk_0
You know, it's important that it's on course on because I think they even say that the people of course on and the Senate have a false sense of security because course on hasn't been attacked in over a thousand years or something.
spk_0
So the only way to get them to move is to attack them directly.
spk_0
It's not enough that the war is being fought on different planets and affecting different people throughout the galaxy.
spk_0
It has to happen to them.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
I also think it's interesting that at the end of Senate murders, what Palpatine says to Padme is just so frustrating when he's like, that's just the power of democracy.
spk_0
We just have to adhere to our laws of democracy.
spk_0
We must let the wheels of the Senate turn.
spk_0
It's like, okay, well, you're, you're steer in the ship.
spk_0
So to be clear, he doesn't say that to Padme.
spk_0
He, uh, he's in his office. Padme is not there.
spk_0
He's with the, you're right.
spk_0
You're right.
spk_0
He's with, he's, uh, he's with the different guy.
spk_0
He's with the, he's with his crew.
spk_0
Guy in there.
spk_0
And he's like, oh, what should we do?
spk_0
And Palpatine is like, well, for now, we're going to let this keep going as is.
spk_0
And it's just, it's so evil.
spk_0
It really is so evil.
spk_0
I, I also, you know, the idea of the Republic, then the separatist, you know, who's good, who's bad, that there's, you know, great area.
spk_0
It's not black and white.
spk_0
I thought it was really important to see.
spk_0
I thought that it was great that we got to see the separatist Senate meeting.
spk_0
Yes.
spk_0
And, uh, you know, they, there's a lot of back and forth about Mina's proposal.
spk_0
And a lot of people agree with it.
spk_0
A lot of people don't.
spk_0
And you see Duku presiding over it.
spk_0
Oh, well, obviously we have to let it vote.
spk_0
And I think it's Duku who says it.
spk_0
But he says unlike the Republic corruptions do not, or corporations do not rule us.
spk_0
And, uh, you know, you don't, the banking plan doesn't have a seat at the separatist Senate.
spk_0
But we know that the banking plan is funding the separatists as well.
spk_0
They admit it.
spk_0
Right.
spk_0
And it's just, it's such an irony that they put on this big show in their Senate meeting of, well, like this is a democracy.
spk_0
Of course, we're going to vote on it, even if a lot of us don't agree with it here.
spk_0
And they vote and it passes and they extend the olive branch.
spk_0
And then, you know, they don't have corporations and they're not here.
spk_0
They're not voting to deregulate the corporations that are funding them.
spk_0
But they're still being funded by the same people funding the Republic.
spk_0
It's just.
spk_0
It's so ironic.
spk_0
It's so crazy.
spk_0
I totally agree.
spk_0
I also really like the design of the Senate is just like the UK.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
Uh, parliament houses.
spk_0
And I thought that was really smart and interesting that they would incorporate that to make it look really strikingly different than the Republic Senate.
spk_0
But I'm so with you.
spk_0
I thought that was it was like, oh my gosh.
spk_0
Wow.
spk_0
This is actually going to pass.
spk_0
I'm surprised.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
But what they were claiming is it all, it all is smoking mirrors.
spk_0
That's the whole thing.
spk_0
Right.
spk_0
What does it gives you a lot of hope?
spk_0
I think it the fact that the bill that Mina's bill passes her motion to open up peace talks.
spk_0
Those people who voted for it, I, I believe it.
spk_0
You know what I mean?
spk_0
That's the hero on both sides.
spk_0
You're on both sides.
spk_0
And then they're all strut all those efforts are struck down.
spk_0
And I think Mina before Padme leaves says something like, you know, I usually don't feel hope about these things.
spk_0
But now I finally do.
spk_0
And.
spk_0
Oh, it's so sad.
spk_0
All right.
spk_0
It's a kind of wrap up this discussion.
spk_0
We already talked a bit about the heroes on both sides feature at.
spk_0
But we have the other two feature at the pursuit of peace and Senate murders, which we also kind of talked about the Senate murders one because the big thing of the Senate murders feature at was all about inspector Tan Zivo and.
spk_0
And then they were all about him being SpongeBob.
spk_0
And that Dave just really liked Tan Zivo.
spk_0
And designing him the investigation he goes on his personality big fan of Tan Zivo.
spk_0
That was that was what it was about with pursuit of peace.
spk_0
The what a fun trivia question, I guess, is is that is directed by Joanne Dunham, which Joanne Dunham was an assistant film editor on Empire and return of the Jedi.
spk_0
And he is there's that video of Ben Bird interviewing the guy in the Boba Fett costume in what?
spk_0
San and Salmo.
spk_0
Yeah, in San and Salmo and the parade for the what Mill Valley film.
spk_0
The first Mill Valley film festival.
spk_0
A book with a film with sponsor.
spk_0
And that's what Boba Fett had his debut.
spk_0
And that's Joanne Dunham in the Boba Fett costume.
spk_0
So really iconic.
spk_0
He directed this episode and he directed a water war, which I believe is the Montcala.
spk_0
Everyone's a good suit.
spk_0
It's like the season four opener.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
spk_0
Also, no, it's notable that I think he edited a ton of twin peak episodes.
spk_0
Oh, okay.
spk_0
For twin peak fans.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
But he's kind of a legend.
spk_0
The first Boba Fett appearance.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
That was the costume was named unfinished yet, right?
spk_0
I don't think so.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
But he directed pursuit of peace and Dave talks about how he had such a good time working with him and how Joanne was a big reason why they ended up with the speeder chase with Padme and the bounty hunters that they wanted to add some zip to the episode.
spk_0
So they added the speeder chase and Dave likes the speeder chase.
spk_0
I didn't really like the speeder chase.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
Well, you're with the rest of the people in the forum.
spk_0
I was like, oh, this is a highlight.
spk_0
What's funny is that Dave and the feature talks about how, you know, not everyone likes so much politics and their star wars.
spk_0
They like a little action.
spk_0
So we added some zip to the episode with the.
spk_0
I think it's fun to have Padme out in the speeder chase.
spk_0
It's like a swoop bike similar to Luke and lay out.
spk_0
Like I thought that was good.
spk_0
I liked that.
spk_0
Yeah, you know, overall, I think overall neutral, but I think I like was looking at my phone.
spk_0
I also liked the whole concept of Padme being like, I'm going to walk home vibes.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
And I was like, girl, I know.
spk_0
I know.
spk_0
I know.
spk_0
But isn't it so relatable?
spk_0
Loose it is for me.
spk_0
I'm like, yeah.
spk_0
I'm going to walk home.
spk_0
You're not a senator though in trying times.
spk_0
You're right with friends.
spk_0
You're like being killed.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
We like Padme and trying times, but we are not senators with people coming after us constantly.
spk_0
True.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
So those are the feature ads.
spk_0
But overall, I, you know, I like these episodes, but they're not, they're not my favorite.
spk_0
Here's on both sides.
spk_0
We'll always remain a favor of just for its role in my own Clone Wars journey, but agreed.
spk_0
Yeah, agreed.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
All right, let's move on to highs and lows.
spk_0
Let's do it.
spk_0
Listen, make you.
spk_0
You better know the problem.
spk_0
We're going to always figure out the truth.
spk_0
Always.
spk_0
All right, welcome to part three where we're talking highs and lows.
spk_0
Who wants to go first?
spk_0
You want to go first?
spk_0
You.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
My highs.
spk_0
Padme's outfits.
spk_0
You know, I feel like we make a lot of comments about how Padme's clothes don't change a lot,
spk_0
but they actually do.
spk_0
They do change.
spk_0
True.
spk_0
And I, I need to come here and say that I, you know, have been critiquing her wardrobe before being stagnant.
spk_0
And it's actually not stagnant.
spk_0
That was a false statement on my part.
spk_0
And I'd like to apologize.
spk_0
And I think she had some good looks in these episodes.
spk_0
The green dress with the spiky headband.
spk_0
I think in all time, babe, honestly, the spiky headband.
spk_0
I think I think it's really cool.
spk_0
Yeah, I agree.
spk_0
I agree.
spk_0
I really liked Senator Christo's aquarium.
spk_0
Our conversation with kind of our evil senator.
spk_0
I guess I even tracking aquariums now because, uh, Satine had an aquarium that I really liked.
spk_0
Thought was cool.
spk_0
Now we've got another one here.
spk_0
So I'm up to two aquariums.
spk_0
So put a pit in that for later.
spk_0
True.
spk_0
Really liked Palpatine being evil.
spk_0
That was pretty big high for me.
spk_0
I really, we already talked about this, but the design of Raxis and the Separatist Senate Chamber.
spk_0
That was really fun.
spk_0
Loved love the woodwork.
spk_0
I'm sure that was all hand carved.
spk_0
And the cleaning droids.
spk_0
I, when the cleaning droids rolled in, I was like, oh my god.
spk_0
I forgot that they have cleaning droids.
spk_0
Totally.
spk_0
It's on my list of highs too.
spk_0
They're just big room buzz.
spk_0
I love that.
spk_0
I know they're so evil, but they're so cute too.
spk_0
Mm hmm.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
Uh, my lows, uh, Uncle Ono being alive and then dead and how the episodes aired.
spk_0
It's just the chronology of it all.
spk_0
It's messy.
spk_0
It's, it's really messy.
spk_0
It's not a good audience viewing situation, TBH.
spk_0
And then, uh, Mina Bonterian, Monmouth, I'm having the same voice actress.
spk_0
It's, it's too similar.
spk_0
Their episodes are too close to get together.
spk_0
They sound alike.
spk_0
They sound too much alike.
spk_0
I think it stands out to me because I know Genevivo Riley's voice so well now that I was,
spk_0
I, I clocked it immediately.
spk_0
Does she voice Monmouth, Ma, Genevivo Riley?
spk_0
I feel like she comes back to voice her.
spk_0
She does.
spk_0
And in, in rebels.
spk_0
In rebels, right?
spk_0
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
I was like, I'm going crazy.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
She talked about it a lot on the press story.
spk_0
I know.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
I know.
spk_0
It might even be on this very podcast.
spk_0
Anyway.
spk_0
We made that to our soul.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
Anyway, it's been a long day, guys.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
My highs.
spk_0
I love the Bonteries.
spk_0
I think it's really cool that Mina was Padme's mentor.
spk_0
I like them both.
spk_0
I know too.
spk_0
I, I'm so here for the Lux of it all.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
I'm just like team Bonterie.
spk_0
Like I, I, I, I, it's interesting.
spk_0
Lower.
spk_0
I'm here for it.
spk_0
I like a Soca.
spk_0
I'm always here for a Soca meeting people her age too.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
And having that perspective shift because it keeps happening.
spk_0
And it's good.
spk_0
I agreed.
spk_0
Also here for the new Lux.
spk_0
Bring it on.
spk_0
Like we're really getting into the meat of the Clone Wars now.
spk_0
You know, and that was exciting.
spk_0
And I love Asoka's new look.
spk_0
It's great.
spk_0
It's iconic.
spk_0
It is.
spk_0
You remember you and I got a pair of boots from French Huskies.
spk_0
Oh, yeah.
spk_0
That we called the Asoka boots because they, it was kind of like,
spk_0
I think we got them shortly after her debut in this new look.
spk_0
They, they honestly really didn't match at all, but they were the closest things that we could find in just like a typical outdoor mall setting that looked like.
spk_0
True.
spk_0
Soca would wear.
spk_0
And we both got them, called them the Asoka boots were them for years and years and years.
spk_0
I'm pretty sure I still have them.
spk_0
I think, I think, I think I really quite literally wore mine out.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
They were good boots.
spk_0
They are good boots.
spk_0
They are so good boots.
spk_0
I don't have them.
spk_0
If you can ever buy something that reminds you of one of your favorite characters, like highly recommend.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
It always, it always feels good.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
That's another layer.
spk_0
It does.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
I love the swoop bike scene.
spk_0
What can I say?
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
And I also really liked my next high is bail and Padme on a little mission together.
spk_0
That was a great choice.
spk_0
I think that was really good.
spk_0
And it made me think of Rain of the Empire.
spk_0
The book, it reminds me of the book, The Rain of the Empire, which Padme, which bail has a lot of thoughts about his relationship and friendship to Padme.
spk_0
And so seeing that in the Clone Wars made me think about that recent book.
spk_0
Right.
spk_0
So that was great.
spk_0
And then I also liked the Mon and Padme relationship.
spk_0
And I think it's at the end of Senate murders, but Padme goes in for a hug for Mon.
spk_0
Did you notice that?
spk_0
It was kind of cute.
spk_0
And then bail gives a bare hug to them both.
spk_0
I need to go back and see this.
spk_0
I need to go back and see this.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
It's cute.
spk_0
I was like, oh, team seats are for Vellian.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
Anyway.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
So my love.
spk_0
I'm out here.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
Team seats are for Vellian.
spk_0
It was cute.
spk_0
I don't know.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
My love is Earth and I forgot Mina dies.
spk_0
And that's a yeah.
spk_0
And it's sad.
spk_0
And I thought that we were going to get a lot more time with her.
spk_0
And for some reason, because she made such an impact for me in Heroes on both sides, I forgot that she died.
spk_0
I forgot.
spk_0
I like it that I didn't realize it was so soon.
spk_0
I thought we saw her at least one other time.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
So the last thing that I think is confusing and this is an actual low is that I don't know how to feel about this.
spk_0
But Padme using Tecla's way of life as the crux of her speech, because Tecla has had such a hard time and can afford to live in a like it.
spk_0
And it's the her way of life is really disrupted by everything that's going on with the Clone Wars and the Republic and taxes and laws and things like that.
spk_0
But it's hard for me to listen to that and think not think, oh, well Tecla is an employee of Padme.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
Can't Padme do more than just use her as like, I hope that she gives her a raise after that.
spk_0
Right.
spk_0
I just thought it was kind of odd that this handmade appears out of nowhere that we've never met that seemingly has a close relationship with Padme.
spk_0
I'm pretty sure we've seen her before.
spk_0
And Tecla and Nandi, they're around.
spk_0
It's not they're not they don't come out of a nowhere.
spk_0
Padme fans know.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
I trust you.
spk_0
I trust you.
spk_0
I'm pretty sure Tecla was with them on the talk in a talk of a thorns.
spk_0
This is this goes back to what we were saying before about I think we could have had just a little bit stronger writing around Padme, maybe realizing that she could be doing more to help even within her own household.
spk_0
I don't know.
spk_0
Well, yeah, it's kind of like, okay, Tecla's been around Padme doesn't know anything about her life.
spk_0
And I think it's it's I think overall it's great that she listened to her and that Tecla feels listened to.
spk_0
So I think that's worth something.
spk_0
But I just kind of felt weird about it.
spk_0
Yeah, I did too.
spk_0
I did too.
spk_0
But that's it.
spk_0
Overall, we've made it to heroes on both sides and I.
spk_0
Night Sisters is next.
spk_0
Y'all sure is.
spk_0
Night Sisters monster in which is of the mist just in time for the spooky season.
spk_0
You know, we couldn't plan that any better.
spk_0
I know.
spk_0
I know.
spk_0
I know.
spk_0
And then guess what's right after night Sisters.
spk_0
It's it's buckle up folks.
spk_0
It's all happening.
spk_0
Buckle up.
spk_0
There's not an off week.
spk_0
Really, I think.
spk_0
Ever.
spk_0
I don't think not not and I don't I don't think we've had a single off week because I've learned so much throughout this entire journey by the way.
spk_0
But it is all gas going.
spk_0
Yeah, going forward.
spk_0
Yeah, it is all gas going forward.
spk_0
So I'm really excited to revisit the night Sisters.
spk_0
It's been a minute since I've watched the origin of all of that.
spk_0
So I'm really excited to go back and see it.
spk_0
It's going to be so good.
spk_0
Get ready.
spk_0
I do watch it every Halloween.
spk_0
Do you?
spk_0
So yeah, I do.
spk_0
The thing is I put it on the back.
spk_0
Right.
spk_0
You know, so I'm excited to analyze it.
spk_0
It's definitely relevant.
spk_0
So we need to we need to really pay attention to it.
spk_0
We really need to lock it.
spk_0
We're putting on the gas and we're locking in.
spk_0
We're putting pedal to the metal.
spk_0
Yeah, we are.
spk_0
For sure.
spk_0
Okay.
spk_0
Yeah.
spk_0
All right.
spk_0
Well, I think that is going to wrap up this Clone Wars rewatch heroes on both sides.
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Presuit a piece and Senate murders did heroes on both sides impact you on a deep level.
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Like it did Charlton night back in 2010.
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Please let us know.
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We have a comment.
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I think this is our official halfway point for the cold.
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We're going to see the world's three watch.
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That's crazy.
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I know.
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Wow.
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We've done 50%.
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Wow.
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Of episodes for SkyTalkers.
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I don't know for 50% of the way through in terms of volume of things that we need to watch.
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But 50% the way through the amount of episodes that we need to do for the Clone Wars three
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watch.
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I know.
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The ceiling.
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Yeah, it really has.
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This seems like it's a big project when we started it earlier this year.
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And it is, but it has really a lot of.
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And we started it.
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I think we started it.
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I think we just, I think.
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I think we kind of started it for two or three weeks and then Skeleton Crew started.
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So then we were off for a while.
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Yeah.
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So true.
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Okay.
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Well, wow.
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We are 50% done with this journey.
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Never too late to jump in and start on the Clone Wars rewatch yourself.
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But yeah, let us know what if you've been enjoying it, we would love to know you can tell us on SkyTalkers.
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You can tell us on SkyTalkers.
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You can tell us on Twitter slash access SkyTalkers pod or personal handles.
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Charlottes is at Crarity and mine is at Kaelin pleasure.
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We also have our Instagram and our TikTok, our website is SkyTalkers.com.
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Those are all great places to find this.
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And if you have a couple seconds and would like to leave us a review on Apple podcast or Spotify,
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we would so appreciate it as it helps other people find our show.
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And if you're looking for more ways to get involved, you can head on over to our Patreon and check out our different rewards years there.
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I want to say a huge thank you to these patrons.
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Jenny Brooke Patrick James, Isaac Jeremy, bowls, Eugene, David Emma, baby springtime, Julie, starboard, Molly, Mercedes, Ben, Greg, Caroline, Jonah, Linda, Draconius, Rex, Steven, Nikki, and Emily.
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Thank you so much for supporting us.
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Yes, thank you guys so much. And until next time, may the force be with you.
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May the force be with you.
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Thank you.
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This has been a 58-ember production.
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For more shows, please visit the 58-ember channel, 58ember.com, or find us at 58-ember media on socials.
Topics Covered
Clone Wars rewatch
Heroes on both sides
Pursuit of peace
Senate murders
Padme Amidala
Anakin Skywalker
Star Wars animated series
Jedi Council forums
Corruption in the Republic
Separatists vs Republic
Political themes in Star Wars
Ahsoka Tano character model
Clone Wars episodes summary
Star Wars fandom reactions
Palpatine's manipulation