817: macOS Tahoe, visionOS, & watchOS 26

Interactive Transcript

spk_0 Welcome to Mac Power Users. My name is David Sparks and I am joined by the one and only,

spk_0 the Apple Genius Mac Pro Mr. Steven Hackett.

spk_0 That was quite the introduction. Hello.

spk_0 I was there, man. I was at Mac stock when you took a part of Mac right in front of a group of

spk_0 people. Yeah. Just cracked open a nine Mac. I think I opened a Mac mini too, if I remember.

spk_0 When's the last time you opened up a Mac? Very recently actually. I told the story on connected,

spk_0 but my wife's M1 MacBook Pro had a thing of water knocked into it by the cat. And so I scrambled and

spk_0 like took the back of it off and let it dry. It never came back on. So she now has a, this is a funny

spk_0 story. So she, it was my old Macbook Pro right I handed it down. Yeah. She's a neat Macbook Pro.

spk_0 Like I wasn't going to go buy another Macbook where to replace it. It's like, hey, let's,

spk_0 you know, look at the Macbook Air. This was a 14 inch Macbook Pro. So like they have an air that's

spk_0 13 inches, which you know, she's had before, but not the new body design. And they have a 15 inch

spk_0 MacBook Air. So if you want a little bit bigger, it's still very thin and light, but a bigger screen.

spk_0 And so she opted for the 13. She kind of wants the portability. And I was like, well, you know,

spk_0 they have a couple of different colors. And I was like, they have, you know, whatever it is,

spk_0 space gray, silver, you know, starlight, whatever. And then sky blue. She's like, oh, let's go crazy.

spk_0 Let's get sky blue. I mean, gray with blue of use. Grint. Oh, dude. It, it's, they're so, it's

spk_0 like they were analyzing something blue across the street. And there's a couple of particles,

spk_0 like floated across the street down a vent shaft where this Macbook Air was being cooked. It's very

spk_0 light blue, but she is really liking it. The battery life's incredible. Of course, on the new

spk_0 Macbook Airs. And thin and light, she's very happy with it. But when we unboxed, she was like, I

spk_0 thought you ordered the blue one. I was like, oh, that is the blue one. Yeah. It does look more

spk_0 blue like in the evening, right? Like our living room has a lot of light, natural light. And

spk_0 in the evening, when it's darker in there, it looks more blue, but it is not, it is not a blue laptop.

spk_0 It is, it is mostly silver, which makes this orange iPhone such an anomaly, right? I mean,

spk_0 just last year, that was their version of blue. And yet we have this orange iPhone. I would love to

spk_0 know the story behind that and how that came about. Me too. How was your orange iPhone doing?

spk_0 Okay. It's good. As of this recording, though, I'm spending a week with the iPhone air,

spk_0 because I'm going to write a review. My idea of my review, it will not be out by the time this

spk_0 show comes out. I'm sorry, is like, these two phones are like two different possible futures

spk_0 for the iPhone. And so I'm spending time with both. So the pro is just off in the drawer. My

spk_0 E-SIM is on the air. They're both really good phones. Like the cameras on the pro are just unbelievable.

spk_0 And I really like the design, like the chunkiness and sort of the, I know it's aluminum and glass,

spk_0 but the perceived ruggedness of the pro I really like. But then I pick up the air and there's like,

spk_0 snap, like this is not the phone for me because I want the cameras and the better life's better

spk_0 than some people would have you believe. But it's not as good as the pro. But you pick the thing up

spk_0 and it's like, dang, this phone is sick. Let's see. Yeah. But yeah, I don't like the narrative that

spk_0 the future has to be one. You know, I feel like, you know, it makes sense to have both. I just

spk_0 talked to a good friend who bought the air for his wife. He says, she hasn't cared about battery.

spk_0 She hasn't go out much. You know, she hasn't cared about the camera and she freaking loves her phone.

spk_0 Yeah. And that's, that's what it's there for. Yeah. So that's sort of the ending spot of the

spk_0 review. This like half-written in my head is like, they're both the future. They're both,

spk_0 the foldable is going to be two iPhone Airs taped together, I think, or something like that.

spk_0 Yeah, with a asterisk. I mean, I think it's going to be thinner because they can spread the

spk_0 battery out over two devices. But yeah, but it'll be like this or to be in this lineage. But the pro

spk_0 is like, I mean, is more pro-ish than ever, right? Like they're doing more camera stuff. We're

spk_0 going to talk about that a lot more on a future episode. But it's great. And I love the orange.

spk_0 Every time I see it, it's just like, I love this. I've not gotten tired of it. I've not like

spk_0 grown weary of it. I will say it draws attention. I think because it's the new phone and because it's

spk_0 orange, I had, I've had several instances now like using Apple Pay somewhere. Like the person's like,

spk_0 oh, is that the new one? It's like, I don't know the last time that happened with a phone. It was

spk_0 probably the iPhone 10, to be honest. Yeah. And I really wonder about next year because we're

spk_0 supposed to get this folding phone. And I think I'm probably down for that. But I, I feel like this,

spk_0 this pro phone is so good. Like what if the folding phone has like inferior cameras, you know,

spk_0 in a very life because it's got a power of three screens? That'll be a, a been interesting year

spk_0 next year. Yeah. iPhones are fun again. Yeah. Exactly. You know, that's, that is one of my takeaways.

spk_0 It's fun. It's fun to have ideas and choices and compromises that that actually works.

spk_0 Hey, guys, we made it through September. St. Jude, we had a good, good month for St. Jude.

spk_0 I want to thank everybody who contributed as always. The Mac Power users came through again.

spk_0 You guys do every year. And it means a lot to Steven and I and it means even more to a lot of

spk_0 families that are benefiting from St. Jude. So thank you, everybody for stepping in. Yeah, absolutely.

spk_0 I'm going to have a couple of links in the show notes. One to a blog post I wrote about a week ago.

spk_0 I'm talking about sort of what the, what the fundraiser means to me. But also I sat down for an

spk_0 interview about St. Jude with Chris Pinington who runs the YouTube channel Coding and Public.

spk_0 And so we talked about my, like if you've never heard my St. Jude story and it's kind of

spk_0 longer form, that is where to go. So those things will be in the show notes. Yes, thank you so much.

spk_0 We'll have the final total in a couple of days, but it has been an amazing month and it always

spk_0 means so much. And today, I'm more power users because we're talking about macOS today. We're going

spk_0 to talk about how we customize the Finder because now there are some customization things you can do

spk_0 and Steven and I are having fun. So I'm looking forward to talking about that. Yeah. And the only thing

spk_0 more spicy than Finder opinions is where you put the dock. So we're just, we're going for the

spk_0 Adcontinent down. Oh boy. It's on the right side. That's where it belongs.

spk_0 I'm not going to say anything until we get there because this is, this is something. I mean,

spk_0 I have thoughts. All right. Today's the big story today is macOS Tahoe. We got a new operating

spk_0 system for the Mac as we do generally every year. In fact, can we start the conversation there,

spk_0 Steven? Do we need a new macOS every year? Not for the Macs sake itself, but I think that's

spk_0 how they are, you know, how they're keeping the Mac in step with iOS and iPadOS. I mean, you

spk_0 remember five, six, seven years ago, we would be in the situation where the iPhone and iPad,

spk_0 or sometimes just the iPhone would get a feature. And then the next year, the iPad,

spk_0 and where the Mac would like come along. In fact, I wrote this blog post that made a lot of people

spk_0 angry called like macOS, the tag along operating system or something outlining the many ways

spk_0 in which macOS was behind iOS and iPadOS. But they've provided that ship. No doubt, thanks to things

spk_0 like Mac catalyst and Swift and Swift UI features basically come to all these OSs at the same time.

spk_0 And you know, some years what the Mac gets is what its mobile cousins get. But as we get a little

spk_0 bit later in this episode, this year in particular has Mac only features. And so the annual of these used

spk_0 to bother me, especially since they weren't keeping it up with the other platforms. But now that they're

spk_0 basically in sync, I just resound myself. It's the way that it is. And you know what, I'm just,

spk_0 I'm happy that the Macs getting those features the same time I phone does.

spk_0 Yeah, I have about faced on this entirely. I think now I used to make fun of it. Now I think they

spk_0 should do it because the operating system are also integrated. And you know, the AI story is evolving.

spk_0 I can't imagine them like fixing Siri on the iPhone saying, well, we're going to take a year off

spk_0 on the Mac and we'll come back next year. You just can't do that anymore. And I feel like it has to

spk_0 be done across. That's one of the reasons they made Swift UI. So they could make features that go

spk_0 across platforms. And I think they need to do it. That said, I still think there need to be

spk_0 features and maybe projects that are multi year. Like I suspect this new, you know, this new liquid

spk_0 glass thing is a multi year project. I don't think that they just cook this up over three months. And

spk_0 and I think that needs to be a thing. But I also think we need to get your updates. So, okay,

spk_0 we're kind of on the, I thought we're going to have a dispute there, but we're on the same page.

spk_0 So let's, let's start with the liquid glass. I think that's what this OS is going to be remembered for.

spk_0 Yeah. And to rewind to WBC, right? Apple comes out. We have a new design language. It's on all of our

spk_0 platforms at once. First time ever for something like that. Yeah. Because I was thinking about this when,

spk_0 of course, lots of people are reflecting on iOS 7 this year because the liquid glass change.

spk_0 If you remember, iOS 7 was the same year as OS 10 Mavericks, which was not flat. That didn't happen

spk_0 until the next year, I guess with the O simmity again, the back being a year behind that flatter

spk_0 design didn't come to the Mac the same time. It didn't have the iPhone and iPad. But this time,

spk_0 it's, it's effectively everywhere. It's not evenly distributed. And I think in particular,

spk_0 like they've pulled some elements of liquid glass into the Mac, but it is not as, as I think far

spk_0 reaching as it is on the iPhone. Yeah. I mean, it's definitely very different on some platforms.

spk_0 Like I've been spending a lot of time in, in Vision OS coming up to today show it. I feel like

spk_0 it's the least liquid glass of all of them at the same time. It's kind of the forefather of liquid

spk_0 glass. It's a strange, it is. That caught me. Yeah. I had a reader of 512,

spk_0 simmity of screenshot that they had taken back in the day on the first version of Mac OS 10.

spk_0 It's like transparency everywhere. Like these buttons in the early versions of Aqua look more

spk_0 like liquid glass and the buttons we have in Tahoe, which is very funny. But yeah, it's, you see it,

spk_0 I think most prominently in places like the dock and the app switcher, which I really like the way

spk_0 it looks in the app switcher and the dock. You see it in some apps like in, I think photos is probably

spk_0 the best example where, you know, as the photos slide around the buttons or liquidity above them.

spk_0 But in other places, it's far more subdued. You know, it's, this is a super nerdy topic, but the

spk_0 roundness of the window was not an immediate love affair for me. How there, there's so much more

spk_0 pronounced the radius is bigger. And now you can absolutely tell which of your apps are updated

spk_0 and which aren't. Just look at the corner of any window and you'll know immediately. Yeah. But

spk_0 over time, like everything else with liquid glass, I've just kind of got like, okay, it's kind of

spk_0 nice, but it is an adjustment, I think. It definitely is. And I think as apps get updated,

spk_0 they'll adopt the more rounded look. Like right now I have Notion and Safari up. The windows

spk_0 look different, right? Like Notion is less round has smaller stoplight icons Safari much more

spk_0 round the icons are more pronounced. That'll just take some time, I think, for everyone to catch up.

spk_0 And, and I think that's like, that's just part of this, right? Anytime there's a UI change,

spk_0 there's a season of transition as developers figure it out. That's not, that's not a big deal.

spk_0 I was like you, I didn't really like the rounded corners at first. But I think they're fine. Like,

spk_0 you know, in some places, it feels like, okay, like I could have, like if you have like a full

spk_0 wet photo or a PDF in a window, it's like, yeah, it does actually kind of encroach into the very

spk_0 edges, but it's just the very edges and it does make the Mac feel a little bit softer. And I think

spk_0 in a good way, but also just more harmonious with the phone, right? The phone and modern iPads all

spk_0 have rounded displays. And even though the Macs don't really in the same way, at least the windows

spk_0 kind of feel the same. Yeah, agreed. And it's just the whole thing just takes a bit getting used to.

spk_0 Like, for instance, the menu bar is another one I've heard from a lot of listeners that are not

spk_0 happy with the menu bar because there's no longer a distinct stripe behind it to be on your wallpaper.

spk_0 You can feel like your menu bar icons get lost behind it. To me, that has just not been an issue at all.

spk_0 I just, I don't kind of, I think it's kind of grown on me. I kind of like not having this stripe up

spk_0 there anymore. Yeah, I think it's probably super dependent on your wallpaper. Like the wallpaper I'm

spk_0 using right now is of the lunar rover parked on the moon and the top of it's black because it's just like

spk_0 the moon and then just, you know, space, literally space black. Yeah. And so I have a lot of contrast up

spk_0 there, but I could see, you know, if you're using a photo or something a bit busier, maybe, maybe it

spk_0 doesn't work. My kind of complaint about this is that if you if you use the default, which is no

spk_0 stripe behind the menu bar, they're actually applying a gradient to like the base window, which is

spk_0 the desktop and your icons. So there's actually, if you toggle it on and off back and forth, you can see

spk_0 it. It actually puts a slight gradient on the wallpaper and those icons to help with the contrast,

spk_0 which is fine. I guess it's kind of weird. Nick here wrote this great thing. I'm going to have it

spk_0 in the show notes. He wrote, I think what is the best thing I've read on liquid glass. And he has

spk_0 the synates in here that when I read it, I was like, dang, I wish I had thought of that first.

spk_0 Like it's so good. He's talking about something else with liquid glass, but he says, it's Apple's

spk_0 clever solution to a problem Apple created. It's like, there's quite a bit of that in places on

spk_0 liquid glass. And I think the menu could be with them. Yeah. And I feel like there's a bit of a

spk_0 flex there, right? So many people have tried to do a transparent operating system and never been

spk_0 successful at it that I can see that, you know, the team saying, okay, let's do transparent. And we

spk_0 will make it work. And there are some weird, you know, kind of hacks around it, but they are trying

spk_0 to make it work. I mean, just I guess I should say going in my thoughts on liquid glass. I don't

spk_0 think it's changing the world. The way Apple says, but I don't think it's the crisis that it's

spk_0 it's critics are saying either. I think it's in the middle. It's okay. It's okay. It's a different

spk_0 look. It was time for a different look. They wanted to take this on. I feel like over time, they're

spk_0 going to they're going to smooth out the rough edges. And this is just going to be the way things look.

spk_0 I do have a couple of things that are on the less okay into the spectrum, at least in my opinion.

spk_0

spk_0 Sidebars and toolbars, I still have not gotten used to. So the side, we'll use Finder as sort of the

spk_0 canonical example. The sidebars appear to be like a layer above their windows or in set in the

spk_0 window. It's kind of both at the same time. It's a bit strange. There's like a rectangle, but then

spk_0 there is the floating sidebar inside the rectangle. I'm looking in Safari right now. Yeah. It's

spk_0 odd. And like macOS has done since you've seen, but that material picks up background color a

spk_0 little bit mostly of your wallpaper. But the rest of the window does it to a lesser degree

spk_0 or not at all. It's you can get it in kind of a weird state. But what I do like about the sidebar

spk_0 like in Finder is that the contrast on the text and the icons is really good. Like I have a bunch of

spk_0 favorites in the sidebar. And they're they feel more legible to me than they have in a long time. So I

spk_0 do appreciate that darker text. I think it's a little bit bigger than it was before. But the thing that I

spk_0 just can't get behind is how toolbars look. Instead of like liquid, loss-in-ch buttons,

spk_0 they are oval-shaped. And in light mode, basically they're white with a drop shadow. Like there's

spk_0 none of the glossiness or anything with liquid glass. They look a little bit better in dark mode,

spk_0 but it's not at all what buttons look like on all the other platforms. Yeah, it is odd. I agree.

spk_0 Super strange. What do you think about the them bringing transparent tinted and dark widgets and

spk_0 icons to the Mac? You know, I was going to ask you about that. I am kind of leaning into it. At

spk_0 first I wasn't sure. And this also transfers over to the phone. But I have always been kind of

spk_0 they've always had like kind of a muted version of widgets on your Mac. And I kind of like that.

spk_0 I like that it's not so shiny. And when it comes up, it's less intrusive. So I've always been a

spk_0 general fan of the monochrome look. And I think it's okay. Now earlier in the beta, it was too

spk_0 transparent. Yeah. And there were readability issues. But I feel like they're close enough with what

spk_0 it is now. And I'm sure people will complain. But honestly, just switch it over to the full color.

spk_0 And then you won't really get that. But but I I like it. I guess that was a wrong-wounded answer to

spk_0 yeah, I'm okay with it. Yeah, it definitely builds the top what they were doing. Now you can set

spk_0 dark icons to be transparent or tinted as well. And that gets picked up in other places. Just like

spk_0 on the share sheet in iOS and iPad OS. If you have tinted your home screen icons, those icons are

spk_0 tinted in the share sheet. Yeah. Same thing here where they are tinted or clear in the like

spk_0 front system settings like all of those get changed. Yeah. I am not personally not really using

spk_0 these features like the full color icons make the most sense to me. I is like if I'm looking for

spk_0 Safari, I'm basically just looking for like a blue circle out of the corner of my eye, right? Yeah,

spk_0 yeah, I mean, that gives you another context is color. Yeah, exactly. And I for whatever reason

spk_0 rely on that. But I think it's great that again, it's on all the platforms at once. Like I can

spk_0 tell you these are popular features. People like the clear look, people like the tinting. And to have

spk_0 that on the Mac, where like all of your devices could be the same, that's really great. Like if this

spk_0 is what you want, that's awesome. And it's a great example of customization that doesn't get in the

spk_0 way. Like if you don't want any of this stuff, you just never turn it on. But it's there for people

spk_0 who want it. A lot of people do want it. And a lot of people are using it. And I'm glad that the Mac

spk_0 kind of got it at the same time. Yeah. Well, I like I go back and forth on it to tell you the truth. But

spk_0 I do generally like it and the idea of it. I like making my devices a little less attractive if

spk_0 that makes sense. But on the the icon thing, like we used to have shapes, like there were three ways to

spk_0 tell if it was the icon you wanted, there was unique shapes, which we lost. Now they're all squares.

spk_0 You know, then there was color, which we can lose now. And then there was the actual content.

spk_0 That being said, I rarely lock launching from the dock. It's more of a reference area for me.

spk_0 I just launched things with the keyboard. So it's not that big of a deal to me. And I just like it

spk_0 kind of being like whatever my wallpaper is. I kind of want that to be the focus. I am so I'm

spk_0 still hooked on that red wood wallpaper from a couple of OSs ago with a big redwood trees. So

spk_0 that's that's mine. Usually when I'm not recording, that's usually my wallpaper.

spk_0 So yeah, I think overall, Luke Glass, like is okay. You know, I don't love the icon shapes all

spk_0 being the same, but I get it. I do however, I have two first party apps that I just

spk_0 struggling with. The first is Safari. Safari is always like a weird kind of UI playground at times.

spk_0 You know, a long time ago they put tabs on the top like that was weird.

spk_0 But there are two things in Safari. One, I think it really shows that the current tab design,

spk_0 this is also in Finder and you know any tab application. They're oval long skinny ovals and they're set

spk_0 in some sort of track or like they're in like a little grouping together in their space and

spk_0 between them. So if you tab between them really quickly, like they don't overlap. They sort of

spk_0 butt up against each other, like they're in a groove or something a little bit weird. And we get a

spk_0 bunch of tabs. It kind of breaks down, I think, because they end up basically like getting

spk_0 putting straight little vertical lines between them. And then when you hover over them or make

spk_0 one active, they return to the oval shape. It's a bit much. I haven't got used to that yet.

spk_0 It just looks weird. Yeah. But the big thing in Safari, and I run into this a lot because in

spk_0 the Relay CMS, there's a lot of things that we do a modal to like, are you really sure you want

spk_0 to remove the audio from this episode? Are you really sure you want to publish an episode without

spk_0 any audio? Like just mistakes people have made over the years we put modals in now.

spk_0 And when you have a modal, so like a pop up like, hey, do you want to leave this email or whatever,

spk_0 the whole browser window goes gray and the modal is white, which makes sense, right? You want to

spk_0 draw attention to it. But also in focus is the tab and all of the controls and the toolbar. So your

spk_0 URL bar, any share extensions, you know, any other buttons, navigation buttons up there,

spk_0 also become white, it feels like a mistake. Like it looks super weird. And every time I encounter

spk_0 it, I'm like, oh, like why, why is it yelling at me? Like why is it trying to get my attention so much?

spk_0 I hope that gets suggested. Yeah, I feel like that probably is a mistake. I don't think that's

spk_0 intentional. I am curious about myself because there's all these AI browsers kind of making

spk_0 the rounds now. I've been playing a lot lately with Dia. I don't know if you've tried that one.

spk_0 I'm like, is this the year that I'm going to not use Safari as my primary browser? I don't know.

spk_0 Yeah, I mean, I definitely have done, you know, the Chrome Safari Dance over the years.

spk_0 I used Chrome for a lot of other work stuff. Safari is sort of like my personal browser at this point.

spk_0 But yeah, the other first party app that is I don't kind of what's going on in it is music.

spk_0 They moved all the play controls at the bottom of the window for a reason I don't understand.

spk_0 Because it's like that on the phone. Maybe for me that.

spk_0 But I'm on a 27-ish display. Yeah, I know.

spk_0 That's a bit weird. But there's a lot of like, maybe it's because music on the on the Mac is actually

spk_0 a very old application. If you have like the up next or some other sidebars, you get weird UI bugs.

spk_0 Like scrolling and it scrolls like underneath something that you should be able to read.

spk_0 But you can't or the controls move around. I think the music team needs a little more time on this version.

spk_0 I feel like anybody listening to me, if you have Alfred, if you have an Alfred license,

spk_0 spend 10 minutes this weekend and figure out how to run your music from Alfred.

spk_0 I'm just telling you, I haven't opened a music app like in years because I just,

spk_0 it's so much faster with Alfred and you don't have to deal with it.

spk_0 And the music app always seems to me like a waste of space. So when I open it, I don't need

spk_0 a window to play my music. The idea of music is it's for your ears, not for your eyes.

spk_0 And Alfred has a very powerful system to launch any playlist, any song, any album.

spk_0 And if you just get it under your fingers, it is way faster than monkey and around with the

spk_0 music app. So that's that's my solution to the music app problems. I just don't use it.

spk_0 So I mentioned the icons earlier, but I got to say this whole thing where it takes old icons and

spk_0 puts them in a box. I feel like they could have done better than this. Yeah, me too. It's, I mean,

spk_0 the Mac has such a rich history of icon design. And even a lot of even Apple's own apps like in the

spk_0 Big Sur era, Apple tried like, okay, there's kind of like three shapes you kind of need to fit

spk_0 within. But this is straight up like you are a squircle or you are put in a squircle with your

spk_0 icon floating in gray, like Notions is is right now in my dock, which is really gross. I just

spk_0 really even on the phone, like I would like developers be able to set their own icon shapes. It

spk_0 works on Android, it works on Windows, like that's totally fine. Again, like the color talk earlier,

spk_0 it makes it even easier to spot what is what. And again, in this transition, right, like I have

spk_0 several apps on my dock or several apps that I use on a regular basis that are there former icons,

spk_0 shrunken to, you know, 75% in a gray squircle. And it makes them actually harder to see. And it's

spk_0 it sort of feels like they're punishing the developers for not updating. And that I don't, I don't love

spk_0 that change. I really don't. Yeah, yeah. But some of this stuff does look really good. You've mentioned

spk_0 the apps which are I agree with you. The brightness and volume overlays. I mean, that's that's

spk_0 pretty nice the way they've done that now. Yeah, it's kind of in the notification area. It's super

spk_0 liquid, glassy. Those things didn't, I mean, they were like a like a floating panel, like the

spk_0 bottom 30 or screen, basically forever. They just didn't need to take that much space. The other

spk_0 thing I really like about it is that with the audio control, Apple puts in what audio device is

spk_0 set as the output. So I use external speakers on my desk. And it shows like the speaker name as

spk_0 it is set in system settings. So it's like reinforcing where the sound is coming out of,

spk_0 which I think is a great feature like how many times have you hooked a laptop up to HDMI and like

spk_0 the sound doesn't come out where you expect and you're digging through system settings. So now,

spk_0 if you just hit the volume button, it'll tell you where it's coming out. And then you can go in

spk_0 and adjust it accordingly if you need to. It's just a little affordance that I really appreciate

spk_0 as someone who switches between audio devices on a regular basis because you have my interface for

spk_0 recording. And sometimes I'm just on my Macbook Pro or sometimes I'm using my speakers. Like it's

spk_0 I think it's a really nice little addition. I'm glad they added it when they were in there.

spk_0 All right. We dumped on the app icons. What do you think of the dock overall?

spk_0 I like the liquid glass effect. You get a window close to it and it gets liquidity inside of it.

spk_0 Like I think that's fun. They didn't really change a lot about how the dock works, which I think

spk_0 is fine. Like the dock is kind of a solve problem. But the design I think I think it works. I mean,

spk_0 there've been various levels of transparency in the dock for years. Like for a while it was like

spk_0 a shiny shelf and the icons that on top of it like in the leopard days. That was weird. And then

spk_0 other times it's been too clear or you know, this is like a good middle ground. It blurs the

spk_0 background enough for the icon standout. And if you move a window near it, it gets reflective.

spk_0 Like I dig it. Yeah. I think overall though, Apple is good at design. I think that they're going

spk_0 to nail down some of these these trouble areas. It's out in the public now. They're going to hear

spk_0 about it. I'm sure their own designers are not going to be happy with some of the

spk_0 after effects and you know, sharp edges. Like I've said that they bumped into.

spk_0 I don't think they're going to switch gears anytime soon. Liquid glasses here probably for another

spk_0 you know, five to 10 years. And I think if you look at this in two or three years, it'll be very

spk_0 few of those those problems left. I hope so. And you know, the other thing I should say is

spk_0 this has been way, you know, we talked about iOS 7 earlier. This has been a way easier transition.

spk_0 It just we'd have not had all of the problems that came with iOS 7.

spk_0 Yeah. I mean, I feel like on the Mac in particular, it's been really smooth. Like if you don't

spk_0 update, there's a couple of design things you don't get, but you don't look super out of place.

spk_0 Right? Like yeah, the round corners or the icons are different, but it's not like I'm tabbing

spk_0 between a couple of different versions of the OS when I switch between apps. And yeah,

spk_0 you know, I think that is good. And honestly, I think we talked about it. That also goes with

spk_0 iOS and iPad OS. Like yeah, an app that's not updated. It does look old, but it doesn't look broken.

spk_0 It doesn't look like it's from a different platform. Right? It's like, oh, that's just the old style.

spk_0 And you know, hopefully the developers will update it and it'll fit in a bit better.

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spk_0 So I talked about Alfred a minute ago, but Apple's own Alfred spotlight this year

spk_0 got a lot better. And let's talk about that for a little bit. Have you been using it?

spk_0 I have been. So since I put the beta on like a MacBook Air that I have floating around,

spk_0 I didn't put Alfred on it. I've been using Spotlight. Sure. And I put Tahoe on my main machine a

spk_0 couple of days ago. And prep for this is like, okay, now it's like it's time to live with this.

spk_0 There's probably been on here about a week and I've been using Spotlight. And I really got to say,

spk_0 it has come so far because I haven't used it in basically 10 years. I think it's been getting

spk_0 better. But the new features this year really level it up into something that's much more like an

spk_0 Alfred or a raycast or something else than it has previously been. I think that's super interesting.

spk_0 Do you, you foresee a future where you don't install Alfred? You just stick with Spotlight?

spk_0 I don't know. I'm still in the time period where Spotlight can feel frustrating. But if I sit back

spk_0 and think about it for a minute, it's the muscle memory that hasn't caught up. So much of Alfred

spk_0 is triggered, right? Like you hit Command Space and CB and you get to the clipboard or BB and you

spk_0 get to your bookmarks. And Spotlight has a little bit of that, which we'll talk about. But it's set up

spk_0 to be I think a bit more friendly. And so like it's just my, I need to get used to it. I don't think

spk_0 it's a problem that oh, Spotlight can't do the thing I want it to do. It's that I haven't like

spk_0 internalized how I get to it yet. Okay. So let's just talk about it for folks who are,

spk_0 who are playing with Spotlight. It has dramatically increased the number of built-in features. And as

spk_0 they've got modes to it now, like you can switch between searching app, searching files,

spk_0 running automations and, um, and going to your clipboard. And so they've got like a lot of features

spk_0 now that historically just were not available in Spotlight. And it does a pretty good job at what

spk_0 they have taken on. I will say that it is not an unlimited number of features, you know, the,

spk_0 and just to jump to the end on this one for me, Alfred is still firmly installed because

spk_0 there's just things Alfred can do that's about like cannot like play my music, you know. So,

spk_0 so there there is a limitation there, but for the basics, we're getting to files, you know,

spk_0 for we're doing the things that they allow you to do in Spotlight. It's perfectly adequate now.

spk_0 Yeah, it's and they've done it in a way that if you're just using it for search,

spk_0 the other things don't get in the way. And the way they've done that is

spk_0 Spotlight effectively has four modes now. And you can switch between them manually and then

spk_0 there's some ways to like kind of not have to switch between them. But you have search, you have

spk_0 applications and files. Again, if you just hit Command Space and start typing, it'll figure out what

spk_0 you want, but you can dig down a little bit more. So if you're in the files section, you get a

spk_0 filtered view of just file. So there's no applications in there, there's no actions in there.

spk_0 It'll offer you some suggestions based on recent activity and historical activity.

spk_0 But then it provides a set of filters that let you focus on a specific file type. So you can type

spk_0 slash PDF and it just like it it narrows it down to just PDFs. And Spotlight, it means 20 years old

spk_0 now. It's wild. It came out with OS 10 Tiger. And like from the beginning, it's like, oh,

spk_0 you can search by file type. And at least in my experience, that wasn't as concrete as I wanted.

spk_0 And now it's like, okay, I'm just showing you your PDFs. I'm just showing you these images.

spk_0 It doesn't seem to know about all file types. Like it does seem to kind of have some presets in

spk_0 there. And so I wish it were a little bit broader. But getting into a file type or into just your

spk_0 list of applications is really fast now. Yeah. So I've mapped it to Control Space where I've got

spk_0 Alfred on Command Space and then AI on Option Space. But the there are some things that I prefer

spk_0 in Spotlight now. And that wasn't the case, you know, a few years ago. Like certain file types

spk_0 are so much faster to search in Spotlight than try to run a workflow in Alfred. Apple notes

spk_0 and Devon think documents are two of my favorites. Like you type in the name of any Apple note or

spk_0 Devon think document and Spotlight will surface it. You hit Return and you're in. And I've worked with

spk_0 the third party workflows with Alfred and they're not as stable as Spotlight is for that problem.

spk_0 And it's like, okay, so now I've trained my little pinky and my thumb to go over to the Control Key

spk_0 when I want to get into an Apple mode or Devon think document. And that just wasn't something that

spk_0 I used to do. I think also like the app search stuff. I hate going into the apps folder. I just

spk_0 digging around in the finder just makes me nuts. And now you can hit. There's a couple of ways

spk_0 you can do it. You command one command two. You can switch through the modes or just hit right

spk_0 in the left arrow keys. I recommend if you've got a person in your life who you think can help

spk_0 benefit from this teach them the keyboard shortcut. I'm sorry, the keep teaching the arrow keys.

spk_0 Because like I think most normal people don't remember keyboard shortcuts. We say, I'll hit the

spk_0 arrow key if you want to search for an app. I think for a lot of people that could be really helpful.

spk_0 I think so too. And I think it's again, that's a nice affordance. Different people are going to

spk_0 use different ways. Some people are just going to use their mouse. Some people are going to use

spk_0 command one two three four or whatever it might be. We should definitely talk about actions. This is

spk_0 I think the most meaningful update to spotlight. They're building on top of shortcuts and app

spk_0 intents. Could you walk us through that a little bit? Yeah. I mean, it's a it's a form of automation.

spk_0 And it's an early peak at what we're going to be able to do with our voices once they figure

spk_0 Syria out. I mean, to me, this is the the biggest signaling of what they're doing. We talked about

spk_0 app intents. So we've got me and salad it. So if you haven't listened to episode, we went in on

spk_0 it kind of deep, but app intents are a language of automation. Basically, we're an app developer can

spk_0 pretty easily create an automation sub routine out of their application. And this is what drives

spk_0 shortcuts actions. So like whenever you open shortcuts and it gives you an action to print a pdf

spk_0 or whatever, that's like most likely an app intent. Apple has been very clear that that will be

spk_0 the backbone of the updated Siri and the AI kind of Siri that we're going to get hopefully next year.

spk_0 And now they folded it into spotlight as well. I mean, now that they've got this architecture,

spk_0 they're going to start hitting it everywhere. And with it, if you go into it, there's just a whole

spk_0 list of them already. And like real simple things like start a timer, send a message, you know,

spk_0 things that you want to do repeatedly. You can trigger there and they even have variable calls in it.

spk_0 They don't call them variable calls, but basically you trigger an app intent in it.

spk_0 So you want to send a message, well, who's it to and what it'll say, you know, and then you fill it

spk_0 out and off it goes. It also has the ability to add quick keys to it. So if you find yourself sending

spk_0 messages all the time and you want to do it via the app intent, you can add a quick key. You can

spk_0 even add them for a specific variable. So like I could make one to Stephen Hackett. So I could say,

spk_0 if I hit, you know, control option S, then create a message to Stephen Hackett, then all I've just

spk_0 do is type in my message and off it goes. So it's a very kind of democratized automation.

spk_0 I don't use it a time because I am a fancy automator and like a lot of the stuff I write is more

spk_0 complex than what this does. But I do think this is making automation available to people who wouldn't

spk_0 otherwise do it. And honestly, I just love these app intents. The more they show up, the better,

spk_0 I'm going to add them to my no list app. I want every app developer to make app intents because

spk_0 this is the lingua franca of automation. And the more people who have app intents,

spk_0 the better shortcuts gets, the better this feature gets, and the better this eventual brain transplant

spk_0 series gets. So this is something that I think we should all be encouraging our favorite developers

spk_0 to embrace. Absolutely. I mean, there's in so many ways, this is the future of automation for most

spk_0 people, right? There's always going to be things for those of us who want more keyboard,

spk_0 my stro, hazel, the command line, right? Automator shortcuts to a degree. But most people aren't going

spk_0 to learn those apps. Most people don't need those apps. And it's like, yeah, if I could just have

spk_0 a couple of quick things to like, okay, I text my boss every time I lock up the building. Like,

spk_0 I could just do that really quickly with my voice or in spotlight or typing to Siri. That's

spk_0 useful to everybody. And the way actions work, like it really breaks it down in really understandable

spk_0 pieces. And I think that was the goal behind the shortcuts UI. I would argue it has failed at that

spk_0 in many ways, because you still end up in shortcuts very often like needing a loop or like,

spk_0 I'm building a menu and it can get complicated quickly where actions, they're predefined, right?

spk_0 You're typing in some some variables and sending something or making something happen.

spk_0 And I think having it in spotlight is the perfect place for it because spotlight is already

spk_0 useful as an application and document launcher. So to have actions there is like just an extension

spk_0 of that. I'm so happy. This is where they put it. And they didn't put it in some like weird

spk_0 type to Siri UI that was like, often the corner somewhere is like, no, like spotlight is front

spk_0 center. This is a section of spotlight. And that makes it really visible. And that means it's more

spk_0 likely that Mac developers will continue to adopt it and add to their Mac apps because if this

spk_0 takes off, people are going to expect it. And I think Apple's hoping for a bit of a fly will

spk_0 affect there that users want it and developers will add it and then, you know, it will grow from

spk_0 there. And I think that's really positive. Yeah. And that's not enough. It's taking off. I mean,

spk_0 if you look, look through anybody listening, go to your Mac, open spotlight, go to the action,

spk_0 listen, scroll down and just look to see all the third party apps that are represented there.

spk_0 I mean, I have a lot because I anything that has these support, I usually am looking into

spk_0 because I want to incorporate it into shortcuts, but I have just hundreds of them. And it's great.

spk_0 You know, I a writer has a whole suite of them. I don't even know that existed till just now. And

spk_0 but there's a lot of different ones out there. And you'll find uses for it. And like is it another

spk_0 use for this because a lot of our listeners are the people who kind of are the sharp endistic

spk_0 for their family. And you talked earlier like, what if you want to tell your boss you locked it up

spk_0 locked up the building? And maybe that's your spouse. And you know that they do that every day.

spk_0 You could go in there for them. And you could fill in the name of the boss. You could write the message.

spk_0 So the whole thing is pre-canned. And then put it on a shortcut. They'd remember and say, you know,

spk_0 hey, sweetheart, if you push this button, that message gets sent for you. You don't have to do

spk_0 the hero for that kind of stuff. I love it. Yeah, it's super cool. Yeah. So spotlight, we're both a

spk_0 fan. And they've been flirting with making spotlight better for years. You know, that you

spk_0 why I got a little juice. And then like, but this year they really took it on. I don't think Alfred

spk_0 and the other apps, you know, power, keyboard launches are in any jeopardy here of Sherlock.

spk_0 You know, I don't think Apple's going to open them up the way they are opened up. But

spk_0 I am really pleased that they have expanded the functionality of spotlight.

spk_0 The last tab there is a clipboard history. We spoke about this after a WDC. It is,

spk_0 it's wild to me. Apple has a first party clipboard manager now. It is more powerful than I expected

spk_0 it to be. I was a little afraid because they kind of blew through it in the keynote. I was like,

spk_0 oh, this is just going to be text like it does a lot of stuff. There is an eight hour time limit,

spk_0 which is some people like bulk at that. I don't that's fine. Like I never need a clipboard history

spk_0 for me is like, I'm loading up three things to pace three things. It's not a history for me personally.

spk_0 And so it has again, in my experiment to use just spotlight and not Alfred for a while,

spk_0 the clipboard history has not been a hang up other than getting to it. It's again, the muscle memory.

spk_0 But it works as basically doing what I was doing in Alfred. And so I'm totally cool with that.

spk_0 Yeah, the eight hours is a problem for me because I often do like, I've been working on a project

spk_0 for a new field guide for the last couple of days. And I'm definitely using older than an eight hour

spk_0 material on my clipboard. The other thing is though, I feel like this is a tease of what it could be.

spk_0 Like can you imagine a few years from now when it's a 24 hour history and it's on all of your

spk_0 Apple devices so you can pick it up on your iPad or your Mac or your phone. I feel like Apple

spk_0 is a first party has a unique opportunity here to kind of solve the clipboard problem for us.

spk_0 And I hope this is just the initial toe hold. That's my goal. I actually submitted a feedback

spk_0 on that one. If anybody out there wants to follow up with that, please do. I feel like, you know,

spk_0 it's just such an obvious win for them to expand this. Yeah. Yeah. I would love to know why

spk_0 they chose eight hours. Like, is it a security thing? But even then Mac apps can at least we're

spk_0 using Alfred. So I assume this is like a system level thing. Mac apps can basically like

spk_0 overwrite their clipboard with something blank. So like if you copy it, pass it out of one password,

spk_0 it doesn't stay on your clipboard forever. It disappears. And so I don't think that's a big issue.

spk_0 Maybe it was like a performance issue. But then again, like we're overring really fast

spk_0 Macs now. I would love to know why that decision was made. And yeah, it would not harm anything

spk_0 for it to be longer that I could that I could foresee. Yeah. And I think maybe part of it is just

spk_0 this whole thing was, you know, that's as much as we have time for right now. Maybe. You know,

spk_0 you know, and they had a lot on their plate this year. We did a show, I did show with Rosemary when

spk_0 you were out planning for St. Jude. And we went, Rosemary took apart all the new shortcuts stuff

spk_0 coming. But there, there is a nice substantive improvement to shortcuts this year. Have you played

spk_0 with any of that stuff? A little bit. The thing that I think I'm most excited about is automations,

spk_0 which basically apples way of saying that you can have a shortcut run without direct input.

spk_0 So it can run at a particular time of day or if an alarm goes off, do this or if I receive an

spk_0 email or a message with these details, then set a shortcut off. That's really been missing

spk_0 from the Mac. And is when we talk about keyboard, my show and others, these third party tools,

spk_0 one thing that makes them so powerful is all the triggers you can choose from. And now shortcuts

spk_0 sort of graduates in the next level that you can have these things kind of ready to go. And you

spk_0 don't have to think, Oh, it's 3 p.m. I need to go run my shortcut. No, it's like it's 3 p.m.

spk_0 and you shortcut runs. And that's that's very good. Yeah, I'm making an update to the shortcuts field

spk_0 guides. So if you've got those, watch your email in about three or four weeks, it's it's coming.

spk_0 And you'll get a free update with some new videos. But to me, the real win here is the access to

spk_0 to AI models. And so you've got three ways you can go with a shortcut. You can do the

spk_0 on device model, you do the chat GPT. But the the middle one, the Goldilocks one is private cloud

spk_0 compute access for users. And this is to me really cool. I did videos on this in the lab. So the

spk_0 lab's numbers know about this. But the I've been doing this thing where I like to take my my journal

spk_0 entry for the day. And then I like to throw it at an AI to say ask me five thoughtful questions

spk_0 about my journal like since some things I should have thought about based on what happened today.

spk_0 I also like having it query me on stoic virtues and different things. And but I've always felt a

spk_0 little gross sending that stuff up to cloud or chat GPT, right? So I built a shortcut that does

spk_0 is with Apple's private cloud compute. And if you don't remember, PCC, that is a server Apple has

spk_0 somewhere that is completely anonymized and running an AI engine. It's bigger than the foundation

spk_0 model that's in your phone. It's so it's going to give you a better answer. But it's still entirely private.

spk_0 And I was shocked at how good this thing did it giving me feedback on journal entries. And it was

spk_0 like problem solved. I don't have to send this stuff off to, you know, you know, Sam Altman or whoever

spk_0 is an anthropic. I can just, you know, I can just send this up to private cloud compute. I mean,

spk_0 and that's the thing about AI that you have to realize is that Apple is behind. But right now,

spk_0 good enough is still pretty good for a lot of uses, you know. And this PCC thing is great.

spk_0 Developers can't access it like at least at this point, you know, developers are writing AI

spk_0 stuff that uses the foundation model on your phone. But as a user in shortcuts, you can. I think

spk_0 this is Apple's way of kind of throttling it. You mean, how many people are running shortcuts,

spk_0 right? But it allows them to kind of get the, yeah, get the wheels turning in the PCC factory. And I

spk_0 am using it all the time. Ever since I did that video on the labs, I'm hearing from a ton of

spk_0 labs numbers that have written fairly complex entirely private AI subroutines out of shortcuts. So,

spk_0 I think this is kind of the sleeping giant of the update this year in shortcuts.

spk_0 How is the speed on the private cloud compute? Thanks.

spk_0 For what I'm doing, it's fine. Okay. You know, it's probably a little faster if you go off to

spk_0 to chat GPT or or cloud. But I mean, it's like, it's not like five minutes. It's like maybe 10 to

spk_0 30 seconds. Okay. Probably close to 10. Totally livable. Yeah, it's fine.

spk_0 And I'm not using it to write from I'm using it to critique and like ask questions. And to me,

spk_0 for whatever reason, I think that that task is low enough on the bar that this whatever they're

spk_0 using to drive PCC is good enough for that. So anyway, yeah, I'm excited about that. And that's

spk_0 one of my favorite features this year. There are some other features we want to touch on.

spk_0 There's folder labels. We're going to talk more about these and more power users.

spk_0 You've got the color tags, which are, you know, the red yellow orange, green, blue, purple, gray.

spk_0 They're there. But now you can combine them with some select SS symbols or emoji to really

spk_0 customize folders, which I think is really cool. Every time Apple says select SS symbols,

spk_0 I want to throw a brick through the window. I mean, I don't understand why they're so stingy

spk_0 with these symbols. I know. You can use some, but not many. They do the same thing in reminders,

spk_0 where they've got a bunch of the SS symbols that you can make an icon for reminders list.

spk_0 But it's like, I don't know, 50. They've got, meanwhile, they've made like a thousand SF symbols.

spk_0 I don't get it. Anyway, sorry. That's just a little annoying. I totally agree.

spk_0 One thing that we are both really enjoying is multiple control centers. So a couple of years ago,

spk_0 two years ago, or last year, we got customizable control centers on iOS. You can have multiple pages.

spk_0 And now they've basically brought that to the Mac, a very similar user interface.

spk_0 So I have my sort of regular control center. And then I built a home kit control center that

spk_0 basically matches what's on my phone for my home kit stuff. And I love this. I can't wait

spk_0 for it to be more widely adopted. It is so powerful on the iPhone and to have it on the Mac is

spk_0 fantastic. Yeah. A big win. Same thing. And I think that's just the natural second control center

spk_0 is home kit stuff. If you've got home automation stuff in your house, why not have a separate

spk_0 menu bar item where you can control it all and just to click, totally make sense. There's a lot of

spk_0 third party apps out there for now doing this stuff. But Apple needed to do this. I guess going

spk_0 back to our music complaints, you could, you could make a music one too. And you could control all

spk_0 that from your menu bar. There's a lot of options here. Spend some time turning the wheels and

spk_0 the dials. Make sure you understand it. And you're going to have ideas. Yeah. I will say at least

spk_0 with the home kit stuff and maybe it's true of others. Sometimes you don't have the exact same

spk_0 functionality. So like on the iPhone, you can adjust a thermostat from control center. You can't

spk_0 on the Mac. It opens the home app. So I would like Apple and third party devs to just make sure that

spk_0 your actions and control center are consistent. Because I think the consensus here is really

spk_0 important to have, okay, if I have this sort of control, whether it's home kit or a third party

spk_0 application doing something that they act the same way. And so hopefully that gets cleaned up a

spk_0 little bit. Yeah, I agree. And this is the first go at this. This is another one. I'm giving them a

spk_0 little, a little grace to get this sorted out. But the existing, the mere existence of the

spk_0 feature to me is, is excellent. Chat GPT key and image playground. You know, if you want image

spk_0 playground to be nice, use the chat GPT bit of it. Yeah. Yeah. Sure. That's simple. I'm unclear

spk_0 if Apple has, I think they do have a different set of limitations above what chat GPT would do on

spk_0 its own. Apple has a tendency to keep these things pretty PG right. Which I don't disagree with.

spk_0 necessarily. But it is, it is not image, like it's going out. It's asking chat GP to make an

spk_0 image and it returns the rights. Similar thing you could do in the chat GPT app or on the website.

spk_0 I think it's, I think you could look at this and be like, oh gosh, like they know image playground is

spk_0 bad. I think they probably do know that. But also like they have, they have integrated chat GPT

spk_0 more and more across the ecosystem. And this is like another place where yeah, it makes sense. Like

spk_0 if Apple has an image generation thing and their partner with chat GPT or Google or somebody

spk_0 else in the future, like yeah, it should be an option where you are. So you're just using the app

spk_0 you're used to and you kind of select like, okay, what, what service am I sort of requesting this

spk_0 from? I think it makes a lot of sense in that context. I mean, there's a bigger story to this.

spk_0 Apple has, it seems like got less precious about artificial intelligence and Apple intelligence.

spk_0 I think the first time they went at it, they thought they would control the whole widget themselves.

spk_0 And you know, now it seems like they're more willing to open it up. I mean, there's

spk_0 real kind of substantive rumors about Apple opening up the entire Mac to an MCP to a model

spk_0 context protocol where you could use a third party AI to control your Mac. And I think that,

spk_0 that is them kind of seeing what's going on and wanting to be part of the conversation.

spk_0 I mean, Apple is the ultimate like,

spk_0 Arbitra of our data, like all of us that use Apple Gear, we have so much data in there. None of it,

spk_0 like me and my diary entries, we're all kind of precious about it. We don't really want to send it

spk_0 off to some AI somewhere. But if Apple can figure a way to harness those AI's to our data locally on

spk_0 our devices, I still think that's like, I still think the vision of Apple intelligence is

spk_0 spot on. They just got to execute it. And, and I think combining with some of these third party

spk_0 companies is probably the best and fastest way to do it. Oh, yeah. I mean, clearly they've

spk_0 struggled to get there for whatever reason, a myriad of reasons, I think. And yeah, if Apple,

spk_0 honestly, if Apple wants to sit in between me and an AI company and help negotiate for lack of a

spk_0 better word, what data they get, how personalized that is, I'm not against that at all. I think

spk_0 that's actually good for users and helps keep these AI companies at bay a little bit. So I expect

spk_0 to see more of this. I'm a little surprised. We haven't seen a partnership with Google through

spk_0 Gemini and their other features yet. But yeah, Chat GPD, you know, spreading its, spreading its

spk_0 wings and more places on Apple's platforms. Lately, I've been really smitten with Anthropics,

spk_0 Claude. It's just for the kind of stuff I do that works really well. And I'm using some of its

spk_0 MCPs and I feel like that also would be a very good fit for Apple. It seems like the, the kind of

spk_0 corporate culture would fit. But I don't know. We'll see. We got some new apps as well on the Mac.

spk_0 Yeah, we got the phone app. And in 2025, I mock, I think this is great. I find myself

spk_0 making my calls a lot at work. And it does the call screening and message transcription stuff

spk_0 that you get elsewhere. This app in particular, it feels like the most like modern interpretation

spk_0 of how Apple is designing apps. Like if you're on Tahoe and you open the phone app,

spk_0 there are parts of it that feel a little bit weird on the Mac. Like, as some point I had a pop

spk_0 over and the escape key didn't work to close it as a quality should work. That's how the Mac works.

spk_0 I had to go find the cancel button. But the way it looks, the way it works, it feels very modern.

spk_0 I think in a good way. And noticeably, it lacks, we spoke about this last time in the phone app,

spk_0 you can switch between the classic and the combined view is just the combined view. They built this

spk_0 new that makes sense to me. Why would you port in the classic design? It's great because

spk_0 before it would do the weird thing, it would open the FaceTime app and hand it off to your phone,

spk_0 it was weird. And now it's just like, yeah, it just opens the phone app, it makes a call,

spk_0 and you're all set. Yeah. And I really find, I don't make many calls from it, but I love

spk_0 with that one, a call comes in. I can see the transcription everything just right there on my screen.

spk_0 And it's actually quite useful. Yeah, it is. I thought at first I'm like, well, what do I need that for?

spk_0 And I find I use it. The journal app has finally made its way over to the Mac.

spk_0 It's still fairly limited, but it's a free app that can get you journaling. And now it's across

spk_0 all the platforms. Good on you. Yeah, I played with the export functionality. And it exports things,

spk_0 basically into like a structured HTML folder. So you have your entries and you have your images.

spk_0 Export is always good in tools like this. It's got some notifications. You can set up for reminders.

spk_0 The big thing with journal that they launched it with and the reason it launched on the iPhone is

spk_0 the iPhone is the only platform that has this like, it's based on this technology called NS user,

spk_0 I think, but basically like, this is the music you listen to today. These are the podcast you listen

spk_0 to today and if developers opt into that, then they can basically donate your activity to the journal

spk_0 app. That is still iPhone only. So when you open it on the Mac or the iPad, it's simpler. But then if

spk_0 you open it on the phone, it still has all the suggestions about where you've been on those other

spk_0 things. Maybe at some point they could sync that with iCloud. So if I opened it on the Mac,

spk_0 that activity data would be there from my phone, but I'm just glad it's on the Mac. I mean,

spk_0 I've joint complaint about this when it launched was it's iPhone only. And if for a lot of people,

spk_0 if you're going to sit down to some serious writing, you want a keyboard. So you want it on the iPad

spk_0 or the Mac and it's here. You know, it's basic, but it's totally going to get the job done for you.

spk_0 Yeah, great. The live activities, you know, that idea that you have in your, on your phone,

spk_0 coming over to the menu bar was a great feature. That does not work for either one of us.

spk_0 I have never got this to work. Yeah, I have yet to see a live activity in my menu bar. Now,

spk_0 I have iPhone notifications set up and they also aren't coming in. And like I haven't set up

spk_0 correctly. So maybe there's a bit of a bug at the moment, but I'm looking forward to the day when

spk_0 they show up because I love live activities. I love, I don't think we talked about this. I love that

spk_0 they're in car play now. And yeah, maybe one day my Mac and iPhone will talk to each other again.

spk_0 I want to in the future do a check in on my car. Yeah, yeah, on car play car, but not today.

spk_0 Also, just a little bit of businesses we wrap up here on macOS. One thing that has happened

spk_0 since all this releases is I've been getting messages from some listeners saying,

spk_0 hey, I'm not going to be using a Macbook Air anymore. I'm going to be using an iPad now for my

spk_0 mobile. You know, a lot of people have like a desktop Mac and other communities iPad because of

spk_0 the changes we talked about last week. Steven, I are going to do a show on that. If that is you,

spk_0 if you're making some changes based on new operating system, write in and tell us what you're doing

spk_0 because we're looking for, uh, looking to see what people are doing now with the new iPad OS. Yes.

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spk_0 We do want to touch on some of the other operating systems that have been updated. And up next is

spk_0 Vision OS 26. I have spent zero time with this. Like I think there's a beta on my Vision Perot.

spk_0 But I haven't gotten it out to update it like it just sitting over there in a cabinet.

spk_0 How has this been because you're you're still in Vision Perot land.

spk_0 I just so I always want to laugh you just really have given up on Vision OS. How are you?

spk_0 Yep. Yep. It's like sorry. Like you know.

spk_0 Okay. So the way I use it is somewhat limited. But I you know I live with three women and they

spk_0 don't like all the shows I do like right now slow horses is there is got a new season out. I love

spk_0 sitting in my Vision OS and watching it on the big screen. Like that's a perfect example for

spk_0 content consumption. Second thing is I'm always playing with some of the 3D games or I guess vision

spk_0 games, whatever you call them. I think those are really fun and fun to explore. I like some of

spk_0 the information for informative ones. Like I heard that they're building a full fully rendered 3D

spk_0 model of the lighthouse of Alexandria, which was like I think it lasted like 1600 years before

spk_0 fell into the ocean. Like I'll be able to walk through that in my Vision OS. I can't wait.

spk_0 The other thing I do with it is the writing environment. And this was something I talked about

spk_0 when I first released. But I like I use the Yosemite environment and Apple notes and I write

spk_0 most of my blog posts and newsletters just sitting there kind of tuned out from the world.

spk_0 So that's my use. What we got this year. Well we got widgets that like embed into the walls.

spk_0 It's kind of fun. You know when you look up there and you see your calendar or whatever. I don't

spk_0 find it all that useful. When I work because of the work flows I've explained I actually don't want

spk_0 a bunch of widgets. I don't want a lot of distraction. I kind of like being in Vision OS. I like it

spk_0 to be kind of solitary. The other thing we got is massively upgraded personas. They're much better.

spk_0 I guess you and I should arrange a call someday because they look way better. But I never use them.

spk_0 I mean I was just talking in the labs. I'm going to get a group of labs people together. We're

spk_0 going to like try and meet every couple months or something in Vision land because I just don't have

spk_0 any experience doing this stuff because to me Vision OS is like the place I go to get away from

spk_0 the world not to talk to other people. But they are extensively better. They've got some new plugins

spk_0 for Safari. They call it Spatial Safari. I have found that really not that useful. We need people out

spk_0 in the world to actually build for it and we're not getting that much of it. But it's also what I'm

spk_0 calling early days strides because it's such a new operating system. There's still a lot of low

spk_0 hanging for it that needs to be picked. This year we got some of a picked. There's folders now

spk_0 you can organize your apps. That sounds crazy but didn't have that before.

spk_0 Yeah, that was a frustrating point in Vision OS 1 and 2 for me. I was like why can't I have more

spk_0 control over this? It used to be a big deal. If you had to check something on your phone while

spk_0 you're wearing it and you couldn't unlock it because it couldn't see your face and now they fix that

spk_0 and switching to a lot of other people to try it was completely bananas when they first released

spk_0 and it's got better. So they're making progress on little things. None of it has really changed my

spk_0 workflows in there. The one workflow I would really like to develop is a glass board workflow

spk_0 where you could have a big fill the room with a glass board that you could write your thoughts

spk_0 on and develop ideas with virtually. I wanted that free form. It seems like a natural for it.

spk_0 They announced a new product at WWC. The Logitech Muse Pencil. Logitech already makes this

spk_0 pencil for other virtual reality headsets. But it's a pencil where you're supposed to be able to

spk_0 write in space and it'll show up. I don't really know how it works. I'm going to get one as soon as

spk_0 they have it. But it's not out yet. Yeah, yeah. I just went to the web page. It's coming later this

spk_0 year. Same thing with the Sense Controller from PlayStation. I feel like the games could get better if

spk_0 you could have some some proper game controllers and those are not supported yet either. So

spk_0 there's still work to be done. I'm glad to see Apple's continuing work on it. We're hearing rumors

spk_0 that there's an upgraded Vision Pro around the corner. Just with the I think it would they're saying

spk_0 the M5 processor. Not really anything else. But I don't really think that you know I have any

spk_0 problem with the current hardware. It works fine. Although I guess as AI gets better that's where

spk_0 you're going to need more processing power. Yeah. But yeah, it's a nice update this year. It's not

spk_0 revolutionary. It's evolutionary. They're hitting some of that low hanging fruit that's still there.

spk_0 And I would you know the chicken and egg problems still exist. Like I love drafts. Drafts is my

spk_0 favorite app. Greg's a friend. But he can't justify spending money and time building a vision

spk_0 up when Stephen Hackett won't even turn his back. That's a good example, right? I mean you worry

spk_0 about our user and you're just not interested. Apple has always been able to take

spk_0 for granted that they're going to have a lot of users with anything they make. And this is the

spk_0 first time that hasn't come true. And you're seeing it in the app store. Yeah, I think so. I mean,

spk_0 I can tell you, you know, Widgetsmith is on Vision OS. And it doesn't have a big user base. And

spk_0 it just hasn't been there on Vision Pro in a way that makes sense to continue investing in

spk_0 it at this point. You know, it's early days for the Vision Pro and Vision OS platform. And it's

spk_0 going to move slower than something like the iPad, mostly because of the cost, I think. But

spk_0 things they need to improve and change and like things like the the Logitech Muse. Like,

spk_0 yeah, that makes a ton of sense. Like Apple seemed very set. Like you just need your hands and

spk_0 eyes. And I think they realize through feedback or through user data or whatever. Like, oh, people

spk_0 want to use a keyboard and trackpad at times. Let's make that better. Now people want hand controls.

spk_0 People want a pin to be able to write. Like they are opening the door to things that they seemed

spk_0 maybe this hadn't gotten to yet, but they seemed a little closed off from before. And I think

spk_0 that's a sign that they are taking it seriously. And they're going to keep tipping away at it.

spk_0 Yeah. And honestly, it's early days. And when they get to a point where the hardware gets more

spk_0 affordable, the operating system's going to be in pretty good shape. Yeah, it's true.

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spk_0 for their support of the show and all of Relay. All right, how about WatchOS? So WatchOS 26.

spk_0 My headline, liquid glass on a tiny screen. I think this is a bit of a take that at least I

spk_0 want to my other co-host Mike Rally disagrees with. I actually really like liquid glass on WatchOS.

spk_0 Like if you get, you pull down the notifications. Like it feels and looks like a water bubble

spk_0 on top of the screen. And it's because liquid glasses like taking over the screen. I really like it.

spk_0 I think the watch should be like fun and playful in a way. And liquid glass brings that. So I like

spk_0 the redesign on the watch. Yeah, I think it's fine. You know, my take on liquid glasses

spk_0 universal. It's like, yeah, that's nice, but it's not, it's not going to change the world. But it's

spk_0 not going to ruin the world either. A couple things because I got a new one. This is a mix of

spk_0 operating system update and just day to getting a new watch. But there's a risk of slick gesture.

spk_0 Man, I know some of our listeners are ahead of me on this because they got new watches the last

spk_0 couple of years. But man, it's such a game changer of user watch to like set timers and get alerts.

spk_0 Just a flick your wrist. Man, I love that. Also, we got a new face with the ultra this year,

spk_0 which is like a navigation face. It's called Waypoint. I'm digging Waypoint. You know, as much as I

spk_0 whine in moan about Apple Watch faces, Waypoint is pushing my buttons right now.

spk_0 Yeah, it's nice when they get a win with a new watch face because very often new watch faces,

spk_0 I feel like the one that's like, I don't know the name, I don't have an Apple Watch on today.

spk_0 But the one that's like the liquid glass numbers is like, I just can't straight straight,

spk_0 straight up can't read that. Like, what are you doing? I'm not interested. Yeah. Yeah.

spk_0 I would like to be able to tell the time when I look at my watch. But that's okay. Yeah,

spk_0 the watch faces is nice. I have played with that. And the gesture stuff is really cool. And

spk_0 making the watch usable one handed seems like a banana's goal. But like they're getting there.

spk_0 You can do simple things, tapping your fingers together, doing the wrist flick gesture. I would

spk_0 imagine that, you know, that on the watch and on Vision Pro, like, you know, they're trying to

spk_0 solve similar problems with hand tracking and other things. I think that's fantastic. What do you

spk_0 call watch enthusiast? You call them horologists or something like that? Yes, something along those

spk_0 lines. Yeah. Well, in that world, there's a term called tool watch. I didn't know it until

spk_0 my kids got me a watch and they said it's a tool watch. Well, I'm a tool watch kind of guy.

spk_0 I want my watch face to be like a tool watch and so many of the ones Apple makes like that goofy

spk_0 liquid glass one just turn not not even at all interesting to me. Sleep score. Have you played with

spk_0 that? Yes. I've spent a lot of time looking at sleep score because I work on sleep plus plus.

spk_0 Apple sleep score is really just extending some things they were already doing in the first

spk_0 party sleep tracking. For a while, they've tracked things like how long you sleep, the consistency of

spk_0 when you fall asleep and even the like your awake periods. Sleep score is basically bundling all

spk_0 that up and giving you a score and basically how well the Apple watch thinks you slept.

spk_0 But it doesn't seem to take into account some other factors like heart rate variability,

spk_0 resting heart rate and your sleep goal. And so apps like sleep plus plus or our competitors can

spk_0 offer. I still think a more complete picture of your sleep. Like it's great that I have like a 99

spk_0 sleep score because I slept really well. But did I sleep? But did I sleep really well because I ran

spk_0 a marathon the next day and like I am more interested in a readiness score that gives me a more

spk_0 complete picture like yeah, I may have slept well, but the marathon wore me out. My readiness

spk_0 score isn't great today. Like that can be an indicator that maybe I take it easy today. Maybe I

spk_0 just do some some stretching and you know eat well and I don't I've never run a marathon. I don't

spk_0 know what you do the day after a marathon. But it is a good feature, but it's not a complete

spk_0 feature. So I think third parties are still so I've plenty of room in this market. Yeah. I'm having

spk_0 trouble getting behind workout buddy. I've had it turned on. I do some some workouts and some gym

spk_0 stuff and you know, a fake buddy talking to me just doesn't work. I don't find that sort of thing

spk_0 at all like energizing or to be a motivation. Some people it is like some people I'm sure this is

spk_0 excellent or they want the group workout experience with someone cheering you on like I find that

spk_0 off-putting personally. And so workout buddy is something that I'm not interested in. I think

spk_0 it's a little bit different than like if you're doing like a couch to 5k type thing that's like

spk_0 hey, you know, run. Okay, you're now walk. You're going to run again in 15 seconds now run like the

spk_0 directions are different. But the hey, you just close your fastest mile or whatever like I'm just not

spk_0 I'm not interested in that personally. Although I will say in my fantasy high cap, you know, the

spk_0 we had a guest on that shared this app three or four months ago. I have now walked 188 miles

spk_0 on my trip to Mount Doom. That's awesome. Okay, volume adjustment is an interesting feature. So

spk_0 the idea is if you're in a loud room, it's louder if you're in a quiet room, the sounds are quieter.

spk_0 But like in our little group of friends, I think none of us have sounds turned on and probably

spk_0 our phones or our watches. No. And I think that's fairly common. I don't think it's just a

spk_0 different thing to turn it off. But just in honor of this change the last month or so, I've been

spk_0 keeping the sounds turned on my watch and my phone. So I'm getting things and alerts. And I have

spk_0 to say that the soundscape of both of these devices is delightful. I feel like Apple has done a

spk_0 really good job with the sounds if you want sounds. But I'm not sure how many keep it on.

spk_0 Yeah, I don't like I'm just like thinking because I'm around people who are Apple watch like my

spk_0 wife or as an Apple watch most of my friends do. I don't know the last time I heard an Apple watch sound.

spk_0 I would imagine that the vast majority of users have it silenced. There's a thing that makes a lot

spk_0 of sense. And you know, you have the the whole reason they have the TAPPIC engine in there so you

spk_0 can feel when it needs your you know, no notification comes in or an alert comes in. You don't have

spk_0 to hear it. That's like the whole point. But yeah, Apple sound design, you know, a few years ago

spk_0 they changed a lot of the sounds on macOS and I think mostly for the better. I think some of them

spk_0 were regression. But then like I just noticed the other night my wife was I mess new I messaging

spk_0 somebody on her laptop and the speakers were on it's like, oh, those are the old iChat sounds like

spk_0 Apple does a really good job with sound design. And yeah, maybe the watch could be a candidate

spk_0 for some additional work. And finally we got notes on the Apple watch. Is it though?

spk_0 Like I have one like medical notes like I just keep a little notes when I go to the doctor. I was at

spk_0 the doctor the other day and I thought, well, he asked me questions and said, well, I wonder if I

spk_0 could get that on my watch. And then I thought about it and I looked at her sitting there and I thought,

spk_0 I'm going to open up my phone. I'm not going to fiddle with my watch here. So I'm curious to see

spk_0 what the use cases are for it. But I'm glad it's there, but I'm not sure that I'll ever use it.

spk_0 Do you have a case for it? I mean, now that you put it that way probably not.

spk_0 But you know, hey, they did it. Somebody will find people. Yeah, I'm sure we'll hear maybe in

spk_0 feedback episode. We'll have some good stories about it. But I just, I'm not sure how you

spk_0 slowly do me. But yeah, good. Good on you, Apple. Made one good face this year. I'll take it. Yeah.

spk_0 The rest is gravy. Okay. So we have now covered all the operating systems this year. Overall,

spk_0 how you feeling? I feel pretty good. These releases in my experience have been, you know,

spk_0 once we're kind of out of the early beta as remarkably stable. Like I'm running Tahoe on my

spk_0 production machine earlier than I normally would put a macOS release on my production machine.

spk_0 It's been totally fine. Phone is great. The watch is great. I feel like really this Apple landed

spk_0 the plane better than I feared, not that there's not work to do on the design. There clearly is.

spk_0 Right. They have things they need to address. But in terms of usability and stability,

spk_0 it's pretty good for, for, you know, being at the point, oh, still. And I think Apple has paid

spk_0 better attention to making non-breaking changes. Right. There was a time where, you know,

spk_0 it was made of example, but like iOS 4 to 5, if you didn't update your app,

spk_0 frio is 5 and user updated, the app would be broken or like part of the UI when it render. And

spk_0 Apple has done a much better job at preserving that compatibility. It's not perfect. Like you can

spk_0 still run into issues, but they've made strides there. I think that make developers lives better,

spk_0 but also make users lives better. Because the last thing you want is to update your phone and then

spk_0 like the apps you rely on don't work or the programming on your Mac crashes at launch. Like I

spk_0 haven't experienced any of that with a new release in a long time. And I think that's to Apple's

spk_0 great credit. Yeah. And you know, some years we don't get as many features as we want and

spk_0 we all have our pet things we want them to fix or change. But something that has gone on over

spk_0 the last 15 years is Apple has really done a good job at like kind of pulling everything together.

spk_0 You know, SwiftUI, the new memory system, the new disk system. I mean, all this stuff,

spk_0 I feel like combines to make a unified Apple platform that it goes out to all their hardware.

spk_0 And it makes these kind of significant years of change less dramatic in my opinion.

spk_0 Yeah. I think that's I think that's spot on. You know, they've they've got a lot of platforms to move

spk_0 kind of at the same time. And they've done a lot of work internally to make that easier.

spk_0 Right where the underpinnings of Mac OS and iOS and iPad OS were closer than ever. They kind of

spk_0 rooted apart and they rebroad them back together several years ago, like deep foundational level stuff.

spk_0 And that work, you know, that works on exciting. That work barely makes a mention in the state

spk_0 of the union at WBC, but it's important. And now Apple can reap the benefits of that. You know,

spk_0 same thing with Mac catalyst, right? Messages, maps, lots of other Mac apps are really Mac catalyst

spk_0 apps now. And what that means is like, yeah, when a new feature comes to one place, it comes to

spk_0 the Mac too. And they've been they've been laying the groundwork for that probably for a decade. And

spk_0 having the now like, okay, we're going to relative design. We're going to relative features.

spk_0 And it's basically all going to be mostly okay. Like that's a win, I think.

spk_0 I agree. We are the Mac Power users. You can find us at Relay.fm slash mpu to leave feedback and

spk_0 sign up for membership for more Power users. More Power users is the ad free extended version of

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817: macOS Tahoe, visionOS, & watchOS 26

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