Stop Avoiding Difficult Conversations (Do This Instead) - Jayson Gaddis - 544

Interactive Transcript

spk_0 Hey, welcome back to another episode of the Relationship Coaching School podcast.

spk_0 I'm your host, Jason, and we're going to dive in to difficult conversations.

spk_0 I'm going to try to help you remember how to stop avoiding difficult conversations because

spk_0 they will destroy your relationship life if that's your approach.

spk_0 So all you conflict avoiders listen up.

spk_0 And this is what we got to help our clients with if we're a coach or therapist

spk_0 because people are understandably terrified to have difficult conversations.

spk_0 It's just, oh, there's a lot of reasons, right?

spk_0 So in this episode, we're going to talk briefly about the cost of not having

spk_0 difficult conversations.

spk_0 The benefits to having them and how to begin.

spk_0 That'll be what we cover, right?

spk_0 Okay.

spk_0 So let's look at the cost, right?

spk_0 Just think of someone right now that you're not having a conversation with.

spk_0 I guarantee you there's someone in your life who you could have a difficult conversation

spk_0 with and because you haven't been having it, it's like you're maybe avoiding it, right?

spk_0 Family member is an a common target and intimate partner is a common one or a coworker is

spk_0 another common one.

spk_0 So these are typically high stakes environments where it's most difficult for us to lean in

spk_0 and engage and take a risk.

spk_0 And notice your stories as to why you're avoiding this conversation.

spk_0 You likely have a past negative experience or you have a future fear assumption about

spk_0 what you think is going to happen.

spk_0 And often what we fear is it'll just make the whole thing worse, right?

spk_0 So why would I, why the hell Jason, when I bring that up, if it's going to make it worse?

spk_0 And making it worse is everything like it starts a bigger fight, we get into a fight.

spk_0 The truth comes out and it just turns to do a total disaster.

spk_0 They feel judged.

spk_0 We feel judged.

spk_0 We all feel a bunch of uncomfortable feelings that we don't want to feel.

spk_0 And ultimately the relationship ends.

spk_0 That's one of our worst fears of course is that, dude, bringing this up didn't help and

spk_0 the person actually doesn't want to ever talk to me again.

spk_0 So no thanks.

spk_0 I don't want that.

spk_0 So I will shut my mouth, minimize my pain and my irritation over here and just go along to get along.

spk_0 Of course, you can do that.

spk_0 But I think you're losing out tremendously on a massive learning opportunity.

spk_0 So frame this whole thing as, all right, I'm going to learn, learn about myself.

spk_0 I'm going to learn about the other person.

spk_0 I'm going to learn about conflict.

spk_0 I'll learn how to communicate better.

spk_0 I'll learn how to repair.

spk_0 I'm going to just learn.

spk_0 Then no matter how bad it goes, you still win.

spk_0 You still come out on top, meaning you just learned a lot about yourself and how this

spk_0 particular relationship works and like, whoa, okay.

spk_0 That's setting you up for success, all right?

spk_0 Even if it goes really poorly.

spk_0 Okay, some of the costs of not bringing this up, all right?

spk_0 I recently facilitated a high stakes business conflict resolution process with a person

spk_0 who was the business owner and a person who was the second in command.

spk_0 Well, it turns out they had 20 plus years of avoiding almost every single hard conversation

spk_0 in their relationship.

spk_0 So, what is the cost of doing that just avoiding like, and it's crazy that they can still

spk_0 sit in the same room and allow me to facilitate a conversation with them because there's so much

spk_0 damage from avoiding the conversation.

spk_0 Like what kind of damage Jason?

spk_0 Well, for example, one of the people, their kids, adult children, never want to speak to

spk_0 them again.

spk_0 How would that be for you parents out there?

spk_0 Your kids don't ever talk to you again.

spk_0 Oof, how about divorce?

spk_0 About separation?

spk_0 How about the health problems of late nights not sleeping because this is on your heart

spk_0 in mind?

spk_0 How about your lack of diet?

spk_0 Like you just don't feel like eating because you're so stressed out about this person?

spk_0 What is this cost physically and mentally on your health, right?

spk_0 And there's so many other costs that are downstream of avoiding conflict.

spk_0 One of the big ones, of course, is that we resent and resentment carries in our bodies

spk_0 and our minds as to me as like toxicity.

spk_0 It's just not good for us.

spk_0 It feels really bad to resent other people.

spk_0 And that's going on 24-7 in you, right?

spk_0 Because you're not willing to have this conversation.

spk_0 Your truth gets squelched.

spk_0 If you're a parent, you're modeling, stuffing your feelings, stuffing your truth.

spk_0 And this is how we do relationships as we don't speak up.

spk_0 We don't lean in.

spk_0 We avoid.

spk_0 And that's the 18-year teaching that goes in to children.

spk_0 If you continue doing that, right?

spk_0 There's being out of integrity with yourself and what's it like to just betray yourself

spk_0 and your integrity and your truth to keep the peace?

spk_0 What's that cost?

spk_0 Right?

spk_0 Energetically and just on you and your well-being.

spk_0 It's pretty high.

spk_0 And I've seen financial ruin.

spk_0 I've seen tens of millions and thousands of dollars of debt, all for on hundreds of thousands

spk_0 of dollars, when people don't speak up.

spk_0 Because they're, quote, too scared or it's too uncomfortable.

spk_0 And so the cost is very, very high.

spk_0 And so if you're a coach or therapist, you can help your clients get in touch with

spk_0 the cost of inaction.

spk_0 All right.

spk_0 And remember, I set it up in my book of, there's two shitty choices.

spk_0 Speak up.

spk_0 And the worst case scenario is the person doesn't want to talk to us ever again.

spk_0 Okay?

spk_0 And it's important to explore worst case scenarios.

spk_0 What's the worst thing that can happen if I speak up and lean into a hard, difficult

spk_0 conversation?

spk_0 They go away forever.

spk_0 That's a choice.

spk_0 Say, choice B is, I don't speak up.

spk_0 I get to keep the relationship, but I betrayed myself.

spk_0 Right?

spk_0 It's just that simple.

spk_0 Two shitty choices.

spk_0 It's a double bind in psychology, jargon.

spk_0 All right?

spk_0 And we have to point that out to people.

spk_0 Because that's the bind we get ourselves in when we're scared with other humans talking

spk_0 to them.

spk_0 Okay.

spk_0 Now that we've touched the cost, it's time to go, okay, well, I'm going to have the

spk_0 hard conversation and go for it because I don't want to deal with the cost.

spk_0 But people won't have this hard conversation unless they're in touch with the tremendous

spk_0 pain.

spk_0 They will keep avoiding because it's kind of working for them.

spk_0 Right?

spk_0 They're like, well, I still have a relationship with this person.

spk_0 And even I resent the hell out of them, I still get to work with them or see them every

spk_0 day.

spk_0 And I don't want to break things off and I don't want to turn into a big shit storm

spk_0 here.

spk_0 So I'm just going to stuff it.

spk_0 So people have all kinds of rationalizations, justifications about why they're not speaking

spk_0 up.

spk_0 So it's worthy to explore those.

spk_0 It's worthwhile.

spk_0 But let's say we are persons like, okay, fine.

spk_0 I'll have the hard conversation.

spk_0 Great.

spk_0 Let's come up with a plan.

spk_0 And for people that are bad communicators, this is part of the reason they haven't had

spk_0 the hard conversation in the first place because they don't know how.

spk_0 Because they've tried in the past and didn't go well.

spk_0 And usually people are like, well, I tried that for years.

spk_0 I tried and it's like, I doubt it.

spk_0 Usually it's like people try like one to three times and they get the message.

spk_0 Like the other person reacts, shuts down.

spk_0 It goes really poorly and they're like, oh, I'm never doing that again.

spk_0 That's what people tell themselves.

spk_0 I'm never doing that again.

spk_0 And they never do it again.

spk_0 And they live in resentment.

spk_0 So it hasn't gone well in the past is one of the reasons this is so scary.

spk_0 And they decided unconsciously.

spk_0 Usually they actually didn't make a actual decision.

spk_0 That was conscious.

spk_0 They just decided to not work on themselves and work on becoming a better communicator.

spk_0 We're working on the confidence it takes to communicate difficult things.

spk_0 They didn't do any of that.

spk_0 They avoided the whole mess.

spk_0 They just said, oh, well, I don't have to learn anything if I keep avoiding this hard conversation.

spk_0 I just, I can stay in ignorance and I don't have to apply myself at all.

spk_0 And is what people do, right?

spk_0 That sucks.

spk_0 So we have to point all this out to people and say, yep, okay, you're being kind of entitled here.

spk_0 You want the easy way out.

spk_0 You don't want to do the hard thing.

spk_0 Persons on board though, right?

spk_0 So they finally get a board.

spk_0 Okay, fine.

spk_0 I'll do it.

spk_0 We have to teach them how and we teach them how to communicate effectively.

spk_0 Listen differently.

spk_0 All the things that I teach in my book.

spk_0 How do we listen to someone until they feel understood?

spk_0 How do we speak in a way that a person can hear and digest,

spk_0 even though it will be potentially activating and triggering for them?

spk_0 How do we do that?

spk_0 So we are in the business of skill building if we're a therapist or coach,

spk_0 and we show people how this is how we role model.

spk_0 We demo people write things down.

spk_0 They take notes and they're like, okay, they rehearse it.

spk_0 You it's like you're in the gym doing practice reps and those are role plays.

spk_0 So that's one of the best ways to do this is role play it out.

spk_0 And then you give them feedback.

spk_0 But if you're happened to be a shitty communicator and you don't have hard conversations in your life,

spk_0 are you fit to guide them through hard conversation?

spk_0 If you're not doing it in your own life, no, that's no.

spk_0 So you as the practitioner need to go learn.

spk_0 And get better at this.

spk_0 Okay, and this has nothing to do with perfection.

spk_0 You perfectionistic people.

spk_0 That's such a dumb standard to have.

spk_0 You've got to have a realistic standard, which is I will probably fuck this up and make some mistakes.

spk_0 But I'm going to dammit.

spk_0 I'm going to keep trying until I get better at this.

spk_0 That's kind of the mindset you need.

spk_0 Okay, so you want to lean in, learn how and do it.

spk_0 And one of the things I teach is to lead with vulnerability.

spk_0 Hey person, I'm scared to bring this up.

spk_0 I'm just can we talk?

spk_0 I'm scared to bring this difficult subject up.

spk_0 Will you go there with me?

spk_0 I've been avoiding it.

spk_0 So you take responsibility for how you're scared.

spk_0 You've been avoiding and you're finally ready to talk about it.

spk_0 And then you can ask them, are you willing to hang in there and stay in the conversation with me and not leave?

spk_0 Will you do that?

spk_0 And again, we can always hire outside help if we just do not trust ourselves or the other person.

spk_0 We can hire a facilitator, which is often a therapist or coach type person.

spk_0 We're not hiring a mediator.

spk_0 Okay, mediators are someone else.

spk_0 That's not what we're talking about.

spk_0 A mediator doesn't teach you how to do it differently.

spk_0 There's no lufu going on.

spk_0 There's no validation.

spk_0 It's just what's your side of the story?

spk_0 Okay, what's your side of the story?

spk_0 That's not what we're doing.

spk_0 We need to actually be real here and be impacted by the other person, allow

spk_0 them to be impacted by us.

spk_0 We're in a relationship with them.

spk_0 This is not some person we're trying to get out of our life.

spk_0 You can just do that.

spk_0 You can just cut people out of your life.

spk_0 But this is a person you're probably going to stay in a relationship with at work or at home or in your family.

spk_0 So you want to like preserve what you can here in the most vulnerable, but

spk_0 confident way possible.

spk_0 And then we just lean in and have the conversation.

spk_0 And we can always lead with ownership.

spk_0 My part is, and I can imagine the impact on you was,

spk_0 or if we want to lead with listening first.

spk_0 What you don't want the person to do is feel ambushed by you.

spk_0 But some people will feel ambushed no matter what you do.

spk_0 So that's their problem.

spk_0 But you want to set them up for heads up.

spk_0 I want to talk about something difficult.

spk_0 Are you available?

spk_0 Can we do this next Tuesday at four?

spk_0 Yes, great.

spk_0 Do we need some third party to sit there with us?

spk_0 Because this could get heated.

spk_0 All those things.

spk_0 So when I facilitate hard conversations with couples or business owners,

spk_0 sometimes I'm really in there and sometimes I hang back.

spk_0 It depends on how bad they're screwing it up.

spk_0 Or how well they're doing.

spk_0 You have to make those calls, right?

spk_0 If you're a third person in those environments.

spk_0 And here's what waits on the other side.

spk_0 And then of course, so let's say the hard conversation happened.

spk_0 It didn't go well.

spk_0 The other skill you've got to develop is how to repair.

spk_0 Because it's so important if it goes off the rails, no big deal.

spk_0 It didn't go perfectly.

spk_0 You can repair that.

spk_0 You can say, oops, I screwed up there.

spk_0 I said something inflammatory.

spk_0 I can see that that hurt your feelings.

spk_0 Got it.

spk_0 Thank you for letting me know.

spk_0 It makes sense.

spk_0 You would be mad at me or hurt by that.

spk_0 So when we know how to repair,

spk_0 we have even more confidence going into a hard conversation.

spk_0 Because if it goes south, we can clean it up.

spk_0 Cool.

spk_0 So in the beginning, you might need a third party.

spk_0 Or you want to both be beginners at this and acknowledge that,

spk_0 gosh, we're not great at this.

spk_0 Should we get someone else to help us?

spk_0 Or can we follow a script?

spk_0 Can we follow the outline in Jason's book?

spk_0 Like, what do we need to do to be successful here and get through this?

spk_0 And you have to just decide, do I want to continue to betray myself?

spk_0 Or am I going to start leaning into my life?

spk_0 And we want to push our clients to actually choose consciously what they want to do?

spk_0 Now, I choose to not bring this up.

spk_0 I don't want to deal with the consequences.

spk_0 So that's fine.

spk_0 Actually, I can honor and respect that because you're out in the open about it.

spk_0 Okay.

spk_0 And as we get reps, what I notice happens to people is the heart eventually opens.

spk_0 The walls come down if done well.

spk_0 And many times, we get to the bottom of things and the heart opens.

spk_0 And there's hugging.

spk_0 There's like, oh, my God.

spk_0 I didn't see this was so possible.

spk_0 Wow.

spk_0 I'm so thank you so much for owning what you did to me.

spk_0 Or I feel so relieved now that we're reconnected again.

spk_0 There is unbelievable, incredible feelings that await some of the time on the other side

spk_0 of difficult conversations.

spk_0 But what's going to get you there is two willing people, right?

spk_0 Learning how, developing the curiosity and confidence, developing the skill to repair,

spk_0 choosing people in your life that will stay in the fire with you that won't just give you the

spk_0 finger and run away.

spk_0 You want people in your life, especially a partner, for example, you want

spk_0 you know, difficult conversations should just be like, oh, we as a couple know how to handle this.

spk_0 And we, it's hard, but we always stay in it and we get through it.

spk_0 That can be our commitment, right?

spk_0 Some of you find yourself with people who are not interested in this at all.

spk_0 And they're entitled.

spk_0 They're incredibly entitled and think it should just all magically disappear.

spk_0 Which is just such horseshit.

spk_0 But a lot of people find themselves in those kind of fairy tales.

spk_0 All right.

spk_0 Okay, those are thoughts.

spk_0 Obviously I dive deep into this in relationship mastery in my book.

spk_0 There's tons of places you can learn more.

spk_0 But I wanted to give you a just if this is really if nothing else, this is a reminder

spk_0 to stop avoiding difficult conversations because the cost to you and the other person is incredibly high.

spk_0 And you will create more harm than good, the longer you wait in my experience, right?

spk_0 Okay.

spk_0 Thanks.

spk_0 And take care.

Stop Avoiding Difficult Conversations (Do This Instead) - Jayson Gaddis - 544

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