How to Make Yourself Unbreakable | DJ Shipley

Interactive Transcript

spk_0 I had a lot of emotional stuff happen to me in that second deployment.

spk_0 You know, my idol, Maddie Roberts, I've talked about him a couple times.

spk_0 I really, really hung on to that dude.

spk_0 Like he was my true north, he was the guy.

spk_0 And when he got shot up, when you see it happen, you know, I think that was the closest

spk_0 call for fire mission the entire Iraq war.

spk_0 Like inside of 15 meters, I mean, Corey Mike Mike, my AC 130 gunship, I mean, it was on top

spk_0 of you.

spk_0 A belt head machine gun just chewing us up.

spk_0 Everybody shot up except for me and one other guy and we're all crowded behind this tractor

spk_0 tire, just felt like a victim.

spk_0 Like I felt helpless, you know, I'm getting around, support all over me and at a certain

spk_0 point you just go, I'd rather run back into the front of the singing, get killed with

spk_0 all of them, then be the lone survivor.

spk_0 Welcome to the Huberman Lab podcast where we discuss science and science based tools for

spk_0 everyday life.

spk_0 I'm Andrew Huberman and I'm a professor of neurobiology and ophthalmology at Stanford School

spk_0 of Medicine.

spk_0 My guest today is DJ Shipley.

spk_0 DJ Shipley is a retired Navy SEAL who served for 17 years.

spk_0 Much of that time as a Tier 1 operator, meaning part of an elite highly selective special

spk_0 operation unit within the SEALs.

spk_0 In recent years, DJ has emerged as a top public educator on the topics of how to structure

spk_0 your days to maximize your mindset for sake of physical and mental health, as well as

spk_0 performance in work or school and to best support and build your closest relationships.

spk_0 As you'll soon learn from DJ, there are key points in your day when you can take specific

spk_0 physical steps, including but not limited to physical exercise, to shift your mind away

spk_0 from rumination, distraction and frustration to a state of immense clarity, focus and drive.

spk_0 Through trial and error, DJ has figured out and he shares with us how that process is

spk_0 done and how you can do it too, right down to the details.

spk_0 What he describes goes way beyond a standard morning routine or evening routine and most

spk_0 importantly is accessible to all of us.

spk_0 You also won't hear any cliches or fluff in today's discussion.

spk_0 DJ is very specific about what to do and when and how in order to become the best possible

spk_0 version of yourself.

spk_0 You'll often hear those words out there, how to become the best version of yourself or

spk_0 reach your potential.

spk_0 But what DJ does so beautifully is he explains exactly how to do that.

spk_0 And he shares his story of how he joined and moved through the SEAL teams and the victories,

spk_0 but of course also the immense challenges and losses that he and his teammates experienced.

spk_0 We also discuss addiction, PTSD and depression and new paths for overcoming those.

spk_0 In particular, a new medical treatment I've again followed by DMT and how that's being

spk_0 used to help veterans overcome addiction, PTSD and suicidality.

spk_0 I've paid close attention to that work over the last five years because the brain imaging

spk_0 aspect is being done by my colleague, Dr. Nolan Williams at Stanford.

spk_0 I should mention that the I began DMT process we discuss is not a recreational one.

spk_0 Rather, it's being done as part of clinical trials and dedicated research studies.

spk_0 DJ explains that process firsthand and at the same time I should mention that I began

spk_0 and DMT are still illegal in the United States.

spk_0 They are not FDA approved, so no one should explore their use outside of these clinical

spk_0 trials.

spk_0 However, the FDA is looking seriously at these compounds and approval for them seems

spk_0 quite likely in the next 12 months or so.

spk_0 Today's discussion is one that anybody, male, female, young or old can benefit from.

spk_0 DJ has immense knowledge, he has immense experience, and he has an incredible ability to take what

spk_0 he's learned and turn it into actionable steps so you can improve your mental health,

spk_0 physical health and performance, and become the best possible version of yourself.

spk_0 Before we begin, I'd like to emphasize that this podcast is separate from my teaching

spk_0 and research roles at Stanford.

spk_0 It is, however, part of my desire and effort to bring zero cost to consumer information

spk_0 about science and science-related tools to the general public.

spk_0 In keeping with that theme, today's episode does include sponsors.

spk_0 And now for my discussion with DJ Shipley.

spk_0 DJ Shipley.

spk_0 Welcome.

spk_0 Thanks so much for having me, men.

spk_0 Let's talk about mental health, physical health, and spiritual health, but not all it

spk_0 wants.

spk_0 You talk a lot about, and you post a lot about mental health.

spk_0 But I've noticed that a lot of that takes on a sort of a protocol-y approach where you

spk_0 use physical steps to approach mental health and vice versa.

spk_0 So what's your framework on this thing that we call mental health?

spk_0 I'm not asking you to solve the mental health crisis in one swoop, but when you think

spk_0 about your own mental health, the people close to you, people you've worked with and the

spk_0 teams, how do you approach mental health as a concept and as an actionable thing?

spk_0 I've lived so many different stages of my life.

spk_0 High points and low points and everything in between.

spk_0 At my lowest point, I had no physical connection.

spk_0 I was either downhired with an injury coming back from surgery and then my mental health

spk_0 rapid decline right after that.

spk_0 For someone who never suffered from mental health issues, it's shocking.

spk_0 You feel like you're the only person going through it, especially when you come from a

spk_0 subculture, special operation.

spk_0 Nobody ever talks about it.

spk_0 When you find yourself in that dark room alone, really contemplating some terrible things,

spk_0 it's hard to wrap your head around because you're the only person that's ever gone through

spk_0 it.

spk_0 It had some really good strength coaches and coming back from injuries and the better I

spk_0 got physically, my mental health naturally started to pull out of it.

spk_0 Everything we did was for the group.

spk_0 All my physical attributes, everything I'm training is for the betterment of the group.

spk_0 Now it's the betterment of my family, of my tribe, of whatever I have.

spk_0 I talk about the things stacking up micro winds.

spk_0 My morning routine is structured in a way to where I can do that same routine everywhere

spk_0 I go, everywhere.

spk_0 At any point of the day, I can lock that thing in, but it all starts with an evening routine.

spk_0 When my phone goes off at 5 a.m. and I spring feed out of bed, I know exactly what I'm going

spk_0 to do for the next 12 minutes to put myself in position to not be stressed.

spk_0 I've got to power down my home life and I've just got to think about what's coming next.

spk_0 Blame out the clothes and I before my bottle of water is filled, my pills are out, my toothbrushes

spk_0 out, everything is set.

spk_0 As soon as I get up, by the time I get to making my morning cup of coffee, I've done

spk_0 25 things inside of my control.

spk_0 Do you know off the top of your head what those things are right now that maybe you could

spk_0 just list them off?

spk_0 You said your alarm clock goes off 5 a.m.

spk_0 And that's regardless of when you went to sleep.

spk_0 I'm going to just want to go to sleep, typically.

spk_0 I mean, if I'm out here, I'm on a different time zone and I can change it.

spk_0 But if you get to bed at midnight or you get to bed at 9 p.m. or you get to bed at 2 a.m.,

spk_0 alarm goes off at 5 a.m.

spk_0 You're up.

spk_0 My wife gave me this the other day I came home or read.

spk_0 I didn't walk through the door until 2.30 in the morning and alarm clock goes off at

spk_0 5 and she rolls over and she's like, what are you doing?

spk_0 I'm going to work.

spk_0 And she's like, you can take a day off.

spk_0 No, I'm not taking a day off.

spk_0 This last five days is the first time and as long as I can 20 years that I've actually

spk_0 taken five days of not working out when I had the physical ability to do it.

spk_0 I've never taken five days off because I'm so afraid my mental health will drop.

spk_0 Something will happen if I leave that routine.

spk_0 So I wake up, unplug my phone, shut off the alarm, I walk in, toothpaste on toothbrush,

spk_0 I go to the bathroom while I'm brushing my teeth, spit it out, all the pills I got

spk_0 to take in the morning, vitamin D, all the stuff I take.

spk_0 And then I get dressed, left sock, right sock, right shoe, everything I do, I do it in

spk_0 a very specific order.

spk_0 Even the way I put on my bracelets, if I put them on in the wrong order, I'll stop and

spk_0 I'll de-jock them all and I'll redone them.

spk_0 Just because that's one simple thing, I'm not rushed, I'm not under duress, I'm in

spk_0 control this entire timeline and that way when I get to the kitchen, I don't feel like

spk_0 I'm frantic, where are my keys, where's my wallet, where's my bag, everything's in a system

spk_0 right now to where I can step in that car.

spk_0 I'm not stuck behind a school bus, my car has gas in it, my phone's at 100%.

spk_0 Because we all have been there, every is a normal person, I wake up.

spk_0 My wife once had a 15 minute conversation that puts me behind that school bus that I'm

spk_0 typically not behind, now I'm late for my first meeting, I've got to rush through my

spk_0 workout, I don't have time to take a shower, all that is going to cascade, it's going

spk_0 to put me to be the person I don't want to be when I have to walk into that first meeting.

spk_0 It's like I'm trying to optimize everything that's within my control, so when I step

spk_0 through the threshold, this is a DJ that I'm purposely presenting to you right now under

spk_0 my control.

spk_0 And that really sets the entire framework for the whole day of being in a good headspace.

spk_0 I'm controlling the things that are controllable and the things that I can't control, I don't

spk_0 think about them anymore.

spk_0 I'm blocking out.

spk_0 I love the regimen and your adherence to it.

spk_0 I'm curious about your mindset when the alarm goes off, meaning where is your head?

spk_0 I guess I know you're human and I understand enough about the brain to make an assumption,

spk_0 which is that you don't wake up every morning with the alarm going off at 5, thinking,

spk_0 great, I'm going to get up and just roll right into the day, that there may be times when

spk_0 you consider going into fetal position, it's warm under those covers, but also that

spk_0 your mind, like anyone else, is probably start spinning.

spk_0 It leaps to the past, leaps to the...

spk_0 Even a little more stress than you'd like, a little more lethargy, this kind of thing.

spk_0 Do you purposely stack up two dues so that you stay out of all of that?

spk_0 And if some of that persists as you're brushing your teeth, what's the way of dealing with

spk_0 that?

spk_0 I just keep pushing.

spk_0 I just keep myself in motion the entire time.

spk_0 I talk about dials, not switches a lot with people.

spk_0 It sounds selfish, but I have to be selfish right now in order to be selfless later.

spk_0 So I tell you guys, as soon as that alarm clock goes off, I'm not thinking about my wife,

spk_0 I'm not thinking about my kids, I'm thinking about being as efficient as humanly possible,

spk_0 and I'm trying to hit that gem so I un-rack at 07, the best version of me.

spk_0 And I can't do it if I'm thinking about a fight or an argument.

spk_0 We have it to a wife and I before the kids and this and that, I have to be selfish right

spk_0 now because it's the only block I'm going to have for me to optimize myself because at

spk_0 10 a.m., I'm going to get pulled from 50 different directions.

spk_0 It's the exact same thing when I go home.

spk_0 So now between hours of 10 a.m. and 6 p.m., I'm only thinking about work.

spk_0 I don't think my wife don't think about my kids, I only think about the team and everything

spk_0 we're trying to do.

spk_0 At 6, you can watch and I tell everybody if you would put a hidden camera in my car and

spk_0 break the internet.

spk_0 I do it every day, I slam that car in the park, I put my phone on, do not disturb, I check

spk_0 social, I check all my texts, I'm good, there's no phone call.

spk_0 So I've got a 12 minute drive from door to door.

spk_0 Those 12 minutes I put on Chris Stapleton, something that makes me feel good, it calms me

spk_0 down and I pre-rehearse, everything's going to happen the moment I hit that garage door

spk_0 opener.

spk_0 Really, I do it every single day.

spk_0 I realize it's personal but to the extent that you're willing, maybe share a couple of

spk_0 what you're rehearsing.

spk_0 I pull one of the driveway, I slam it back in park, I check my phone one more time and

spk_0 I tell myself, you're only going to have three hours from 6 to 9 to be the person they

spk_0 need you to be.

spk_0 You've got to be a full-time dad right now, you've got to be a full-time husband and

spk_0 I don't get it right every time.

spk_0 Some days I drag that stuff home with me to hand texting frantically but I really try

spk_0 not to.

spk_0 And before I hit that garage door, I tell myself, they don't know what's going on, they don't

spk_0 know the stress you're at at work, she's had her own day, they've had their own day,

spk_0 I've got a daughter in seventh grade, I've got another one in second grade, we've got

spk_0 to work through this whole thing together and see what version of me do I want to present

spk_0 to them right now.

spk_0 I'm going to walk in bags over my right shoulder, I'm going to clear the threshold and make

spk_0 it a 90 degree turn and there's going to be a seven year old and she's a huge ball of

spk_0 energy.

spk_0 She gets all shake and she runs up me at full blast and I pick her up and shake her

spk_0 kiss her like 100% love taking immediate right in the kitchen.

spk_0 There's my oldest usually even some to four homeworks about to start, give her a kiss,

spk_0 give her a hug, ask her how her day was, straight to the room to see my wife because she's

spk_0 got a, she gets like a 30 minute buffer before she has to go upstairs and walk in with

spk_0 seventh grade homework, check her, what do you need.

spk_0 If you can fold the towels, if you can start dinner, done, boom, boom, boom, boom.

spk_0 So my last interaction in the morning was positive.

spk_0 I left them a positive note, the first interaction you're getting at the end of the day is

spk_0 an positive note in regards to how I'm feeling.

spk_0 If I have to fake it, I'll fake it.

spk_0 I got three hours and if you space out of the course of the five days, I don't have a

spk_0 lot of time to make positive memories just because of work and stress and everything

spk_0 else.

spk_0 I'm trying to maximize those three hours and then when I do, it feels like you can do

spk_0 no wrong.

spk_0 But every night after we finished dinner, me and my wife do a 20 minute walk.

spk_0 10 minutes for her.

spk_0 So since we started, tell me about your day, everything she wants to vent through, everything

spk_0 we had to get caught up on, we had to halfway mark right around this park and then it's my turn

spk_0 for 10 minutes.

spk_0 Average human can walk a mile in 20 minutes, helps your cat in rhythm, helps digestion.

spk_0 I mean, mental clarity, I'm not on my phone, there's no stimulus.

spk_0 I mean, I'm watching the sun set, but now it's 20 minutes just for us to reconnect and

spk_0 we do it every single day.

spk_0 Unless it's a torrential downpour or doing it every single night and our marriage has never

spk_0 been better, my physical health has never been better and then my time with my kids, I

spk_0 can be accountable for every single minute in my day that I maximize that opportunity.

spk_0 No, why?

spk_0 Because I drug that dude home with me from, you know, 2.30 in the afternoon, I drug him

spk_0 all the way home till six.

spk_0 That's not what they need.

spk_0 They don't need a commando, they don't need a business owner, they don't need an entrepreneur,

spk_0 they need a dude that's going to have a tea party right now or guy that's going to talk

spk_0 about how difficult navigating seventh grade is.

spk_0 Like she really needs a husband, it's going to be fully present because I haven't been

spk_0 for the majority of our marriage.

spk_0 I've been gone 300 days out of the year.

spk_0 She really just needs a buddy who's going to help parent.

spk_0 And if I'm not mentally there, I'm never going to get there.

spk_0 So I second this and so where I can be the person, I need to be no matter what threshold

spk_0 I'm walking through.

spk_0 And it's been hugely beneficial for me.

spk_0 Perhaps one of the most underestimated but powerful tools to improve your mental health,

spk_0 your physical performance and your cognitive performance is ensuring you get enough hydration

spk_0 every day.

spk_0 The unfortunate reality however is that tap water often contains contaminants that negatively

spk_0 impact our health.

spk_0 So while we're trying to get great hydration, that can cause serious problems.

spk_0 In fact, a 2020 study by the environmental working group estimated that more than 200

spk_0 million Americans are exposed to PFAS chemicals, also known as forever chemicals through drinking

spk_0 tap water.

spk_0 These forever chemicals are linked to serious health issues, such as hormone disruption,

spk_0 gut microbiome disruption, fertility issues and many other health problems, some of which

spk_0 are just now coming to light.

spk_0 For all these reasons, I was thrilled when I came across Rora water filters and now they're

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spk_0 When an awesome example and the two-does are super impressive,

spk_0 I wonder if we could just explore a little bit of the to-not-does.

spk_0 A lot of what you described, it's clear requires having the phone away.

spk_0 I mean, I could go on and on about phones, but the incoming is incessant, right?

spk_0 And the temptation is really tough to deal with.

spk_0 So when you walk in the door, because you're with family, phone is in the car or it's just shut off.

spk_0 During the day, when you're going about your work,

spk_0 is it understood that if your wife wants to get a hold of you, she can,

spk_0 but that there's a high threshold for that?

spk_0 Because I think a lot of couples get into, you know, like just pinging each other here and there,

spk_0 this and that.

spk_0 Even in business teams, there's a lot of unnecessary communication.

spk_0 I'm fortunate now that my wife actually works inside the business, so she gets it,

spk_0 and she knows that once I lock in, that camera turns on, that microphone goes on,

spk_0 you gotta leave me alone.

spk_0 And I tell people, like, I'm not trained to do this.

spk_0 I'm a normal dude, so I'm really susceptible to negative energy,

spk_0 and they know better.

spk_0 Don't slam me with something negative before I have to turn that microphone on,

spk_0 because I'm not going to be able to compartmentalize it all the way.

spk_0 I need to be the best version of me right now, so wait till I'm done and then

spk_0 deliver the bad news.

spk_0 And she's the same way.

spk_0 She's, she's an absolute gangster.

spk_0 And she knows, she's like, when you get done today, we have to talk them.

spk_0 What is it?

spk_0 She says, nothing bad.

spk_0 It'll definitely be something bad, but she doesn't even give me an inkling,

spk_0 because she knows it'll rob me a bandwidth.

spk_0 She's like, go do what you do.

spk_0 As soon as you get done, we'll talk.

spk_0 And on that 20 minute walk, she'll drop it.

spk_0 But now we're here.

spk_0 I'm in a clear headspace.

spk_0 I've had a productive day.

spk_0 We've had a great 10 minutes end of this.

spk_0 Now he met the bad news.

spk_0 The last 10 minutes we'll solve it together.

spk_0 But not get on that social media first thing in the morning.

spk_0 I used to be the guy I'd roll over.

spk_0 I immediately open up Instagram and I'm checking it.

spk_0 What are the comments?

spk_0 How's the posting do and how's this?

spk_0 How's that?

spk_0 You'll stay there for 40 minutes.

spk_0 And then if you see something negative, I'll ride that.

spk_0 I'll wear that jacket all day long.

spk_0 I can't get it away from me.

spk_0 So I don't take a Zoom call.

spk_0 I don't take a phone call.

spk_0 There's nothing that happens inside of my orbit

spk_0 before 10 a.m.

spk_0 From 7 to 10.

spk_0 That's my morning block.

spk_0 I've got the whole team in there.

spk_0 We do finish from 7 to 9.

spk_0 I make them all do a 20 minute walk.

spk_0 I make the whole team protein shakes.

spk_0 I take a shower and at 10 a.m. I walk out.

spk_0 Hit me with it.

spk_0 What do we got to do?

spk_0 We're going to range and my training.

spk_0 And we shoot in content.

spk_0 What are we doing right now?

spk_0 You have full bandwidth and toilet lever.

spk_0 And if I run till midnight, we run till midnight.

spk_0 But you have both barrels of me at 100%

spk_0 because I've controlled that entire morning routine.

spk_0 And it's been the best thing that's ever happened to us.

spk_0 But you've got to be consistent.

spk_0 It's like everything else.

spk_0 What's the best diet?

spk_0 The one you'll stick to.

spk_0 And that morning routine has been the biggest game changer

spk_0 I've had.

spk_0 That's awesome.

spk_0 I feel like the teams I've been fortunate to know

spk_0 and work with some folks from the teams

spk_0 seem to have what I call kind of an unconscious genius

spk_0 like as a whole, as a system.

spk_0 When we can talk about buds, we can talk about selection

spk_0 for tier one stuff.

spk_0 We can talk about any of that and we will.

spk_0 But it seems to me that a lot of the practices

spk_0 that are built up in the teams and in team guys

spk_0 who are successful when they transition out

spk_0 are built around this notion.

spk_0 I just call unconscious genius

spk_0 where they weren't thinking about like,

spk_0 what's the underlying neural circuitry or this and that.

spk_0 And everything you describe, by the way,

spk_0 is extremely actionable for anybody.

spk_0 I love that you told us and I'm going to underscore this

spk_0 highlight it and bold it right now.

spk_0 Is that doesn't matter if you went to bed at 2.30 a.m.

spk_0 or you went to bed at midnight,

spk_0 you're getting up at the same time.

spk_0 It's actually critical for keeping sleep rhythms healthy

spk_0 and one thing from the literature I'll just share

spk_0 is that it's clear that if people have the same wake up time

spk_0 each day that whatever sleep they get prior

spk_0 to that wake up time, you get the maximum amount

spk_0 of growth hormone release that's possible,

spk_0 which is of course crucial for recovery,

spk_0 not just growing muscles, but recovery.

spk_0 Et cetera.

spk_0 So there's that.

spk_0 You guys came to that.

spk_0 There's that kind of,

spk_0 you didn't need to know the science.

spk_0 You just arrived at it.

spk_0 But also the brain is so context dependent

spk_0 and throughout your description,

spk_0 I'm hearing that, you know,

spk_0 if there's you'll wear that jacket all day long,

spk_0 like it can pull you in.

spk_0 I mean, you're a strong minded individual.

spk_0 You know, at a control your own behavior clearly,

spk_0 but you are susceptible like anybody else.

spk_0 And I was thinking of mental states as,

spk_0 you know, we can either be like a ball bearing on a flat surface

spk_0 where that ball bearing can go anywhere with even

spk_0 just the slightest tilt or even a breeze,

spk_0 versus, you know, little dimples in that service

spk_0 where it can kind of reside,

spk_0 but if you get blown out or pushed out easily.

spk_0 And ultimately what we're all seeking

spk_0 is to drop like a ball bearing into a trench

spk_0 and rage bait and numbing out,

spk_0 which are the two kind of core features of social media,

spk_0 except there's this other opportunity to learn.

spk_0 I feel like those are drop us immediately

spk_0 into that trench.

spk_0 And so I feel like our brain wants to be the ball bearing

spk_0 at the bottom of that trench,

spk_0 but it's tempting to not do the work to get there.

spk_0 And so there are things in the world,

spk_0 highly processed, highly palatable foods,

spk_0 you know, certain aspects of social media

spk_0 because I don't think all of it is unhealthy

spk_0 that provide that opportunity to drop into that trench.

spk_0 And so clearly, the unconscious genius here

spk_0 is that you arrived at,

spk_0 it seems an understanding that you're very context dependent,

spk_0 you know, it's not that you're so robust internally

spk_0 that you can throw anything your way.

spk_0 It's exactly because you're, if I may,

spk_0 you're not that robust internally

spk_0 that you understand the brain,

spk_0 that you can't let anything come your way,

spk_0 but if you set the context internally

spk_0 then the rest of your day is maybe not a breeze,

spk_0 but it's workable.

spk_0 And you'll stay that ball bearing in the trench

spk_0 that you're determining.

spk_0 Do I have that right?

spk_0

spk_0 Okay, so I think this is important

spk_0 because I think a lot of people hear about

spk_0 special operators and high performers

spk_0 and their structure and their routine

spk_0 and they assume they wake up and they're like,

spk_0 into the day, nothing's gonna bother me.

spk_0 It's because things have the potential to bother you

spk_0 that you have to structure that way.

spk_0 Okay, for me that's very helpful to hear.

spk_0 And I think you're also defining the difference

spk_0 between an artist, I know a lot of artists

spk_0 who need it, they kind of float about their day,

spk_0 they're two hours late to things

spk_0 and then the stuff emerges, right?

spk_0 I mean, I can tell you stories about people

spk_0 in Los Angeles and how meeting times

spk_0 and I'm a little guilty of this,

spk_0 but it's incredible the way that things just kind of

spk_0 orbit around certain people.

spk_0 But then they bring the magic and so the world

spk_0 continues to orbit around them versus an operator.

spk_0 And I feel like everything you described

spk_0 is like the essence of being an operator.

spk_0 You're approaching your civilian life

spk_0 the same way presumably you did your operating life.

spk_0 So let's say you have a morning

spk_0 where something goes wrong.

spk_0 There's no toothpaste and the toothbrush or something

spk_0 more serious like your wife really needs to talk about

spk_0 something maybe she's so, you know,

spk_0 you know, together that never happens.

spk_0 Will you for go those minutes or do you make or how

spk_0 do you deal with that?

spk_0 Situation really dictates when I was in I wouldn't.

spk_0 I'd wake up before everybody else is in there and it's

spk_0 a lot of stuff I tell other than you guys

spk_0 and special operations like if you sacrifice your sleep

spk_0 when it doesn't affect anyone else you can really

spk_0 lay the foundation for greatness.

spk_0 Right?

spk_0 Your first four years don't rush to make your girlfriend

spk_0 don't make your wife don't have a kid don't get a dog

spk_0 just focus on being a green beret.

spk_0 Focus on being a Navy seal and just do that.

spk_0 Then when that girlfriend turns in a fiance

spk_0 you can have the bandwidth to do them both.

spk_0 It's very hard to do that job, you know,

spk_0 build that build that boat with the high seas

spk_0 and now you're dragging your wife into it.

spk_0 It's hard to do.

spk_0 But you know situation dictates if it's something I really

spk_0 have to solve we really have to solve it but she knows

spk_0 no matter what I'm unwracking it's zero seven.

spk_0 I'm not missing us for you.

spk_0 I'm not missing from the else because she knows

spk_0 what to when to happen.

spk_0 So she'll either grab me a lunch.

spk_0 Hey, do you have a block here we can talk for sure.

spk_0 Well maybe start the initial conversation.

spk_0 If it starts going south or anything it's going to take

spk_0 long I'll look at my watch.

spk_0 I gotta go I got 12 minutes.

spk_0 Me either she's like okay we'll catch up a lunch.

spk_0 Cool and we'll go.

spk_0 I can't miss morning movement.

spk_0 I can't do it.

spk_0 That will ruin my day.

spk_0 And if I'm rushed through morning movement if somebody

spk_0 comes in somebody beats on the door and they're like hey

spk_0 we were in the neighborhood just want to come see you

spk_0 can we talk for 20 minutes no you can't no.

spk_0 I'm sorry and I know it sounds bad you can't because

spk_0 I know what happens if I miss this day and I'm not

spk_0 willing to take the chance on you right now you can

spk_0 wait an hour wait on done.

spk_0 But it's hard you know and now we've kind of restructured

spk_0 the whole day to where I can get my time in the morning

spk_0 and I can leave with just enough time to see my kids

spk_0 wake up now they're pouring cereal so now I get that

spk_0 little dopamine hit of seeing them and I kick off

spk_0 their morning a positive way.

spk_0 I'm doing red by therapy in the morning I'm still going

spk_0 to unwrack at 07 I'm still getting up at 5.

spk_0 But now I'm just in the house getting everything processed.

spk_0 I'm going to leave on my terms and that way they get

spk_0 to see me first thing in the morning and we get 3 hours

spk_0 at night well if I get 30 minutes in the morning.

spk_0 Stacked over the course of a year that's a huge difference.

spk_0 It took me to restructured the entire day with the whole

spk_0 team is also on that exact same schedule.

spk_0 It's not just me it's not just my world me business

spk_0 partners coal and everybody else every who does that

spk_0 morning block of fitness that's why I've been pushing

spk_0 this whole time and if you look at anybody in the

spk_0 military anybody in fire department anybody in special

spk_0 operations and military in general everybody's day

spk_0 always starts with fitness when you're in bootcamp you

spk_0 wake up you do a workout and then you eat when you go

spk_0 into buds you wake up you work out essentially all day

spk_0 long go to sleep.

spk_0 It's the same thing when you get to the seal team you do

spk_0 the same thing everybody wakes up everybody does fitness

spk_0 the very first thing and then we start our day.

spk_0 It's been really successful why would I ever break

spk_0 that you see guys when they transition out to get away

spk_0 from the game a bunch of weight they started drinking.

spk_0 You working out five days a week no why you've been

spk_0 doing it since you were 17 years old why would you break

spk_0 it now why yeah why do you think that that happens.

spk_0 I think guys use excuses injuries limitations black and

spk_0 motivation like all there's no reason for me to be in shape

spk_0 longevity of life.

spk_0 Everybody says I take a bullet my kids.

spk_0 You won't lose 40 pounds for you won't prolong life if you

spk_0 think you're a real asset to your family why wouldn't you

spk_0 try to maximize that time.

spk_0 So I look at them out it doesn't take a whole lot like you

spk_0 don't have to be David Goggins you have to run a hundred

spk_0 miles a day you can wake up and do a 20 minute walk every

spk_0 single day and you'll be better off or you grab a set of

spk_0 kettlebells 30 minutes in your garage that is something

spk_0 every single day that makes you exponentially better just

spk_0 to the repetition of being there being present being a little

spk_0 selfish right now so you can be selfish later.

spk_0 So for me if I don't get that workout in and

spk_0 everybody's got stuff going on I do too.

spk_0 If I don't get that block of fitness and I will think about

spk_0 that all day long.

spk_0 Well I think about it for weeks we go back the next time we

spk_0 hit that muscle group I don't get the same numbers I thought

spk_0 I would well that's because I took Monday off.

spk_0 I'm never going to put myself in that position.

spk_0 I don't have to have to excuse so I just set the foundation I

spk_0 lay it down I stand there on a piece of paper that's what I'm

spk_0 doing.

spk_0 I'm not compromising on it.

spk_0 And it's been it's been great for us.

spk_0 That's awesome.

spk_0 I mean as somebody who got into resistance training in his

spk_0 teens and and running I confess over the years I felt some

spk_0 guilt around working out because in my community of

spk_0 scientists I mean now I have a much broader community you go

spk_0 to meetings everyone sitting all day and eating bad food and

spk_0 then you know and then it was happy hour.

spk_0 I was never much of a drinker but I would participate a bit

spk_0 until eventually I just stopped drinking entirely and

spk_0 occasionally I would sneak off during some of the I'll just

spk_0 be honest that the weak talks I was like I've seen this person

spk_0 speak before I'm going to get a workout in and only once did

spk_0 I ever run into a colleague in the gym at one of these places

spk_0 and we both were like it was like getting caught doing something

spk_0 bad.

spk_0 But then the years went by and I saw my colleagues start to die.

spk_0 I saw my colleagues start to get sick.

spk_0 I saw my colleagues start to resemble melted candles and

spk_0 these were people that had a lot of robustness and they also

spk_0 had a lot to offer and families and friends and so I think

spk_0 nowadays people think about physical fitness a little bit

spk_0 differently they understand it's an investment and therefore

spk_0 it's beneficial to the people around you but I still see a lot

spk_0 of people kind of couch it especially with respect to anything

spk_0 that relates to muscle it's kind of selfish and narcissistic

spk_0 and this kind of thing and I think it's so important that

spk_0 people understand the mental health benefits but also the

spk_0 benefits that it can bring the people in your life and not

spk_0 just longevity but just the person that it brings you really

spk_0 understand yourself you know I mean the back of my mind I'm

spk_0 thinking about you know the Oracle know thyself it's like so

spk_0 important if you don't get that workout you you're going to have

spk_0 to force out being best husband best dad best teammate and

spk_0 if you do get that workout they still get that best dad

spk_0 everything but it's it's that much more genuine and and it

spk_0 and it comes it probably is in abundance one of the things

spk_0 that nobody ever talks about is your body awareness when you

spk_0 do fitness for a long time 50 years old you've been doing

spk_0 fitness for a very long time you are so in tune with that

spk_0 vessel that when something does pop up you identify it

spk_0 right away when you don't you like I back kind of hurts

spk_0 where you don't know I'm in tune with that thing so well

spk_0 I walk into a doctor like taking needle three inches down

spk_0 rotate over 45 degrees and that's where it is like okay

spk_0 this is it I'm so in tune with it so when anything pops up I

spk_0 can diagnose it I can walk in and give them actual feedback

spk_0 what's happening I'm not just sitting on the count

spk_0 all day long just like I'm my neck kind of hurts no I know

spk_0 exactly what it is I'm doing a full diagnostic approach

spk_0 the entire day and that's why I've got Vernon I mean he's

spk_0 the best drink coach in the world and if I wouldn't have

spk_0 that guy I would be I mean he's probably back in the dead

spk_0 more times and I can count but it's five days a week I mean

spk_0 he's in there every day so if I walk in and I've got a slight

spk_0 limp on my left side he's like hey my man come over what is

spk_0 that and I was like I had nothing's Bruce Hill yeah I just

spk_0 know it was a Bruce Hill it's like I watch that broad jump on

spk_0 Friday like you laying the little funky I want to see if it's

spk_0 gonna mess with you he ideas that I did I just wouldn't

spk_0 get a say anything okay what are you gonna do about it right

spk_0 me pro act instead of reactive but that's because you're

spk_0 chipping away and you know you're understanding yourself

spk_0 so well because you are constantly in tune with your body

spk_0 and people just forget about like why aren't you sleeping or

spk_0 I had caffeine at four o'clock oh I'm accountable for

spk_0 everything I put in my body and then everything comes out of

spk_0 me the gym's just one of the methods really ties them all

spk_0 together for me the body awareness piece I think is

spk_0 something that we should also underscore a bit I think

spk_0 one thing that happens if people don't develop body

spk_0 awareness is that they don't learn the difference between

spk_0 something that hurts and an injury a few years ago right

spk_0 before going on Kim Haines's podcast where you carry that

spk_0 rock I was about to say you make you carry the rock you don't

spk_0 have to you know carry the rock is things have 72 pounds

spk_0 slippery it's muddy thousand feet of elevation and people

spk_0 do it right you can do it but I popped a hamstring on the

spk_0 hamstring chrome machine like a couple days before but I

spk_0 didn't pop pop it like it didn't rave you know unravel up

spk_0 the up the tendon so I was like I'm just not gonna talk

spk_0 about it I'm not gonna say anything I'm not gonna because

spk_0 that's gonna create its own thing I was like I'm hurt it

spk_0 hurt but I'm not injured and knowing that line is really

spk_0 important because if you are injured it'd be the stupidest

spk_0 thing in the world to carry that rock up the hill right

spk_0 you end up out for six months potentially or four months I

spk_0 had years ago a back pain kind of sciatica thing and I couldn't

spk_0 stand up and I actually was online it was Instagram and I have

spk_0 no business affiliation of this kid but there was a I think

spk_0 is a chiropractor he has a cell called rehab fix and he

spk_0 convinced me that what I need to do is some like up dog things

spk_0 looks like you're kind of like humping the floor you know

spk_0 your pelvis is down and you're pushing up and you repeat

spk_0 those it's kind of like like lizard pushups you know and then

spk_0 against the wall if you can't actually do that from the floor

spk_0 within three days it resolved itself and I was thinking about

spk_0 pain meds which I don't like to take in fact I avoid them

spk_0 entirely see me but I can have to have surgery I mean I could

spk_0 not stand up I can move I can do it and and I realized

spk_0 then I was like okay the line between hurt and truly injured

spk_0 is often kind of blurry and you need to be able to work through

spk_0 that space and you think about this and it through one lens

spk_0 and it sounds like a selfish thing oh it's all about being

spk_0 able to work out more you think about it through another

spk_0 lens it's you know people who think they're injured or who

spk_0 are in pain and don't resolve that are very difficult to

spk_0 be around very difficult I've been that person it's just

spk_0 everything great song you know and male female young or old

spk_0 people now you know I talk about their neck or they sleep

spk_0 bright and I think being able to suck stuff up is really great

spk_0 it's also important to know when you have a real issue and so

spk_0 the body awareness thing I think is it is a gift to oneself

spk_0 you can avoid a lot of costs a lot of unnecessary medical

spk_0 interventions you can know when it's time to take action

spk_0 with proper medical intervention but also it really allows

spk_0 you to be in life with people without being the person

spk_0 that's always complaining about stuff is just difficult I

spk_0 think a lot of people who are difficult are in pain and

spk_0 they don't know how to resolve that pain and they think they

spk_0 have a problem with pain so then they take pain medication

spk_0 and that's a whole cycle so I just you know want to underscore

spk_0 that kind of where we're headed here it seems again and

spk_0 again is with you know what seems selfish is actually one of

spk_0 the most selfless things you can do let's talk about what you

spk_0 call unwracking at 07 to your operator former zero and

spk_0 operator is the lingo so that I'm guessing is that unwracking

spk_0 the weight that's when the workout starts phone is off phone

spk_0 tall because we run an app on it okay we have burning

spk_0 griffin you're not looking at text messages no you're not

spk_0 shooting selfies of your cabs and biceps right I point that out

spk_0 and so semi just because I was joke that the first rep of

spk_0 every set now seems to be guys in the gym taking pictures

spk_0 of themselves last rep of every set seems to be guys taking

spk_0 pictures of themselves so 07 so what's that workout look like

spk_0 you're doing it five days a week I know it's going to be

spk_0 different for different people but you have this program that

spk_0 I really want to explore with you today about how to measure

spk_0 progress and set standards and meet new standards higher

spk_0 standards what does that work out look like for you so I

spk_0 linked up with Vernon right when I was going to medically

spk_0 retired on 2019 I came back to my gnarly shoulder injury I

spk_0 blew it at a dislocation it came through my armpit shredded

spk_0 out everything and I went from about two 15 to about 180 pounds

spk_0 got stuck in a rehab clinic enough in Bethesda Maryland for 31

spk_0 days inpatient and I came out like death warmed over worst

spk_0 up ever been in my life worst my mental health has ever been

spk_0 I did not want to play the game anymore and Navy

spk_0 Seal Foundation hooked you up with this uh physical rehabilitation

spk_0 program in Virginia Beach ran by a former seal and Vernon

spk_0 was the lead strain condition coach and he was my coach and

spk_0 we walked in we did full body assessments and what's

spk_0 interesting about him is he took all your limitations in

spk_0 develop concepts and movements to establish confidence in

spk_0 that area so when I came back you know day one he's like okay

spk_0 let's try to hang from the bar I looked right at him no he's

spk_0 like what no I'm not hanging from that bar I'm done like I've

spk_0 done I've done more pull-ups than most people on the planet

spk_0 my pull-up days are done then like I'm not doing it again he

spk_0 is you gotta trust me what's not gonna happen on day one

spk_0 slowly but surely I mean I mean he's at the point where he's

spk_0 holding my knees I can't even extend my arm overhead like

spk_0 I'm that's humbling I forgot that for a guy that when it was a

spk_0 tier one operator that's humbling I was so bound up by fear

spk_0 that it was gonna come because that was my first shoulder

spk_0 surgery and if you've never had one shoulder surgery is the

spk_0 worst rehab I've ever had and I've had a lot of them the

spk_0 shoulder rehab was brutal and I didn't want to pop and I'd

spk_0 extend and I couldn't do and I couldn't do and he's like you just

spk_0 gotta trust me man like doctor cleared you the anchors of

spk_0 set everything is there but you cannot go through the rest of

spk_0 your life like this he's like you're not even 40 you said you

spk_0 want to go another 40 years without doing a pull-up you're

spk_0 gonna have to trust me keep picking up by the legs I put my

spk_0 arm under and he'd slowly but surely start to extend me

spk_0 down until we got full range of motion and we did that for days

spk_0 and weeks then we went to a band and we took the band off I

spk_0 just want you to hang now we're going to focus on going back

spk_0 out and we built back to the planet I can do sets of 25

spk_0 pull-ups now you're you're because I'm your weight which is

spk_0 what right now you're I'm at two 15 your six one two 15

spk_0 and you put you doing sets of 20 at one twenty five non-kip pull-up

spk_0 yeah and it's all bouncing back from him but the whole

spk_0 program we did you know because I'm I'm not a unicorn by any

spk_0 mains but I've had all the injuries that everybody else has

spk_0 had I've had double hip surgery had double shoulder surgery

spk_0 if I had my abdomen blown through a couple times I mean I've

spk_0 had them all I've had thumbs I've had a rebuild and

spk_0 blown through I mean yeah everything when I got electrocuted

spk_0 it blew out everything and we had to rebuild that entire

spk_0 thing so all the guys that are in this process if you're a

spk_0 swatheam a fireman on a seal team anybody in between we've

spk_0 all got injuries to become limitations and we just avoid

spk_0 them you can't avoid them forever and this program is

spk_0 designed to get you back in shape and it grows with you

spk_0 as you go so every single week your chase and numbers and

spk_0 week before and pushing on the days you don't have it on the

spk_0 days you wake up and you're bound up just lacking motivation

spk_0 we're going with 100% of what we have to offer that might be

spk_0 75% I'm giving 100% of the 75 I have today but Monday's a

spk_0 poll day from the floor usually trap bar dead lifts and we

spk_0 do those because of all the injuries I've got a really long

spk_0 torso it puts my back at a weird precarious situation so

spk_0 we do trap bar dead lifts we do those a lot of pull-up work a

spk_0 lot of grip work a lot of core stability stuff Tuesday's a

spk_0 press day heavy upper body bench and climb that kind of

spk_0 stuff Wednesdays and upper body lower body disassociation so

spk_0 we get the upper body moving in one direction lower body move

spk_0 in the other a lot of example of that we'll do a lot of

spk_0 banded work will drop down to a knee like almost in a shooting

spk_0 position and we'll do cross body pulls with bands resistance

spk_0 training but just you know interpretation stuff and sort of

spk_0 anti-rotation stuff yeah on that day we'll do plyo stuff

spk_0 box jumps height distance and broad jump that kind of stuff

spk_0 farmers carry walks all the stuff just trying to connect all the

spk_0 dots Thursday is the most brutal leg day you've ever had and

spk_0 it's amazing we got belt squat machine so anybody who walks in

spk_0 regardless of injuries limitations you have we have equipment

spk_0 to accommodate that and we say brutal leg day it's just I have

spk_0 a belt squad I love that thing I love throwing a lot of weight

spk_0 on that thing it's nice it doesn't load the spine up but

spk_0 yeah it's a I like to think it's brutal can you describe

spk_0 are you talking about like an hour and a half two hours of

spk_0 usually for seven to nine low weight high weight pretty high

spk_0 repetitions you know so high weight high repetitions trying

spk_0 to yeah always trying to push but a lot of single leg

spk_0 movements Bulgarian split squats mean a lot of lunges a lot of

spk_0 lunges with heavy weight 70 pounds in each hand for me that's

spk_0 a lot of weight so not calf raises leg curls no but on these

spk_0 some days we'll do a feel good day like some days will come in

spk_0 he'll take a pulse of the whole room and he'll go we're all

spk_0 gonna hit the same muscle groups we're just gonna do it in a

spk_0 more traditional so we're gonna do hamstring curls leg

spk_0 extensions we're gonna do belt squats we're gonna do pulsing

spk_0 lunges really just pump the blood flow and just chase a

spk_0 really good pump everybody loves doing that and Fridays

spk_0 really it's a feel good day it's an arm day we'll do some

spk_0 shoulders and accessory work you know and then we added

spk_0 and sprint in between probably two to three days a week

spk_0 you know 200 meter repeats 300 meter repeats

spk_0 we've done where in the workout in between sets at the end

spk_0 at the end yeah we always save it at the end and we always

spk_0 did that with military to always ends with a run and I've

spk_0 tried every combination doing sprints you know pre and

spk_0 post and it really just stops the workout for me yeah

spk_0 paulva set swollen you know the paulva sets on satin

spk_0 that chair right where you're at now and said you know if

spk_0 if your goal is hypertrophy and you're gonna come into a

spk_0 pumping workout doesn't really matter if you do cardio

spk_0 first or last but if you're gonna if you're serious about

spk_0 strength and performance in form that do your cardio after

spk_0 if at all you know because a lot of times those kettlebell

spk_0 workouts or some of these leg workouts they're not

spk_0 quote unquote cardio but they definitely get heart rate up

spk_0 in a serious way so on Wednesday if we're doing a sprint

spk_0 workout it might be 10 by 40 50 meter sprints right nothing

spk_0 crazy we'll do that at the very beginning get the fast

spk_0 switch muscle flyers going and then we'll do whatever the

spk_0 normal Wednesday workout is then we go to the flat range

spk_0 every Wednesday so we train we bring him out to so all

spk_0 the stance the grip the presentation everything we talk

spk_0 about the tactical setting he's there with us so when I

spk_0 talk about flexing your right glute adds stability to a

spk_0 stable shooting platform he's there driving home this is

spk_0 why it's important think big toe down drive your heel down

spk_0 so mean he's much of a coaches I am on the flat range and

spk_0 but he can connect to dot so well that's why I love him

spk_0 he's not gonna let you take that limitation and then

spk_0 live it forever you don't want to be like that and it

spk_0 doesn't help these bigger stronger faster than everybody

spk_0 else so you've always got a good lifting buddy to kind of

spk_0 chase he always pushes you but he's so good at navigating

spk_0 human terrain because some days I'll walk in and whatever's

spk_0 happened over the week he'll see me in the morning he'll

spk_0 look at me like how we hold no 100% yeah yeah come over here

spk_0 what's going on I'll talk to him he's like we'll shake it all

spk_0 out we've got two hours here just us nothing else matters

spk_0 but just focus on this and I find myself pacing a lot so

spk_0 in between sets I'll block out everything else I'm not

spk_0 thinking about social not thinking about my wife not

spk_0 thinking about the business I'm thinking about putting

spk_0 myself in the best mental spot to pull that off the floor

spk_0 at 100% with no distractions and I think that's why I like

spk_0 it so much because it allows me to isolate my thoughts

spk_0 nothing else matter you don't matter this doesn't matter

spk_0 just that movement let me get to that the best of my ability

spk_0 set it down recog walk around get ready for the next one

spk_0 here we go eight reps I'm gonna put so much intent

spk_0 behind this pull that if I get eight or 12 it doesn't

spk_0 matter every single one is all out and you're doing eight

spk_0 talks about it intensity is what really drives and I really

spk_0 try to drive and 10 behind everything I do know and yeah

spk_0 he's a huge man I can't I can't tell you how many times

spk_0 he's brought me back I mean the worst injuries you can

spk_0 imagine and he's there every single time and I think that's

spk_0 why so many people get on with it's they see the injuries

spk_0 you've gone through and it's like well you can still perform

spk_0 on a high level only because I'm I don't want to say I'm

spk_0 even ego driven I've been so ingrained in sitting with

spk_0 routine that doesn't matter what entries have had I mean

spk_0 I come out and we got pictures me in there double slings

spk_0 like when I got electrocuted double slings I can't even I

spk_0 can't even tie my shoes he's tying my shoes like he's

spk_0 putting the belt squad on me I'm squatting down he's

spk_0 clipping it in he's unwrapping the entire thing like

spk_0 he's my guy I tell us his first and last name burning Griffith

spk_0 and you met him when you were injured right and he's a

spk_0 former operator as well he's not so his business partner

spk_0 was a former operator he was actually the Air Force and

spk_0 transition dial got a strength conditioning all his

spk_0 calls and he's got such an interesting look to mobility

spk_0 impact and the high level athletes that come through him

spk_0 and that's really what it is he gets big guys tricked in

spk_0 and doing mobility and liking it because nobody wants to

spk_0 do mobility it's not a sexy thing to do I mean we get

spk_0 first round draft picks that are pouring through that gym

spk_0 all week long and you see him because it's the truth like

spk_0 we're trying to keep you at a super high level is long as

spk_0 humanly possible damage guy placing NFL three years

spk_0 but I'm trying to keep you in effort 12 how are we going to do

spk_0 it you have to maintain that vessel at a super high level

spk_0 because all these young kids are trying to knock you off the

spk_0 team and then the reality of the sport is trying to knock

spk_0 you off the team as well so we got to keep you really really

spk_0 mobile and healthy and I've never seen anybody that can

spk_0 connect thoughts about a mega he's an absolute life saver

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spk_0 to three hundred fifty dollars the way you describe him and

spk_0 your interactions with him it almost takes on a sort of a

spk_0 mythical like quality I mean like we could be talking about a

spk_0 movie but that but this is real and we'll talk about just how

spk_0 real it is with some very real things have happened to you by

spk_0 virtue of the high risk high consequence career that you

spk_0 undertook but you know when you hear about this person who's

spk_0 able to bring back a high performer and then get him to exceed

spk_0 his previous notions of what he could do and under conditions

spk_0 of deras and hopelessness it's you know this is real life though

spk_0 this is not this is in star wars this is real life and so

spk_0 without ever having met him you know I can feel the respect

spk_0 and the admiration and the gratitude you have for him and I'm

spk_0 sure everyone else can too so this is the stuff of mythology

spk_0 but it's real so here's what I know about you you live in Virginia

spk_0 Beach at one point you were interested in skateboarding

spk_0 and perturken skateboarding at some point you decided to

spk_0 become a Navy seal at some point you got electrocuted fill

spk_0 in the blacks for us yeah man I was born in a senior California

spk_0 my dad was a seal my mom was in a Navy so when my dad graduated

spk_0 my mom was nine months pregnant with me so his whole first

spk_0 four years at you know the west coast seal teams I was one of

spk_0 the only kids there so kind of grew up in the culture

spk_0 you know really ingrained into it my first car not a

spk_0 yeah my first bottle I'm wearing a seal team one onesie I mean

spk_0 you literally were raised on Coronado yeah so I did that we

spk_0 moved to the east coast you get transition over the east coast

spk_0 I grew up the rest of my time there fell in love with skateboarding

spk_0 that's all I wanted to do I wanted to go pro I can do a fight

spk_0 with the old man around 15 years old something like that

spk_0 and he signed up for summer school to graduate early so I

spk_0 graduated at 17 hit delayed entry program joining a V a month

spk_0 later was that a contentious interaction I mean I mean

spk_0 skateboarding was clearly not the right career for you I mean

spk_0 I'm sure you would have done exceedingly well there but having

spk_0 grown up a bit in that culture and also knowing a bit about

spk_0 the culture you eventually decided on you know it's hard

spk_0 to say which one is you know the better career choice one

spk_0 is definitely more life threatening which is that in many

spk_0 ways but you just said okay like you're a Navy seal you want

spk_0 me to be a Navy seal so I'm gonna I'm gonna hang it up it was

spk_0 always in a back your mind like that was always what you thought

spk_0 you were going to do but at 15 years old in your mind you can

spk_0 do both you're like oh I can be a professional skateboarder

spk_0 and then I can be a Navy seal later you don't realize what it

spk_0 actually takes to do it even though you grow up in the culture so

spk_0 when that happened you know the towers had just fell I was

spk_0 17 years old delayed entry program straight out Coronado

spk_0 got through seal training came back to the east coast where I've

spk_0 been essentially my whole life and yeah

spk_0 joining the Indian 2002 and I got medically retired in 2019

spk_0 right around 17 years think it was 16 years and like 10 months

spk_0 something like that can ask you about buds a lot of people have

spk_0 heard of buds and yeah they understand that it has a hell

spk_0 weak with minimal if any sleep you know maybe an hour or two

spk_0 tops but probably not even that how hard was buds relative to

spk_0 other things that you did in the teams you know I've heard

spk_0 people say it was the hardest thing they ever did I've heard

spk_0 some people say it was extremely hard but not nearly as

spk_0 difficult as like some aspect of like guys who hate the jungle

spk_0 and humidity or like that was worse and you never know if people

spk_0 are joking around I mean did you learn a lot in buds about

spk_0 yourself if you make it through buds you can do anything it is

spk_0 such a brutal program and I just I have weak just secured and I

spk_0 saw a bunch of guys took about the dinner the other night and I

spk_0 was explaining to a group of civilians that were out there

spk_0 with my parents like you guys all see it every single person

spk_0 does that pipeline it's not just buds it's you know the

spk_0 cue course for Dream Brays it's rip for the Rangers Marsox

spk_0 selection every single kid that's doing that selection program

spk_0 is the biggest deal in his hometown the biggest thing in his

spk_0 high school everybody knows he's going in the amount of external

spk_0 pressure it's riding on that kid unless you've done it you have

spk_0 no idea you just don't it's like playing D1 College ball

spk_0 everyone in your family is expecting you to be a pro they're

spk_0 expecting you to be any NFL and if you don't get drafted

spk_0 it's like oh my god it's so much pressure on you it's the

spk_0 same way and self selection because people quit they're not in

spk_0 general they're not asked to leave all of that can happen so if

spk_0 you if somebody doesn't make it through buds it means they quit

spk_0 yep pretty much and it's a lot of pressure right the G.

spk_0 What just kicking off all the instructors were coming back

spk_0 from Afghanistan and they were larger than life you really

spk_0 look up to them and I was just very fortunate that I grew up in

spk_0 a culture and I knew a lot of the guys going in so I knew what

spk_0 the in-state was most of these kids are from Balex he Mississippi

spk_0 you've never even seen a Navy seal in real life until you showed

spk_0 up here I grew up with one all my family friends were

spk_0 seals we didn't have a single civilian friend growing up the

spk_0 only thing I've been around were commandos so I felt really

spk_0 natural around that environment but I knew it was going to

spk_0 suck I just knew it was did your dad have you running with him

spk_0 and doing pushups and things like that at home or was it

spk_0 mode along and then go skateboarding you know mode longer

spk_0 skateboarding than as we transition we got closer it was

spk_0 turning on down with the stew Smith guy did Navy seal prep and

spk_0 did that like everybody else didn't it's a phenomenal

spk_0 program for anybody's trying to go but I was I was so young

spk_0 I was so immature didn't have a cell phone didn't have a car

spk_0 I lived on the barracks and the only thing you had to do was

spk_0 get to the program what I will say is the 17 year old me

spk_0 that showed up in 2002 if I would try to be a Navy seal in 2025

spk_0 they wouldn't even take me my performance scores like you

spk_0 have to pass a screen test pushups pull ups run swim the whole

spk_0 thing your scores now have to be so competitive they wouldn't

spk_0 even take it may also that the standards have changed the

spk_0 standards are the same but the people going through the

spk_0 program are so better prepared they wouldn't even take you

spk_0 so if you're not if you're not 120 pushups 120 they don't

spk_0 even look at you like for me I basically barely scratched

spk_0 through I was I was a strong swimmer but technique was my

spk_0 thing and until you take the test you don't realize how hard

spk_0 it is and I got through it and I went out the buds and I was

spk_0 successful but I was by no means a star athlete and you guys

spk_0 you know Coleman release naval academy they are freaks

spk_0 their phenom the professional athletes and there you are 6

spk_0 145 pounds pot smoke and skateboarder we are not on the same

spk_0 level but mentally you couldn't mess with me I didn't care

spk_0 like we're getting surfed orchard and you watch these guys

spk_0 who would just he starts get up and quit and like

spk_0 it's not going to stop and I felt like I always had the

spk_0 inside scoop like if you think this is going to end it's not

spk_0 like my dad did a lot of diving I was like I've seen the

spk_0 conditions he dive in breaking through the ice like it is

spk_0 only going to get worse if this phases you this is not the

spk_0 program for you and I was right if that phases you the seal

spk_0 teams are going to chew you alive so not everybody should make

spk_0 it through that program I was just fortunate enough that just

spk_0 good enough to get by and you know maturity came later but

spk_0 buds was definitely not the hardest thing I've ever had to

spk_0 do at the time it was and when you get through it and you

spk_0 see all the pain you start with 200 something people you

spk_0 graduate less than 20. It's a 200 of the most physically

spk_0 capable people of that year in the United States Navy and they

spk_0 couldn't make it did any of the people that not made it

spk_0 through as well as made it through surprise you for not

spk_0 making it through or making it through not making it through

spk_0 for sure I mean all the guys that they you've been around

spk_0 in the cap in America's Navy seals have a certain look they

spk_0 have a certain mystique a certain or in they do in training

spk_0 too it's not like you just developed that you've had it your

spk_0 whole life and they were definitely guys you look at that

spk_0 look like Dolph Lunger from Rocky for you look at me like

spk_0 oh that dude is definitely going to make it he's gone in 20

spk_0 minutes how he passed everything he didn't like that cold

spk_0 water okay and then you see another guy who he was worse

spk_0 shape than me barely squeak by everything and he is the hardest

spk_0 dude you ever met in your life nothing faces him every run

spk_0 every swim just miserable he doesn't care he he's kind of it

spk_0 sounds like you have to not mind being miserable you have to

spk_0 use to you have to embrace it it's going to suck it's

spk_0 supposed to and you just got to tell yourself it's worth the

spk_0 price of admission it's going to be miserable you bought to

spk_0 take it you're going to get the whole show and it's totally

spk_0 worth it but you got to be there at the end you mentioned

spk_0 Coleman Ruiz who's been a guest on this podcast as a good

spk_0 friend of mine and yours as well and you worked with him and

spk_0 I'm probably going to get this a little bit wrong but I think

spk_0 once he said because I think it was an instructor but it's

spk_0 also for a short while you and he said you know when you look

spk_0 at the guys and make it through buds nine times out of ten

spk_0 they've had one at least one of the following three things

spk_0 either spend some serious time in detention in high school

spk_0 played a varsity sport in high school divorced parents

spk_0 and you know that raises a whole bunch of other questions

spk_0 about you know friction and and kind of for lack of a better

spk_0 way to put it like some internal sense of like FU I'm going

spk_0 to push through this anyway or just F F you to something so

spk_0 when you're going so let's assume that Coleman having given

spk_0 the fact that he's not a scientist he's he's a he was a

spk_0 former operator so he knows do you think that there were

spk_0 there were moments or many moments where it was you against

spk_0 them like you and your teammates because you're you know

spk_0 you're in Boat Crew or whatever with with your teammates

spk_0 you're working as a team and learning how to do that it's not

spk_0 just about you it's about the group and it's about you and

spk_0 it's about the expectation but how many different bins of

spk_0 motivation do you do you have to access to get through buds is

spk_0 it and is FU to the instructors or whoever to the cold water

spk_0 is that part is that a critical bin it is and it isn't because

spk_0 sometimes you get caught up in the moment you don't even

spk_0 think about it you just want to finish that evolution so

spk_0 when you're doing a four mile timed run that was one of the

spk_0 big things you have to do a four mile timed run it's got to

spk_0 be I think a seven minute mile or less and nowhere in there

spk_0 does it say the condition of the beach matters so if it's high

spk_0 tied low tied you have to run it on the burn themselves and

spk_0 the time standards time standard and talked to anybody at any

spk_0 point in that training you are going to hit a wall where you

spk_0 think your heart's gonna stop like if I take one more step

spk_0 I'll die right here is your heart rate so high and you're like

spk_0 I can't do it and at some point you just don't care you're

spk_0 like I'd rather fall stone cold dead in front of all of them

spk_0 and die right here than I would fail in their quitting yeah

spk_0 at least you don't have to go home head hanging and shame

spk_0 exactly you just push anyway sometimes you'll get it you'll

spk_0 be getting served tortured by the instructors and just laying

spk_0 on that 60 degree water just miserable and I tell the story

spk_0 quite a bit we had dudes getting up leaving mass access

spk_0 just and the biggest strongest dudes it's broad daylight 70

spk_0 degrees on Coronado Island the most beautiful day you've

spk_0 ever seen where Lane is just jackhammering and you look over

spk_0 and all the west coast seal teams are up to your right and you

spk_0 can see seal team one out there doing long PT for like

spk_0 their morning PT and you could look it down the left you

spk_0 see the hotel del in this little what I call a seven year old

spk_0 with a big pink flamingo jumping in the water having the

spk_0 best time of life and I'm like it's all about your perspective

spk_0 being a palisar prison however you want to see it right now

spk_0 that they're still doing it that kid time their life when

spk_0 the exact same water just change your mindset this is all

spk_0 part of the process and if you want to wear that shiny gold

spk_0 thing on your chest you must do this just do it and I remember

spk_0 that was one of the things like you're not going to break

spk_0 me no matter what you say I'll die right here in this water

spk_0 I don't care and that kind of that mindset has really been

spk_0 beneficial throughout the entire process parts of this part

spk_0 to buzz and part to being in special operations where you

spk_0 think it's going to kill you and then a certain point you just

spk_0 don't care if it kills me it kills me out of care and you get

spk_0 through it but you know I'm so terrified of heights I can't

spk_0 jump out of the back of the airplane you watch 15 guys going

spk_0 to front you get right to the ramp you go I don't care and

spk_0 you just for whatever reason they just jump like what made you

spk_0 jump everybody else did it I didn't want to be the guy who

spk_0 said no sometimes that that performance anxiety that pressure

spk_0 to perform on demand and get you through the hump and it shows

spk_0 you there is nothing if it can be done by a human being I can

spk_0 do it and it just it rings true it's like how far can you run

spk_0 as far as I have to well how fast you know as fast as I can

spk_0 but if you can run that I can run it if you can get up and

spk_0 over that mountain I can do it too how you can do it one

spk_0 step at a time brother here we go and it makes you so mentally

spk_0 resilient and I think that's the that's really defining factors

spk_0 you can make them believe in their mind they can get through

spk_0 anything now collectively as a group now you stack 25 of those

spk_0 true believers together you can do anything and I've seen some

spk_0 dudes do some herculean feats and they do it just because

spk_0 they're too afraid to say no can you do that yep you sure if

spk_0 it can be done I'll do it I see it at time and time again

spk_0 but yeah I mean everybody hits his moments and buds where

spk_0 it's just I cannot believe I'm doing this right now but it's

spk_0 magic once you get through it it's awesome I mean I I think

spk_0 setting a threshold for if it kills me it kills me is in many

spk_0 context is unhealthy but in that context is yeah healthy

spk_0 adaptive it's called adaptive I I'm not going to decide what's

spk_0 healthier unhealthy I'm sure some people are listening to this

spk_0 and the thing like this is how this is how guys get themselves

spk_0 killed and indeed outside of the context of buds that's

spk_0 yeah it's sometimes guys do dumb stuff I always say there's

spk_0 some about having a white chromosome that through you know I

spk_0 wasn't around tens of thousands of years ago but I'm guessing

spk_0 the first homo sapien male who picked up a rock the first thing

spk_0 you did hit himself in the head with it was like out then he

spk_0 hit the guy next to him with it and he go out and then they

spk_0 decided to take it and throw it against the wall and see

spk_0 what happens and on and on and here we are you know and

spk_0 obviously you know those with two ex chromosomes took a

spk_0 different path and we need that we need the collaboration in

spk_0 order of survival the species obviously but there's something

spk_0 about that let's just see what happens if and if it kills

spk_0 me it kills me that actually is a core feature of human

spk_0 evolution that's brought us to some incredible positive

spk_0 places so clearly buds is is it one such micro environment

spk_0 yeah so you make it through and then I realize there are a lot

spk_0 of other iterations there's jump school and there's a bunch

spk_0 other things and you often you you start hopping right away

spk_0 yeah get stationed at seal team 10 and for Gene Beach

spk_0 Virginia and we deploy in 2005 they are rock ward just

spk_0 kicked off so we at check in and I was early 04 and we deployed

spk_0 and yeah we deployed by seven months later I sent up Iraq

spk_0 was phenomenal everything you ever wanted to be scary

spk_0 you don't know anything the ideas are really bad and just

spk_0 I'm being really uncut I mean I was stormtrooping I don't

spk_0 I reckon 19 years old I mean you forget how young you are

spk_0 19 so you're 19 your kick indoors down I'm driving

spk_0 and humvee's blowing stuff up yeah and seeing friends get

spk_0 blown up if you talk to anybody who's in Iraq the chances

spk_0 of you not hitting an ID were so rare and we never hit one

spk_0 they'd hit the convoy in front of us the one behind us we

spk_0 get delayed at the gate for two minutes we turn them boom

spk_0 they go off in front of you they're just not hitting they're

spk_0 hitting everybody else but you and you know you would tell

spk_0 yourself things like all the reason or not doing this because

spk_0 we look so aggressive because we have flames and best goals on

spk_0 the humvee's it's not that man it's just it's not your time you

spk_0 be the best trained dude in the world that ID hits you lights

spk_0 over and on that deployment we lost all the guys and operation

spk_0 red wings in Afghanistan that was the other half of our

spk_0 seal team that was an idea that was the helicopter that the

spk_0 the the now I don't know what I've caught famous or infamous for

spk_0 giving I'm gonna step in it one way or the other loan

spk_0 survivor amazing book I should say I really really enjoyed the

spk_0 book that the movie does a I think a pretty good job of

spk_0 extracting some of the key moments from the book but more than a

spk_0 movie or book it's a true story and that's the four guys

spk_0 they got a three of them got killed on the ground and then

spk_0 one helicopter blown up attempting to come save them

spk_0 the I just saved the the one guy yeah Marcus and that was so

spk_0 hard to wrap your head around as a 19 year old to get a

spk_0 think you know in my mind I'd essentially been in the

spk_0 community for 19 years at that point and during my dad's time

spk_0 it was peacetime the whole time so you weren't going to

spk_0 funerals all day long like Navy SEALS getting killed was

spk_0 it was like folklore it's like all it's a bad training a bad

spk_0 parachute accident you know we had Neil Roberts got killed

spk_0 in the early G Watt in Afghanistan Robert Ridge you've

spk_0 ever heard of that story it's a gnarly one for us to get the

spk_0 Melvon or John Chapman the Air Force guy got Melvon or

spk_0 gnarly firefight but outside of that it wasn't happening

spk_0 very often and then when all those guys got killed in one

spk_0 shot it was like a slap of reality they were the best

spk_0 do you ever seen like the highest like unbelievably trained

spk_0 unbelievable experience in their gone and innocent no goodbye

spk_0 no fanfare no you know holding in like tell my mother it's

spk_0 nothing like Hollywood they're gone and that was kept under

spk_0 wraps for a long time before the book in the movie I think

spk_0 people really didn't know there wasn't a lot of discussion

spk_0 about SEALS and not know what yeah it wasn't in popular

spk_0 culture when the book came out started to gain steam and

spk_0 people started to you know read more about it but for being

spk_0 inside the SEAL team that was your own private 9-11 every single

spk_0 seal cried in an instant throwing up I mean just you cannot

spk_0 believe that just happened and then for everybody else who

spk_0 still fight in the war you have to try to explain to your wife

spk_0 and your family what it's not gonna happen you and it's a lie

spk_0 it's not like they did anything wrong that's just the way it is

spk_0 sometimes it just happens you were married at this point I

spk_0 wasn't single thank God intentionally intentionally yeah

spk_0 yeah I tried to wait as long as humanly possible try to do

spk_0 that good advice but you know it's hard it's hard to try to

spk_0 do that job at full time and trying to be a full-time boyfriend

spk_0 that turns into fiancee turns into a husband turns into a

spk_0 father it's very hard unless you're able to compartmentalize

spk_0 really really well unfortunately for us that's the thing you

spk_0 the best at is I can wall it off so fast and never think about

spk_0 you again now when you transition out of the military that's

spk_0 not really a superpower anymore in a moment it served you

spk_0 so it's more and more guys are getting killed

spk_0 did you find that getting into action each day the same way

spk_0 that you described civilian life now and getting into action

spk_0 each day being really adaptive did you find that that was key

spk_0 to being able to not go down mental traps and at the same

spk_0 time I acknowledge that you must have also just been really

spk_0 busy there's stuff coming at you all the time like just

spk_0 because I mean it sounds cold but just because guys get

spk_0 killed doesn't mean that the the opting stop stops in fact

spk_0 it probably picks up even more you got the next layer you have

spk_0 to you got to keep going get back on the horse keep

spk_0 going the last thing that we wanted is those guys get killed

spk_0 let's pull them all back let's take you know six months to

spk_0 you know regroup no no no we got to go out right now same

spk_0 thing with a parachute accident I told you about the

spk_0 the electric I got to do it right away if I don't get back

spk_0 on the horse I'll just build up this this dread and I'll

spk_0 lose my confidence in the whole process like we have to go

spk_0 and NSW did everybody did full gas full steam ahead let's

spk_0 go and just kept going we did another one in 2007 if you

spk_0 seen the stuff with Jason Redman I talked about my buddy

spk_0 Matt again shot up that 2007 deployment was dicey but it's

spk_0 the same thing like two of your close friends yeah and you

spk_0 know pretty mangled crazy mangled and you know you

spk_0 start to find out really really fast it doesn't matter how

spk_0 much you train if your numbers call you're getting pulled

spk_0 and it's hard to justify because now you have a girlfriend

spk_0 you have all this stuff and people are dying and you have to

spk_0 reassure them why it's not going to happen to you and you get

spk_0 really good compartmentalization like I can't control that

spk_0 the only thing I can control is this I'm shooting as much as I

spk_0 can I'm doing as much CQB as I can I'm jumping as much as

spk_0 I can I'm around the boys building team camaraderie is

spk_0 much as humanly possible because I can't control anything

spk_0 else control things you can't control building confidence

spk_0 but reality when it slaps it slaps hard and definitely

spk_0 slapped us as the public understanding of what the seals

spk_0 even were in our started to grow and change in the movies

spk_0 the loans arrived movie and I should think that they did

spk_0 again I think they did a good job with the movie I know the

spk_0 book in the movie were approved by the military so there was

spk_0 a lot of kind of vetting of the material but I think I think

spk_0 it hit powerfully at the time I was living in San Diego so

spk_0 you know the movie theaters were packed but that was true

spk_0 everywhere I'm made a big impact but then with like the

spk_0 the bin Laden thing you know being you know the televising

spk_0 the the White House watching and you know I feel like the

spk_0 whole world came to understand that there were these guys

spk_0 called Navy Seals and they're doing this really dangerous

spk_0 stuff and I'm taking out bad guys was there anything that

spk_0 changed about the job just knowing that it wasn't as as

spk_0 vaulted as it once was I mean what you're doing is vaulted

spk_0 on a day-to-day basis but you know just this idea like this

spk_0 is in movies and they there it is and cover CNN there's

spk_0 Obama and you know secretary defense watching the op you

spk_0 know and and people then there's a movie made about it very

spk_0 quickly and I mean it was all happening and it was weird in

spk_0 real time and on the movies and it just for a civilian it was

spk_0 a little bit of a of a mine band I can't even imagine what

spk_0 it was like if that's your job and so much of being able to

spk_0 perform the job well relies on people not knowing what

spk_0 you're doing and how you do it what was that like terrible

spk_0 terrible I mean the very next day you couldn't drive on the

spk_0 compound every news channel across America was setting

spk_0 outside of the thing and not only taking photos everybody

spk_0 comes in they know what you look like they're looking for

spk_0 guys with long hair beards covered in tattoos driving jack

spk_0 you know jacked up pickup trucks so what you're looking for and

spk_0 now you can't go anywhere now they're going out in town to

spk_0 all the bars and restaurants you go to and they're pulling

spk_0 you aside asking you it's like it's very uncomfortable they'll

spk_0 see wives in there with a little trident stick on the back of

spk_0 the car they'll nail her and the whole foods parking lot

spk_0 your husband and ABC or nobody's ever done this before it's

spk_0 like mums award everybody kind of just collapsed on

spk_0 ourselves and really really tried to hush this thing down

spk_0 but it made the job very very difficult it felt like you

spk_0 were just on a microscope the entire time and then when

spk_0 extortion happened then everybody started that it was an

spk_0 inside job you know they come on man I know it's probably not

spk_0 something you want to get into it may just explain for people

spk_0 what extortion 17 was and why that was so additionally

spk_0 impactful after what happened with Operation Red Wings.

spk_0 Yeah I mean you know we had Operation Red Wings that happened

spk_0 June 28 2005. You had a bunch of really historic things that

spk_0 led up after that you had the rescue captain Phillips in 2009

spk_0 that was a huge milestone when like everybody's cool yeah yeah

spk_0 and they made a movie they made a movie and it's great and

spk_0 like but nobody in the teams is on social media they're not

spk_0 on I didn't watch a YouTube video my entire time in the

spk_0 ceiltings like what are watching YouTube video for like

spk_0 nobody knew how bad it was spinning outside of your control

spk_0 and nobody.

spk_0 Then lot happens and then August 6 2011 we lose an entire

spk_0 troop of guys in Afghanistan he will get shot down kills

spk_0 him all in an instant killed 31 total people in it was like

spk_0 we were reliving June 28 again but now it's double is bad and

spk_0 now you truly have the best that have ever suited up if you

spk_0 look at the experience level they have most of those guys

spk_0 were pre 9 11 guys 10 12 combat rotations gone you never

spk_0 replace it never you've never filled that void since that

spk_0 moment and then you have all these people just hateful

spk_0 rhetoric like always an inside job and you know they they

spk_0 knew too much they knew they were on the bin Laden rates we

spk_0 killed them until you know hard that is living for

spk_0 junior beach doing that job seeing those wise at Whole Foods

spk_0 weren't a memorial t-shirt knowing you're saying that do you

spk_0 know what that does to a family you know that does a little

spk_0 kids who wake up and they read the comment section mom was

spk_0 dad killed.

spk_0 Yeah was he killed by the government that's what they read

spk_0 because that's what you're saying and it's not the truth

spk_0 it's not that was an off the went wrong.

spk_0 It's a dangerous job and when you fly in those big gigantic

spk_0 black helicopters and they're slow to land you can shoot

spk_0 them and that's what happened.

spk_0 And it's as simple as that it's a dangerous job.

spk_0 What are you going to do but it is very hard to live for

spk_0 junior beach that is so small everywhere you go it's around

spk_0 you.

spk_0 I mean you're sitting through black t-shirts all day long

spk_0 which memorial sure you know where it is and I you get

spk_0 there now people are starting to road that from you and

spk_0 it really starts to lose your confidence so for me now I

spk_0 married I'm in the organization.

spk_0 We had to fill we had to fill a lot of those guys from

spk_0 other squadrons and one of my best friends had to go over

spk_0 and unfortunately he had killed in.

spk_0 December 8 2012 on a hostage rescue.

spk_0 Ed Byers got the mile of honor for that operation by

spk_0 buddy got the Navy cross and you know we went to blood

spk_0 together his name is Nick check.

spk_0 One of the greatest most pure operators you have ever met

spk_0 came from Pennsylvania big wrestler always in a gym

spk_0 always training.

spk_0 He he represented with the essence of being a Navy seal

spk_0 was in everyone knew it.

spk_0 When he died a piece of me died that I've never gotten back

spk_0 and try not to cry.

spk_0 The hardest thing I've ever had to do was look at my wife

spk_0 and tell her that it wasn't going to happen to me after

spk_0 he died because he was the true north so when she looks

spk_0 me and she goes well the reason you're away from us the

spk_0 reason you spend 300 days on the road is because you're

spk_0 perfecting this craft because you say it buys down the

spk_0 risk.

spk_0 What about that.

spk_0 You can't justify it.

spk_0 Just look at it and you're like I just hope it's not my

spk_0 time.

spk_0 I'm just going to try to exhaust all my resources run out

spk_0 of put myself in the best positions surrounded by the

spk_0 best people to buy down as much risk is humanly possible

spk_0 my numbers call it's called.

spk_0 What do you want me to do?

spk_0 And that's where the compartmentalization really took

spk_0 old.

spk_0 You have to be able to leave Virginia Beach your wife

spk_0 your two kids and completely blocked them out.

spk_0 Like I can't run through that door with bullets coming

spk_0 out of it thinking about my wife and kids and how I'm

spk_0 going to work in them.

spk_0 You can't.

spk_0 I don't have pictures in my room.

spk_0 I'm not trying to face time all the time.

spk_0 I'm trying to separate myself out so I can just do this

spk_0 job and it makes you it makes you really distant.

spk_0 It makes you not be the person you want to be the

spk_0 person you used to be because you can't.

spk_0 You've been the person you need to be in order to

spk_0 eventually be able to go back and become the person you

spk_0 want to be is what it sounds like to me.

spk_0 And you know I say to the guys now and it'll sound

spk_0 messed up so forgive me but I never chased a guy who had

spk_0 a perfect family.

spk_0 There was never Navy SEAL I ever wanted to emulate

spk_0 who had the pitcher perfect family ever.

spk_0 They were all either on their second marriage, bad

spk_0 relationship with their kids because they were so

spk_0 devout at work and you looked at them like that's a

spk_0 masterclass like it's why it's like watching Tiger

spk_0 Woods drag around his golf bag like that's the best

spk_0 it's ever been ever and he has no 50 50.

spk_0 There is no dial for that man.

spk_0 He is living this at 100% in the moment he retires.

spk_0 I really hope he takes all that energy all that focus

spk_0 and becomes a better husband and father but you can't

spk_0 do it both ways.

spk_0 My mind has come to change now but I've never seen it

spk_0 and I most certainly had no balance.

spk_0 I wasn't even trying to find balance.

spk_0 I was trying to wall them off is much extremely possible

spk_0 to focus on task at hand because any distraction was

spk_0 dangerous and it's hard to do but it was necessary.

spk_0 I don't know any high performers especially ultra

spk_0 high performers and especially ultra high performers

spk_0 in high risk high consequence careers that don't have

spk_0 some unresolved dark aspect of themselves of their

spk_0 life or something that you mentioned Tiger.

spk_0 It's public knowledge he had issues outside of his golf

spk_0 game and sounds like he's resolved those things.

spk_0 He got married again recently and I think

spk_0 everyone should wish him the best and the best.

spk_0 Especially in the United States we hold people up

spk_0 and we expect perfection from our so-called heroes

spk_0 historically as well as ones that are alive and

spk_0 perfection doesn't exist because so much of what's

spk_0 required from high performances total focus,

spk_0 total compartmentalization and being a human being

spk_0 is a lot more complicated than that.

spk_0 It's something I think to keep in mind.

spk_0 I also just want to just briefly double click on this

spk_0 thing about comments.

spk_0 I'm not going to tell people stop saying mean stuff

spk_0 about me if they want to mean stuff about somebody.

spk_0 I think I'm going to do it anyway.

spk_0 It's not the issue but when it comes to kids reading

spk_0 about their dead parents, their dead dads in this case.

spk_0 And last week we had a public assassination.

spk_0 There's a dead dad and people making up theories

spk_0 and coming up with ideas that they somehow know things

spk_0 that other people don't know.

spk_0 Sometimes these people have a professional background

spk_0 in politics or in the military or in law enforcement

spk_0 and it adds additional weight to these theories.

spk_0 But the repercussions on the kids and family

spk_0 and the legacy is really bad.

spk_0 It's really bad.

spk_0 It's a shame there isn't a thicker filter.

spk_0 I'm all for free speech, 100% for free speech.

spk_0 But there's a lot of damage done with those thumb clicks

spk_0 that I don't think people can really comprehend.

spk_0 So I'm glad you pointed at that out.

spk_0 I mean, yeah, I mean just imagine it.

spk_0 Like you're a 14 year old kid and you've grown up

spk_0 worshipping your father and he gets killed in Afghanistan

spk_0 and you see a post about him.

spk_0 You start to read down like he was killed by his government

spk_0 by this and this.

spk_0 Mom, mom, it raises doubt.

spk_0 And then that little seated doubt

spk_0 is going to be with him forever.

spk_0 It's like it takes the entire collective to like listen to me.

spk_0 They've never even met a Navy SEAL dude.

spk_0 That's some kid in the middle of nowhere

spk_0 who's typing his mother's basement

spk_0 who's just writing some hateful stuff.

spk_0 It's not real. It's hard to block it out when there's 500 of them.

spk_0 Or guys that were in the military

spk_0 that didn't make it through selection, their past

spk_0 or have some resentment for some guy

spk_0 that was jacked in high school who said something

spk_0 and they didn't get the date or you know,

spk_0 I mean, it's like recent is like the ego and resent

spk_0 are a bitter combination.

spk_0 It can last a lifetime.

spk_0 Negative comments many times are irrelevant,

spk_0 but in this context, I have a potential lasting

spk_0 very, very corrosive aspect.

spk_0 I'd like to take a quick break

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spk_0 So you're hopping.

spk_0 Guys are dying.

spk_0 You now have a family.

spk_0 And it's in your family lineage to do this job.

spk_0 I'm curious, you know, was the fact that your dad was a team guide?

spk_0 Did that feel like pressure?

spk_0 Did it feel like buoyancy or neither?

spk_0 It felt normal.

spk_0 Did you feel like you had to outdo them?

spk_0 I would ask that of anyone, military or not.

spk_0 There's this notion, well, I mean, just briefly back up.

spk_0 A friend recently, we were talking about kids and family and building family.

spk_0 And he said, you don't want to son.

spk_0 You got daughters. He has a whole daughter.

spk_0 No, I think I'd like to be a part of each of her.

spk_0 But who cares? I have daughters.

spk_0 I have a son. I don't care.

spk_0 And he said, no, because if you have a son, he's going to try and be better than you.

spk_0 And then you're going to be in conflict.

spk_0 And I almost said no.

spk_0 And then I was like, my dad's a scientist.

spk_0 And so I was like, there's a point in your life where you go, can I fill those shoes?

spk_0 Can I exceed those shoes?

spk_0 It's natural human son to father behavior, I think.

spk_0 And so was there ever a moment where you're like, I got to exceed

spk_0 or just, or was it irrelevant?

spk_0 I think it was irrelevant, but just because the time when you came in, you know,

spk_0 spent his entire time at the peace time.

spk_0 I did nothing but combat the entire time.

spk_0 A lot of deployments back and back, back, never took a short duty station just by that amount of experience.

spk_0 You already surpassed it, but it doesn't need to be said.

spk_0 Why not leave?

spk_0 Guys, one of your closest mentors and friends gets killed.

spk_0 I mean, the retirement plan, I'm guessing is pretty good, but it's not that awesome.

spk_0 That's a plug for the military to increase the retirement salaries.

spk_0 And you get some medical care, right?

spk_0 You know, some things come to your family for staying in 20 years, I think it is.

spk_0 But did the thought ever cross your mind like, hey, guys are dropping off and you're right in the center of it.

spk_0 Maybe leave.

spk_0 Not for a moment.

spk_0 I should have known that wasn't going to be the answer.

spk_0 At that time, it's so different because a lot of people think about special operations into global Ontario is the Marines pushing through Fallujah.

spk_0 Broad daylight just getting smashed.

spk_0 Those are the bravest dudes that served during the G1.

spk_0 There is nothing more impressive than a 19 year old Marine and the things they'll do like they just are like their hero some on my experience in a GWT was very different.

spk_0 It's always at night.

spk_0 It's always select targets.

spk_0 It's not like like, hey, you and your team are going to go raid this village.

spk_0 No, we're going for a very, very specific person.

spk_0 And then when you look at it,

spk_0 Hemingway said it best.

spk_0 Once you've hunted our men long enough and liked it, you'll never care for anything else thereafter.

spk_0 There is nothing like hunting a human being who's hunting you, nothing.

spk_0 And you are so afraid you're going to miss it.

spk_0 So that's why you hide injuries.

spk_0 You don't get surgery.

spk_0 You do everything you can to put yourself in position to be on the out to not miss the deployment.

spk_0 And I think that's what it is in the essence is.

spk_0 You know, you have all the intel folks and all the technology that are giving you this one thing and you just stare at them.

spk_0 I know everything about you.

spk_0 Where you live, your secondary house, everybody you talk to you, right handed, left handed, how many windows, how many doors, the inward opening, outward open, these are storm doors.

spk_0 What's the windows made?

spk_0 I know everything about you.

spk_0 And then we know exactly when we're going to go get you.

spk_0 We know you're bad.

spk_0 We know everything you've done.

spk_0 I know everything you've said on that phone for the last six months.

spk_0 I know everything there is to know about you.

spk_0 And we are coming to get you.

spk_0 And when you're successful, it becomes addictive.

spk_0 And you just keep chasing that feeling like, I am pulling these people off the earth and it makes a difference.

spk_0 I'm not just not carpet bombing anything like that one singular dude has done all of this.

spk_0 We have to remove him.

spk_0 Let's go.

spk_0 It makes you feel like you're important.

spk_0 It makes you feel like people actually need you and you chase it for as long as possible.

spk_0 My buddy Jimmy Hatch wrote a book called Chase in a dragon.

spk_0 And that's what it's like.

spk_0 You chase him long enough you'll find him and you don't want to jump off that train.

spk_0 You're so afraid in the teams and special operative.

spk_0 The military does a really good job of painting a narrative that if you leave this, your life is over.

spk_0 There's nothing that's going to surpass us.

spk_0 The seal teams are the only thing you know how to do.

spk_0 And it's the only thing you'll ever feel at home.

spk_0 And it's the truth.

spk_0 You get guys to get out and they go work at Goldman Sachs and you do this and you do that.

spk_0 If you really get a couple beers and you sit down, they're miserable.

spk_0 They mess up.

spk_0 Even all the stuff you didn't like, the things that you hated about the military and the people you hated working for at the end of the, you don't remember any of that.

spk_0 You only remember the good times.

spk_0 And because you had the entire time at war, the whole aspect, the whole career was just amazing.

spk_0 You know, standing on the shoulders of giants.

spk_0 I've got to work with people that are the greatest thing you'll never get to see.

spk_0 Like there's 12 people in the planet that were there that saw that thing and we won't even address it.

spk_0 Because it's not cool if you address it.

spk_0 I cannot believe you just pulled that off.

spk_0 That's the most impressive thing I've ever seen in my life and you don't even, you don't even talk about it.

spk_0 Like the regular people will never get to see the level of detail that goes into doing that job.

spk_0 They see it on a flat-range shoot or whatever and they're like, oh, I can do that.

spk_0 But you can't jump out of 35,000 feet at night into a place you've never seen and then do it.

spk_0 But you can't do that.

spk_0 Like, you know, hard it is to put yourself in a position to do that operation.

spk_0 They have no idea.

spk_0 And they're shooting back at you.

spk_0 Yeah.

spk_0 There's that piece.

spk_0 The target's on a flat-range shoot back.

spk_0 Yeah.

spk_0 This is a two-way range.

spk_0 This isn't aerosol. It's not called a duty.

spk_0 Like there's a real people that dude has five kids and he's going through that threshold regardless what's coming out of him without a second thought.

spk_0 It's amazing to see.

spk_0 And I said to a group of guys the other day, you know, in the tower fell, I've never felt more patriotic in my life.

spk_0 In those moments, you never think about the flag.

spk_0 You never think about the American people.

spk_0 You never think about that.

spk_0 You think you do it for the country.

spk_0 You really do it and you stay doing it for the culture.

spk_0 The culture of the SEAL teams will forth every ounce you have to pay for it.

spk_0 And every other group will tell you the exact same thing.

spk_0 Like the cultures will keep you there.

spk_0 You're so afraid to leave it because you know you're never going to find it anywhere else.

spk_0 And that was the same way.

spk_0 I mean, when me and my lady were going through our worst moments, I told her,

spk_0 like, if you don't like to train jump, I'm not stopping for you.

spk_0 I'm not.

spk_0 And that's why I was really concerned we first got together because she was married to Danny Deeds.

spk_0 It was on Operation Red Wings on the ground.

spk_0 Her dad was the SEAL.

spk_0 I mean, we were embedded in the SEAL team.

spk_0 You guys have both came up in it.

spk_0 Oh, yeah, man.

spk_0 Like we're embedded in this.

spk_0 And you know, I met her three years after Danny passed.

spk_0 I didn't know Danny.

spk_0 I didn't know her mutual friends.

spk_0 We connected around 2008 and I told him we first, I fell in love with her instantly.

spk_0 And it scared me because I was getting ready to screen and try to go with a tier one command.

spk_0 And the pace was so fast.

spk_0 And I was so worried that she'd looking me one day and go, I can't do this again.

spk_0 And I wasn't going to leave her.

spk_0 And I told her that don't ever ask me to leave because I won't.

spk_0 Like if you don't want to do this, I get it.

spk_0 Like we can be best friends.

spk_0 We can do whatever, but I'm not leaving this for you.

spk_0 And that's one of the hardest things I've ever had to do.

spk_0 And for whatever reason, she's a unicorn.

spk_0 She has been the quintessential teamwife above and beyond.

spk_0 Every deployment full steam ahead.

spk_0 Hot water heater blows up.

spk_0 Tree falls to the minivan.

spk_0 She doesn't even tell me.

spk_0 She just solves it.

spk_0 She's amazing.

spk_0 And I still blocked her out like I did everything else because I still thought that my love for her was abstraction.

spk_0 And like those are the times I look back on and I regret.

spk_0 But in the moment, I don't think I'd change it.

spk_0 I don't think I could.

spk_0 I don't think I could do that job at the level that was required to do it and have that love of them.

spk_0 You know, hanging around my neck.

spk_0 I couldn't do it.

spk_0 It all ended up working on the wash, but it was, it's hard, man.

spk_0 It's hard to sit there and just wait for your number to get called and just hope it doesn't.

spk_0 I mean, the best dudes in the world are getting killed.

spk_0 And you can't just, it's not lack of training.

spk_0 It's not lack of funding.

spk_0 It's not lack of experience.

spk_0 It's not lack of commitment.

spk_0 What is it?

spk_0 It's a dangerous job, man.

spk_0 That's what it is.

spk_0 It's a super dangerous job.

spk_0 And people are trying to kill you all day long.

spk_0 You just hope that you're better than air.

spk_0 But some days it happens regardless.

spk_0 And it's hard.

spk_0 It's hard putting guys in the ground, especially when you've grown up with them.

spk_0 You're in your whole life.

spk_0 You definitely picked the right woman.

spk_0 I lost her to Unicorn.

spk_0 I did.

spk_0 She's unbelievable.

spk_0 I have a good friend.

spk_0 He, uh, because I know you've got daughters.

spk_0 And, uh, and he said, um, you want to marry a woman that were you to have daughters with her

spk_0 that you'd be very happy if they turned out like her.

spk_0 Yeah.

spk_0 Which is one of the best pieces of advice that I didn't hear until fairly recently.

spk_0 And the moment I heard it, I was like, wow, that's really good.

spk_0 You know, they don't tell us that in high school.

spk_0 No, they don't.

spk_0 But, uh, clearly you bullseye it on that one.

spk_0 So you're opting here alive.

spk_0 Guys are dying.

spk_0 You got a family.

spk_0 And it sounds like you love it too.

spk_0 You're loving the work, um, which is so key, right?

spk_0 I don't.

spk_0 Because in moments of stress and, you know, I mean, all the other stuff that's clearly important.

spk_0 And love a country flags on that stuff.

spk_0 It sounds like it's necessary, but it's not sufficient in those moments.

spk_0 The culture is really the glue.

spk_0 Then you start incurring some damage.

spk_0 I mean, uh, so what do you see in your mind as kind of the first, uh, high impact event that's not someone else die?

spk_0 Um, like that your, your body is starting to take a toll.

spk_0 I had a lot of emotional stuff happen in that second deployment.

spk_0 You know, my, my idol, Maddie Roberts, I've talked about him a couple times.

spk_0 I really, really hung on to that dude.

spk_0 Like he was my true north.

spk_0 Like he was the guy.

spk_0 And when he got shot up.

spk_0 When you see it happen, you know, his arm shot off, it flipped around his shoulder.

spk_0 It looked like his arm was completely gone.

spk_0 My fingers were inside his arm.

spk_0 We're trying to solve this saying.

spk_0 They're shooting at us and really, really close proximity.

spk_0 And I think it still has a record F test.

spk_0 Jay Redman, but I think that was the, uh, the closest call for fire mission, the entire Iraq war.

spk_0 Like inside, uh, 15 meters.

spk_0 I mean, Corey Mike Mike, my AC 130 gunship.

spk_0 I mean, it was on top of you.

spk_0 A belt fed machine gun just chewing us up.

spk_0 Everybody shot up except for me and one of the guys.

spk_0 I'm roll crowded behind this tractor tire.

spk_0 Just felt like a victim.

spk_0 And at one point right when the initial contact happened, I sprinted to a tree and got a piece of cover.

spk_0 So there's me three guys that are all shot up and one other guy who's behind this tractor tire.

spk_0 And I'm screaming at him like, hey, I've got an out come over here.

spk_0 And he screams on black Hawk down like, nope, come to me.

spk_0 And you're looking back at it.

spk_0 You can see all the muscle flash.

spk_0 And just the way it happened, you had blue forces or friendly, so we're in behind him.

spk_0 So you couldn't shoot into this veg line because you knew there were friendly, so we're back there.

spk_0 So you're in this weird dance where I can't do anything.

spk_0 Like I felt helpless, you know, I'm getting around support all over me.

spk_0 And at a certain point, you just go, I'd rather run back into the front of the slaying.

spk_0 You killed with all of them.

spk_0 Then be the lone survivor.

spk_0 I don't want to walk through this.

spk_0 I don't want to live with the survivor's guilt.

spk_0 I'd rather just run back up and let's just catch it and be done with it.

spk_0 And I ran right back into the center of it and dropped down on that tire and started working on the guys back

spk_0 and putting on turn and gets and quick clod and all the stuff.

spk_0 When I came back from that, I was mentally scarred for the rest of my life.

spk_0 And I just never ever processed it.

spk_0 I just blocked it off because it was so close.

spk_0 I think because it was the first time I felt helpless.

spk_0 Like I was just waiting to die.

spk_0 Right? Like the guy that I looked up that I wanted to be like, like he was a physical representation of what I thought the essence of being a Navy SEAL was.

spk_0 And he's dying in my arms.

spk_0 And I can't shoot back.

spk_0 I mean, we're hunkered down in rounds.

spk_0 We're just skipping all over you.

spk_0 And you're just, if that J-TAC wouldn't have called in a firematch when we'd all be dead.

spk_0 I mean, it's only a matter of time before he stands up and just realizes he can just walk us down.

spk_0 I mean, there's no alone night visions all messed up at this point.

spk_0 I mean, everything that could have went wrong went wrong.

spk_0 And now we're inside of 10 meters getting pounded by a belt fed machine gun.

spk_0 You can't move.

spk_0 And it was the first time my life I truly felt helpless.

spk_0 And everything worked out.

spk_0 Everybody ended up surviving it.

spk_0 We got him in the helicopter and did all that.

spk_0 I just think I never got an opportunity to ever talk about it.

spk_0 And when I went back home, you know, you're taking a shower.

spk_0 The showers and I rock aren't the best as you can imagine.

spk_0 And I'm standing in ankle deep sludge water that just filled with blood.

spk_0 It means all in my mouth. It's all over my hair.

spk_0 And I've never taken the shower and just seen it all.

spk_0 And not knowing if you lived or not.

spk_0 And thinking, do I want to be washing this off?

spk_0 Because they call me in 20 minutes and tell me he's dead.

spk_0 This is the last piece of him I have.

spk_0 So I saved the cameys. I saved the boot. I saved the shirt.

spk_0 I saved everything I wore. I shoved it on the bag and I kept it in case he died.

spk_0 But it was hard, man. Like the back of that helicopter looked like black Hawk Down.

spk_0 Just blow out kits and turnikits and magazines and rounds all over it.

spk_0 And just the most blood I've ever seen.

spk_0 And you're just slipping and sliding in it just like out of the movies.

spk_0 And it's not. It's dudes. You've wrapped your arms around and told you I've loved you a hundred times.

spk_0 You know, this is not what I thought it was going to be like.

spk_0 I didn't think this was going to be like this.

spk_0 I didn't because I'd never seen it. And my dad has never been through that.

spk_0 None of his friends ever went through that.

spk_0 Now I am this 20 year old kid.

spk_0 And this is what I'm living with.

spk_0 And it was hard because you got to walk back in the culture of the seal team.

spk_0 So we're not talking about that.

spk_0 Nobody's ever addressing that. When you see him, you know, you always make a joke.

spk_0 Like, hey, could you scream any louder?

spk_0 Like, I'm surprised. We already killed by how loud you were yelling.

spk_0 You always make a joke about it.

spk_0 It wasn't a joke. And I was traumatized.

spk_0 Like I worship that guy.

spk_0 And to see the reality.

spk_0 Like, he's not Superman and neither am I.

spk_0

spk_0 Fortunately for me, he did the most heroic thing I've ever seen.

spk_0 And that moment is stuck with me forever.

spk_0 And that initial contact happened. Everybody got shot, including him.

spk_0 And he stood back up and ran forward and grabbed our corpsman,

spk_0 who was all shot up and started dragging him back.

spk_0 And I watched it happen.

spk_0 Get shot again. It spins him.

spk_0 Drops him on the floor and he gets right back up.

spk_0 Picks him up again. Get shot.

spk_0 Arm spins over his shoulder.

spk_0 Keeps dragging him back. Get shot again.

spk_0 Hit the ground. Get's back up.

spk_0 Keeps dragging him.

spk_0 And it's like, at no point was he ever going to leave that dude.

spk_0 Could he have?

spk_0 Yeah. He could have ran dough behind that tractor tire

spk_0 and sent me out there to go fetch him.

spk_0 He was so committed to the process of, I am never going to leave you.

spk_0 If he would have took one right in the head and he would have died right then.

spk_0 He would have never battled my about it.

spk_0 If he would have known the outcome, he would have went in anyway.

spk_0 And that part is stuck into the entire time.

spk_0 Like, a true believer will go further than anyone else

spk_0 in the moment of total duress because they're conditioned to it.

spk_0 He's already made up in his mind how far you willing to go.

spk_0 The entire way right now.

spk_0 I'm just looking for an opportunity to prove it.

spk_0 And that was his moment to prove it.

spk_0 He proved it to everybody.

spk_0 Still to the stage, and probably still my biggest inspiration

spk_0 in the entire team, which is not Roberts.

spk_0 Unbelievable human.

spk_0 I'm trying to get emotional, but yeah.

spk_0 Just amazing human.

spk_0 I mean, intense in every way to hear about

spk_0 so I can only imagine what it's like to be there.

spk_0 And your reverence for people around you

spk_0 that do amazing things is super impressive.

spk_0 I notice you're constantly noticing the people

spk_0 that you've been blessed to be around that show you things.

spk_0 And the extent to which you internalize it is awesome.

spk_0 I realize it also carries some weight when they're not doing well.

spk_0 It's so interesting.

spk_0 I hope people hear what I'm hearing, for they are,

spk_0 which is that it's never about you.

spk_0 It's always about seeing this other person

spk_0 that you know, it was like a almost like superhero status.

spk_0 They're human and it sort of brings reality back.

spk_0 But all the while, you're a central figure in this interaction.

spk_0 This wasn't like watching it on an iPad from a distance

spk_0 and wishing you could do something like that.

spk_0 You're in there too and that's not lost on us as you tell this.

spk_0 So you're carrying this in your head

spk_0 and you're still going back out.

spk_0 So you didn't process it then.

spk_0 Let's talk about you getting electrocuted.

spk_0 Because you keep popping.

spk_0 Fortunately, you're not killed.

spk_0 And then you're pretty close to the time

spk_0 when you can leave feeling like you've done sufficient time

spk_0 in the teams you've done your work.

spk_0 Was there a desire to stay in past 20 years?

spk_0 I never planned on getting out.

spk_0 Never.

spk_0 You wanted to be one of these so-called bullfrogs.

spk_0 I know one that I won't much in his name because he won't appreciate it.

spk_0 But he did something like 32 years or something.

spk_0 He's a friend and actually asked him once

spk_0 what his training regimen.

spk_0 He's getting up there now.

spk_0 He's going to give me a shit for saying that.

spk_0 But he's in great shape obviously.

spk_0 And he says he finds some way to make sure

spk_0 that he's breathing super hard

spk_0 and his heart rate is max for an hour a day.

spk_0 This is workout.

spk_0 It doesn't get any simpler than that.

spk_0 I didn't ask him the variety of things.

spk_0 He's done to accomplish that.

spk_0 But I think it's running.

spk_0 I think it's lifting heavy objects.

spk_0 I think it's swimming.

spk_0 I think it's...

spk_0 But yeah, it doesn't get any simpler than that.

spk_0 In addition to his physical durability,

spk_0 his mental durability, he says directly linked to that.

spk_0 An hour a day breathing as hard as he can at max heart rate.

spk_0 That's that sort of bullfrog mentality.

spk_0 So you wanted to be one of those guys.

spk_0 But you decided at some point,

spk_0 it might be wise to lean into the family life?

spk_0 No.

spk_0 No, God no.

spk_0

spk_0 I'm...

spk_0 Okay.

spk_0 So, okay.

spk_0 Bad gas, Andrew.

spk_0 Yeah.

spk_0 My first major injury, I made it all the way through.

spk_0 You know, came in in 2002.

spk_0 In 2010, I was going through selection

spk_0 to the Tier 1 organization.

spk_0 And about three quarters of the way through,

spk_0 we do a big skydive blog out in Arizona.

spk_0 I love jumping.

spk_0 It's my jam.

spk_0 And I had a bad landing.

spk_0 Downwind landing, hit this ravine,

spk_0 and I snapped my femoral neck.

spk_0 Broke that thing.

spk_0 And I was so afraid they were going to wash me

spk_0 out of the program.

spk_0 I just didn't say anything.

spk_0 So I can barely walk.

spk_0 I can't drive a car.

spk_0 I mean, it's full atrophy.

spk_0 It's bad.

spk_0 And I'm jacked up on so many torridoles, tramadoles,

spk_0 and 800 milligram motoring that I'm able to get through and jump.

spk_0 They know something wrong with me,

spk_0 but they know I'm not going to quit.

spk_0 They know I'm not going to ask for any help.

spk_0 So as long as I can pass,

spk_0 the evolutions were good.

spk_0 And all I have to do is jump.

spk_0 We graduate that.

spk_0 We get drafted in all the different organizations

spk_0 you're going to go to, and I walked into rehab,

spk_0 and I went, okay, now that's over.

spk_0 My back's broken.

spk_0 And they were like, oh, what do you say that?

spk_0 And they told them, we had gotten out.

spk_0 We got an MRI on my hip when we were in Arizona.

spk_0 And nothing showed up.

spk_0 They were like, I think you tore your hip flexor.

spk_0 And I was like, oh, if I tore my hip flex,

spk_0 I don't care.

spk_0 We're good.

spk_0 I thought it was my back.

spk_0 We get home.

spk_0 They run new images in my femoral neck.

spk_0 And I was like, my back is snapped off.

spk_0 And you know the deal, you lose a femoral neck,

spk_0 blood supply, total hip replacement,

spk_0 you're out of the military.

spk_0 And I walked in, saw the doctor,

spk_0 and he, you know, he's sitting here in front of my command

spk_0 masher chief, and all the rehab guys,

spk_0 and he goes, hey, we got emergency surgery for you tomorrow

spk_0 morning, 07.

spk_0 No.

spk_0 And he's like, what?

spk_0 I'm not getting surgery.

spk_0 I've never had surgery.

spk_0 I'm not getting surgery.

spk_0 Nope.

spk_0 I got deployment coming up.

spk_0 I'm not doing that.

spk_0 And my command masher chief,

spk_0 look at me, and he goes,

spk_0 let me rephrase this.

spk_0 You're getting surgery tomorrow at 07.

spk_0 If you don't, I'm going to shit candy out of the program.

spk_0 It's like, oh, okay, what is it?

spk_0 And he's like 15 inches of titanium.

spk_0 Three lag bolts.

spk_0 We're going to pump them in there.

spk_0 Here's a rehab protocol.

spk_0 You're still going to deploy.

spk_0 And you know, I think it was a month and a half.

spk_0 And we did.

spk_0 But I got through, from the time I broke it,

spk_0 I did another 85 skydives on it.

spk_0 Went through Utah.

spk_0 I mean, up and down that craze elevation,

spk_0 just, I think it was a month and a half.

spk_0 Really just sucking it up.

spk_0 But it was a test for mental resiliency.

spk_0 How far are you willing to push to be a part of the organization?

spk_0 The entire way.

spk_0 Did your team, teammates know you had a broken femur?

spk_0 Okay.

spk_0 We got through.

spk_0 We didn't bring to surgery.

spk_0 We had a nasty complication.

spk_0 Got infected.

spk_0 You know, wound backs.

spk_0 The whole thing.

spk_0 And they were so cool.

spk_0 They, they flew a rehab guy over Afghanistan with me.

spk_0 And that's how we tested out.

spk_0 You know, the final test.

spk_0 Like we're doing VO2 maxes and broad jumps.

spk_0 And all the things make sure you have can take it.

spk_0 And the very last thing was this huge box, probably a 48 inch box.

spk_0 We got a full kit on.

spk_0 And he looks me his name is Mike.

spk_0 And he goes, okay, we're going to have you drop off this and land on the bad leg.

spk_0 And he goes DJ.

spk_0 Do not step off that box.

spk_0 If you don't think it'll hold.

spk_0 I know it wouldn't hold.

spk_0 There's no way it's going to hold.

spk_0 Like it feels so bad inside me.

spk_0 Step off it.

spk_0 Hit.

spk_0 It felt like a bolt of lightning went through me.

spk_0 And I looked at him.

spk_0 And he went, how do you feel about it?

spk_0 How to percent?

spk_0 Got my stuff down the helicopter.

spk_0 Made it through all that.

spk_0 The screws ended up backing out going through my tea band a couple months later.

spk_0 Had another surgery and just, just a long history of things that happened to me.

spk_0 But it really got you used to, we talked about it before.

spk_0 Are you hurt or are you injured?

spk_0 I got to the point very, very fast in the sealed teams.

spk_0 I could not tell the difference.

spk_0 I don't know the difference.

spk_0 Everything hurts.

spk_0 Everything's got a limitation.

spk_0 And I'm just pushing through it regardless.

spk_0 And again, it's not like I'm a unicorn.

spk_0 If the amount of people over the need,

spk_0 major reconstructive surgeries, eight out of 10.

spk_0 Everybody needs it.

spk_0 And they just don't do it because you have an appointment coming up.

spk_0 Or you have a trip you can't miss.

spk_0 There's something going on the way you can't miss it.

spk_0 So you sacrifice yourself.

spk_0 Just don't do it.

spk_0 The same thing was happening.

spk_0 I had a gnarly shoulder dislocation, blew it out.

spk_0 Had to have major reconstructive surgery.

spk_0 I had an admin wound four around the plastic surgery.

spk_0 Couldn't get it to close.

spk_0 I mean, all the complications are happening.

spk_0 After the shoulder surgery, it was so bad.

spk_0 Medical retirement was imminent.

spk_0 So hey, we're going to medically retire you.

spk_0 Same benefits if you do 20 years.

spk_0 But you can't do this job anymore.

spk_0 They wanted to fuse my lower back, my neck.

spk_0 Shoulder surgery, shoulder surgery, double hip surgery.

spk_0 So I had three years of surgeries lined up.

spk_0 It's like, I'm not going to sit here and rehab for three years doing surgeries.

spk_0 Taken up a swat.

spk_0 I'm not doing it.

spk_0 I was like, I'll just get out.

spk_0 I'll retire it.

spk_0 I'll deal with it on my own.

spk_0 That's kind of the whole process.

spk_0 So I got put on a laundry list of medications.

spk_0 60-something pills a day, probably 25-30 different prescriptions.

spk_0 We were on goodness.

spk_0 I mean, Symbolta, Adderall, Gapapin, Heavy, Heavy Doses.

spk_0 Symbolta.

spk_0 I got you on it.

spk_0 Antidepressin.

spk_0 Oh, yeah.

spk_0 And yeah, Symbolta, when you come off Symbolta,

spk_0 Symbolta gives you the jolt.

spk_0 Oh.

spk_0 Yeah, Symbolta is the treat.

spk_0 Lyrica, I've been on everything.

spk_0 Amitripleine to sleep, taking a heavy dose of those.

spk_0 Ambien, obviously, everything.

spk_0 Everything in between.

spk_0 You take it all.

spk_0 And you don't realize that you're smashed all day.

spk_0 Because you're not hitting alcohol.

spk_0 You don't realize that you're processing pharmaceuticals 24 hours a day, every single day, 52 weeks out of year.

spk_0 You don't realize it.

spk_0 You're not sober.

spk_0 And that was my hardest thing to kind of walk away with is I came out of the rehab program.

spk_0 They put me on these medications and I felt like a million bucks.

spk_0 I got really hurt in 2013.

spk_0 Amnesia, forgetting where I was at.

spk_0 And I went down and they gave me these pills and I felt like Jesus came down and touched me.

spk_0 You gave me Adderall and Symbolta.

spk_0 Okay, what else you have?

spk_0 Oh, we got this.

spk_0 We got this.

spk_0 We got, give them to me.

spk_0 Steliate gangly in blocks.

spk_0 So my throat, give it to me.

spk_0 Raky, give it to me.

spk_0 Anything you have, I'll do it.

spk_0 There's not a protocol on the planet.

spk_0 I have not done.

spk_0 And I've done about 100% full value.

spk_0 And they buy you a little bit of relief.

spk_0 We got to the point where I was taking so many different medications.

spk_0 A bunch of them.

spk_0 You were not allowed to take together.

spk_0 And I had a new doctor came in.

spk_0 He's trying to read the low-my prescriptions.

spk_0 And he's like, you can't take these four medications in combination.

spk_0 He's like, it'll give you a stroke.

spk_0 You get a little kill.

spk_0 And I went, well, it's 2019.

spk_0 I've been taking them since 2010.

spk_0 I have to keep taking these.

spk_0 You're going to have to have a med wash out.

spk_0 They send me down the Walter Reed 70s to the Neurobehavioral ward.

spk_0 I don't know that.

spk_0 I think it's like a team guy clinic.

spk_0 We're going to go work on shoulder mobility and whatever else.

spk_0 Because I just came after.

spk_0 I could help it.

spk_0 You know, I was.

spk_0 You don't know, right?

spk_0 I don't know.

spk_0 I go down there.

spk_0 They start taking my shoe laces.

spk_0 They take everything I have in my...

spk_0 What is this?

spk_0 I mean, there's phytoopilots in there.

spk_0 And those are green berazers in there.

spk_0 I went through sears school.

spk_0 I don't need this.

spk_0 Sears out of dead.

spk_0 Torture training.

spk_0 Yeah.

spk_0 I don't know why I'm doing this.

spk_0 They don't tell me it's a neurobehavioral ward.

spk_0 They tell me it's for a med wash out.

spk_0 He's like, hey, you're going to go there.

spk_0 He's like, you're going to focus on shoulder rehab.

spk_0 Because that was a gnarly shoulder surgery.

spk_0 He's like, they're going to focus on that.

spk_0 We'll get you washed out of these meds.

spk_0 We'll come back.

spk_0 You'll be in a good spot.

spk_0 Medical retirement.

spk_0 Transition next phase.

spk_0 Awesome.

spk_0 I went into that hospital, broken.

spk_0 My eyes were jet black.

spk_0 I was 180 pounds.

spk_0 Just death warmed over.

spk_0 I didn't want to do anything.

spk_0 And I'd laid in that hospital bed.

spk_0 And I had these...

spk_0 I had the most amazing nursing staff.

spk_0 And I laid down that bed.

spk_0 I started getting sick.

spk_0 And I was like, ah, confuute boys.

spk_0 Throwing up.

spk_0 Pissing myself.

spk_0 I mean, the whole thing.

spk_0 And I remember throwing up in this bucket.

spk_0 It was beautiful black nurse.

spk_0 It has this wet wash floss.

spk_0 And she's washing my face off.

spk_0 And I was like, I don't know what I ate.

spk_0 I was like, I'm so sorry.

spk_0 I feel so embarrassed.

spk_0 And she's like, it's okay.

spk_0 It's okay.

spk_0 And I was like, I haven't eaten anything.

spk_0 I was like, I never get food poisoning.

spk_0 And she's like, oh, man.

spk_0 It's okay.

spk_0 And I can remember the looks she gave me.

spk_0 Like, you have no idea why you're here.

spk_0 Wow.

spk_0 I was like that for probably 10 days.

spk_0 Around the 10th or 11th day, I finally came out of my room.

spk_0 I got sunglasses on.

spk_0 My photophobia was so bad.

spk_0 If you shine light my eyes, I'd throw up.

spk_0 And like, my TBI was controlling everything I had.

spk_0 It wasn't sleepy and had insomnia.

spk_0 I had everything you could have.

spk_0 And that was the first time in a decade I had been truly sober.

spk_0 No booze, no nicotine, no pharmaceuticals of any kind.

spk_0 And that was my baseline.

spk_0 And if you would have given me the ability,

spk_0 I would have closed out that chapter right then.

spk_0 I was done.

spk_0 I could not believe what I had done to myself,

spk_0 what I had turned myself into.

spk_0 And there's no way to get better.

spk_0 Like, I'm stuck like this.

spk_0 And now you're going to kick me out of the only thing that I've ever loved.

spk_0 What am I supposed to do now?

spk_0 Rock bottom.

spk_0 And we started spinning up our therapy.

spk_0 So I had, I've been there before we'd done our therapy before.

spk_0 And I found it really beneficial.

spk_0 And actually the, the red cross used to bring me in dogs.

spk_0 They'd bring me in a same-er-nord drop in my bedroom.

spk_0 And I just, I do dog therapy for a little bit.

spk_0 And she's like, do you want to do our therapy?

spk_0 And I was like, I'd love to.

spk_0 And she's like, well, what do you want?

spk_0 I'm just like, I'd really love a skateboard.

spk_0 And they snuck me out of that hospital, not supposed to.

spk_0 And they drove me down this little skate shop right outside of a Walter Reed.

spk_0 And there's a skate shop there.

spk_0 And I walk in, you know, I've got my gown and stuff on.

spk_0 Like, I'm all, I'm all jacked up.

spk_0 Hair super long, beard's long, I was like a hobo.

spk_0 And I told the guy in my story.

spk_0 I was like, hey, I grew up skateboarding.

spk_0 Like, it was my passion.

spk_0 And I really would love to have a skateboard just to paint your therapy.

spk_0 Yeah.

spk_0 Because I got a couple of bolts in my femur that ripped through a couple of tendons.

spk_0 And you know, I just got, got detoxed and didn't realize it.

spk_0 And I'm here.

spk_0 Can I ride a skateboard?

spk_0 Love it.

spk_0 So he gives me a bunch of blanks skateboard.

spk_0 When I go back and I'm paper mache, I'm doing hands coming out of them.

spk_0 Just a bunch of really dark demonic stuff.

spk_0 But I felt so good when I came out my best friend, Cole Fackler.

spk_0 So, and guy I started to drive skates with and I had GVRS with.

spk_0 We went to Buds together.

spk_0 He grew up in Virginia Beach with me.

spk_0 And so we've been thickest these for 25 years now.

spk_0 And he's like, open up an LLC.

spk_0 He opens up the backside and he's like, let's just make skateboarding your art therapy.

spk_0 So we had an artist come on board.

spk_0 We'd start drawing motivational things.

spk_0 You know, old school UDT, stuff for firemen, stuff for police officers, memorial skateboards.

spk_0 And then I found for actual burning.

spk_0 So you essentially take a microwave transformer, pull it out and you hook it up the jumper cables.

spk_0 And then run a lead out to an octopus out with like 110.

spk_0 So when I clip it on top of the wood and I pour an electrolyte solution on it.

spk_0 Coca-Cola baking soda with warm water was my favorite.

spk_0 And I hit it.

spk_0 It'll burn the wood grain and they'll connect.

spk_0 Scrub all that out, fill with resin.

spk_0 Just make these beautiful pieces.

spk_0 And that was my art therapy.

spk_0 I could set there in burn skateboards all day every day.

spk_0 It was amazing.

spk_0 It truly changed my life.

spk_0 And I don't know why I didn't grow a baron electricity.

spk_0 Obviously I'm not very good at it.

spk_0 And it was something about having to set there in sand the lacquer off that skateboard.

spk_0 I mean, I'd buy brand new skateboards.

spk_0 I'd sand the entire graphic off of it and then we'd burn them.

spk_0 You have to sand them off.

spk_0 You'd have to rinse them.

spk_0 Wait 24 hours.

spk_0 Pour the resin.

spk_0 Wait 24 hours.

spk_0 Sand them off.

spk_0 Pour it again 24 hours.

spk_0 It's a seven day process to make one board.

spk_0 And we'd bring in guys who were transitioning.

spk_0 They'd do it too.

spk_0 It's their form of art therapy.

spk_0 And I felt like I was making a difference.

spk_0 And I'm scheduled to retire at the end of August 2019.

spk_0 This is Father's Day.

spk_0 So was that into...

spk_0 Is it mid June?

spk_0 Is that right?

spk_0 Yeah.

spk_0 So I was like that.

spk_0 Right before I'm scheduled to retire.

spk_0 Father's Day morning around 9 a.m.

spk_0 I've been up since five burning skateboards.

spk_0 I've got a big bay window that looks at my backyard.

spk_0 And I've got these sea saws set up these boards.

spk_0 And I've got an EOD guy, explosive warden sky from maybe.

spk_0 He's making a paddles for retirement.

spk_0 So he comes over there covered in lacquer.

spk_0 And I'm like, you know what, man, I can't burn them

spk_0 while they have the lacquer.

spk_0 So he's got a sander out.

spk_0 I've been burning.

spk_0 So I unplugged my machine.

spk_0 He plugs into my office class out and sanding down the lacquer.

spk_0 When he's done, I'll clip in.

spk_0 I'll burn him real quick.

spk_0 He'll finish him off.

spk_0 And my wife will never forget.

spk_0 I look up and she bangs on the window.

spk_0 And she's like, it's Father's Day.

spk_0 Supposed to go eat brunch.

spk_0 And I was like, last burn, last burn.

spk_0 He had unplugged the sander and plugged in my machine

spk_0 into the hospital and now there's a charge going to it.

spk_0 It's sitting on the ground.

spk_0 I don't know it.

spk_0 And the way I run the protocol is there's no electricity running

spk_0 to it.

spk_0 So you can put these things in your mouth.

spk_0 There's no electricity.

spk_0 So I pick them up to adjust them.

spk_0 Because then I'm going to walk back, plug it in.

spk_0 Everybody's clear.

spk_0 Flip the outlet.

spk_0 And when I readjust it, the whole thing lit me up.

spk_0 I had them both hands.

spk_0 You closed the circuit.

spk_0 Yep.

spk_0 So they were live on the lead just sitting on the ground.

spk_0 I didn't know it.

spk_0 So I went to readjust them.

spk_0 I made contact with them.

spk_0 And it spun me around and I faced them, but this far away.

spk_0 And I can remember the back of my head was trying to touch my tailbone.

spk_0 And I was trying to fight it.

spk_0 I could feel my teeth heating up.

spk_0 And I was squeezing this thing as hard as I could.

spk_0 And I heard a pop pop.

spk_0 And I stepped back.

spk_0 It was my collarbone shattering from flex.

spk_0 My scapula.

spk_0 They both shattered.

spk_0 But in the process, you take a hose and you wash off all the ash.

spk_0 So right behind me is ankle deep standing water.

spk_0 And now I'm holding on to the saying, I stepped back.

spk_0 And my wife, both my kids are turned around watching me from eight feet away.

spk_0 I pop up.

spk_0 I levitate.

spk_0 And it launches me about 20 feet across my backyard still holding on to the leads.

spk_0 He, thank God, has a way with all to unplug it.

spk_0 So when I wake up, my hair stands straight up.

spk_0 My hands are smoking and I exhale and all this smoke came out of my mouth.

spk_0 And I remember laying on the ground and he's right in my face and he goes,

spk_0 you know where you're at.

spk_0 And I said, on the ground.

spk_0 And he went, can you move?

spk_0 And I went, my shoulder's dislocated for sure.

spk_0 And he said, you set up.

spk_0 And I went, help me.

spk_0 And he pulled me up.

spk_0 And as soon as he put pressure on me, I could feel my scapula just gravel.

spk_0 I could feel this all hanging in there.

spk_0 My hands are smoking like so it blew out of my finger, blew out of this bum.

spk_0 It fused my tendon to the nerve bundle.

spk_0 So it was stuck like this.

spk_0 I couldn't move anything up here.

spk_0 He stands me up and I tell him I'm going to drive myself to the hospital.

spk_0 My wife is freaking out.

spk_0 They're trying to unplug the machine.

spk_0 You know, my kids are running out there and I don't want them to see me like this.

spk_0 I don't have a shirt on.

spk_0 I don't even have shoes.

spk_0 I'm just got a pair of shorts and my shorts were on fire.

spk_0 So I had little ingrown hairs in my thighs.

spk_0 Electricity was shooting out of those and caught my shorts on fire.

spk_0 Anywhere I had them.

spk_0 So I had to top my head.

spk_0 One next, my nether region.

spk_0 I mean, just exit shots coming out of my body.

spk_0 I don't know anything about electricity, but it's not good.

spk_0 And I take a turn and I've probably got a walk.

spk_0 Maybe 35, 40 feet to my car.

spk_0 So he's in there with my wife trying to get the keys, trying to get me in there.

spk_0 And I turn and I step to the door.

spk_0 Have you seen Kill Bill?

spk_0 Remember the five-finger death touch?

spk_0 Five steps.

spk_0 I took one step and everything went...

spk_0 I took another one and it started closing and everything started going black.

spk_0 I was like, oh God.

spk_0 Third step and I was like, oh no.

spk_0 Fourth.

spk_0 Fifth and I'm looking through a toilet paper straw.

spk_0 I'm like, oh my God.

spk_0 I took one more step and everything went black.

spk_0 And I was in total blindness.

spk_0 Staying out there.

spk_0 I'm opening my eyes as wide as I can and I'm panicking.

spk_0 I can hear my wife running through the house screaming.

spk_0 I can hear him running around screaming, trying to get everything together.

spk_0 And I'm stuck on the side of my house like this is shaking.

spk_0 I can't see anything.

spk_0 And I start power breathing.

spk_0 It's deep and as hard as I can and I saw a little speck of light.

spk_0 And I just kept doing it.

spk_0 It just forced it.

spk_0 It inhaled the nose and mouth.

spk_0 It's as much as I can.

spk_0 It started to open up, open up, open up.

spk_0 And probably 20 breaths into it.

spk_0 It was like I had superhuman vision.

spk_0 It was like I was interconnected with everything on the planet.

spk_0 It was like I had a DMT trip.

spk_0 Everything was super vibrant.

spk_0 I was totally aware of my whole body.

spk_0 I knew everything had just happened to me.

spk_0 I could recall things from in the past.

spk_0 And I knew everything was going to be fun.

spk_0 I'm good.

spk_0 I walk right over the truck.

spk_0 I open up the car.

spk_0 I get inside it.

spk_0 We hit every single speed bump and pothole from there until the ER.

spk_0 Just jocin around.

spk_0 You can hear my ear.

spk_0 I was a little messed up.

spk_0 Shoulders.

spk_0 So I walked through the ER in Princess Anne Santara in Virginia Beach.

spk_0 It has an amazing staff.

spk_0 What they also have is a staff of really, really beautiful nurses.

spk_0 But now it's COVID.

spk_0 So now everybody has a mask on.

spk_0 And all you can see of their eyes.

spk_0 And they had the most beautiful eyes I've ever seen.

spk_0 And I'm laying on my back.

spk_0 I walk in and they can see it.

spk_0 And I'm like, if one of the nurses made a comment,

spk_0 it's like, who brought in Barbara Q?

spk_0 It's my hands.

spk_0 Like they're melted.

spk_0 Like they're smoking.

spk_0 It's so bad.

spk_0 It's making me nauseous to think about it.

spk_0 They give me that table.

spk_0 And I'll never forget this nurse came over and spun her face.

spk_0 And she goes, I'm so surprised you still have a penis.

spk_0 It's a what?

spk_0 And she went, honey, when you get electrocuted, usually fingers come off.

spk_0 Your nose comes off.

spk_0 Everything comes off of you.

spk_0 And she's like, as far as we can tell, you're intact.

spk_0 And you haven't lost anything right now.

spk_0 She's like, move your fingers and move and everything.

spk_0 Open on mouth.

spk_0 Can you hear?

spk_0 I can hear.

spk_0 And she's like, okay, well here we go.

spk_0 They ran to me.

spk_0 I think I took an ambulance ride.

spk_0 I kind of blacked out for a little bit.

spk_0 And then I woke up in the burn unit in Norfolk.

spk_0 And I had the specialist came in.

spk_0 My wife is now with me.

spk_0 We're laying there.

spk_0 Double slings.

spk_0 Trying to identify how bad everything is.

spk_0 They know we've got to do an emergency surgery on all this.

spk_0 And he goes, DJ.

spk_0 So this is after my two months with Vernon.

spk_0 So this is the best physical condition I've ever been in.

spk_0 So I came from 180, non-220, 6% body fat.

spk_0 I'm in phenomenal shape.

spk_0 Like, I don't need to retire.

spk_0 I could probably still suit it up again.

spk_0 And non-lainless hospital bed.

spk_0 Out the shape of the photos.

spk_0 And he walks in.

spk_0 He's like, you know what, rap dough is.

spk_0 And I said, yeah.

spk_0 And he goes, when you get electrocuted, your body releases an enzyme.

spk_0 Everybody has, but it multiplies rapidly.

spk_0 And your muscles liquefy and they go toxic.

spk_0 Then they go septic.

spk_0 And you die.

spk_0 Your issue is, you're big dude.

spk_0 If these enzyme markers hit this level,

spk_0 I got to start cutting stuff out of you, man.

spk_0 Taken muscle off.

spk_0 Yeah, he's like pecs, lats, shoulders, delts, hamstrings, quads.

spk_0 Like, so every hour, I'm coming back here.

spk_0 And we had to start doing these enzyme markers.

spk_0 So I'm laying in that bed.

spk_0 Can't move.

spk_0 I can't run.

spk_0 Can't do anything.

spk_0 And I'm looking at my wife.

spk_0 And I'm just imagining Dr. Gervorky coming in here and chopping me up in little pieces.

spk_0 I've never been in a low spot like that.

spk_0 Outside of being stuck behind that tie with Maddie,

spk_0 this is the first time since then where I was a true victim of circumstance.

spk_0 There's nothing I can do to prevent this.

spk_0 There's no magic pill I can take.

spk_0 There's nowhere to run.

spk_0 There's nothing I can do.

spk_0 I'm either in a landless hospital bed.

spk_0 I'm going to let that dude come in here and chop me up in the pieces.

spk_0 And I'm just consumed with anger, guilt, envy.

spk_0 I just don't want to be here right now.

spk_0 And he came back in the hour and he's like,

spk_0 levels are good.

spk_0 Levels are good.

spk_0 Came back next hour.

spk_0 Levels are good.

spk_0 Third hour.

spk_0 Fourth hour.

spk_0 Fifth hour.

spk_0 And he's like, DJ, every person on the planet has this enzyme in your body, everyone.

spk_0 Not only is yours not climbing, not increasing.

spk_0 There's not a trace of in your body now.

spk_0 He's like, I've never seen anything like it.

spk_0 He's like, hmm.

spk_0 Tomorrow morning you're free to go.

spk_0 Okay.

spk_0 They planned the surgery.

spk_0 They put in two plates, twenty-something screws, did the whole thing,

spk_0 but didn't have to chop me up.

spk_0 And, you know, from talking to all the other people,

spk_0 typically people get electrocuted by one touch.

spk_0 So this arm comes off, you know, rib cages blow open.

spk_0 They were like, we don't know if it's because you had leads in both hands

spk_0 and you just completed a circuit and were able to ride it.

spk_0 We don't know what would happen if you would have held it for another second and a half.

spk_0 Where's your heart starting and stopping?

spk_0 Just the perfect timing.

spk_0 All the stars had to rely on you to be here right now and it's a medical mystery.

spk_0 So I took it with that, medical mystery.

spk_0 And now we're here.

spk_0 But I had to walk back in.

spk_0 So I get dropped off my house and this is where Vernon really comes into play.

spk_0 As I'm sitting in my house in double slings, I've got two kids.

spk_0 I've got a wife.

spk_0 I've got no income.

spk_0 I've got no job.

spk_0 I've got no one that can hire me and I can't do anything physically.

spk_0 Nothing.

spk_0 I'm just landing there in mental health straight down the tube.

spk_0 And I'm landing at my kitchen table just feeling absolutely the worst I've ever felt.

spk_0 And I get a gimp up to the door, open up the door and there's my trainer Vernon.

spk_0 He's like, how are you doing?

spk_0 Big guy.

spk_0 Not good.

spk_0 He's like, gizzling this half ass tug.

spk_0 We walk in the kitchen.

spk_0 We're sitting down and he's like, talk me through it.

spk_0 I was like, I can't do anything.

spk_0 He's like, okay.

spk_0 Well, now that we've established out, what can you do?

spk_0 It's like nothing.

spk_0 Can you make a fist?

spk_0 You know, my hands are all bandaged up.

spk_0 I was like, yeah, I need to just, can you move your wrist?

spk_0 Yeah.

spk_0 Anyway, can you walk?

spk_0 I can walk.

spk_0 He's like, perfect.

spk_0 Pulls out his back pocket.

spk_0 This little blue two pound dumbbell.

spk_0 And he sticks it in my fingertips.

spk_0 He's like, curl it.

spk_0 And I curled up my did a wrist curl.

spk_0 And he went, roll your hand over.

spk_0 Okay.

spk_0 So we can do grip and we can walk.

spk_0 Here we go.

spk_0 And we did that every single day until I could pressurize my upper body enough

spk_0 to where a sneeze wouldn't cripple me.

spk_0 And then we were straight back in the gym.

spk_0 So I'd walk in, double slings.

spk_0 He's like, the only thing we can do is belt squats, lunges, and mobility.

spk_0 That's all we're going to do.

spk_0 You're about squatting in double slings.

spk_0 Uh-huh.

spk_0 But I walk in.

spk_0 So you're not holding on to the whole.

spk_0 It's none of that.

spk_0 I can't do anything.

spk_0 So I'd literally walk in.

spk_0 I'd step through like a whole of hoop.

spk_0 He would bring it up around me.

spk_0 I'd step on the platform.

spk_0 I'd squat down.

spk_0 He'd clip me in.

spk_0 I'd stand up.

spk_0 He'd un-rocket.

spk_0 I'd do my set.

spk_0 Re-rocket.

spk_0 He'd take the belt off me over and over.

spk_0 And he rebuilt me back every single day, five days a week.

spk_0 And we have never missed a session together since 2019.

spk_0 Never.

spk_0 Save my life, man.

spk_0 That is awesome.

spk_0 He is the best human.

spk_0 He's been more of a life coach than a strength coach.

spk_0 Yeah, unbelievable.

spk_0 And without him, if he wouldn't have walked him without two pound dumbbells,

spk_0 I told that story.

spk_0 The tactical strength and condition conference.

spk_0 Like, no one does that.

spk_0 No one is going to come over during that moment and push you.

spk_0 Everybody's going to walk over and put down.

spk_0 I'm so sorry for you.

spk_0 Oh, I can't believe this happened.

spk_0 Not him.

spk_0 It's like, control things you can't control.

spk_0 Can you make a fist?

spk_0 Can you turn your wrist?

spk_0 Risk girls and 20 minute walks.

spk_0 Here we go.

spk_0 And that's what we did every single day.

spk_0 Bounce it all the way back.

spk_0 I mean, he's been there.

spk_0 Had to get a surgery on my hand.

spk_0 Had to rebuild this whole hand, all the strength.

spk_0 And everything we've had to do, the stomach, the kidney, everything in between.

spk_0 He's been there for how many years ago was that that roughly?

spk_0 That was in 2019.

spk_0 So what is that?

spk_0 It's not long ago.

spk_0 Six years.

spk_0 And now you're feeling great.

spk_0 Super robust.

spk_0 We'll talk about your training now.

spk_0 And what people can do with that training.

spk_0 I've gleaned a lot of really useful information about your from your current training program

spk_0 about setting standards.

spk_0 And that is a wild ride.

spk_0 I always say like, at least give me a cool story with it.

spk_0 Like, did I get this kidney thing going on?

spk_0 Not a cool story.

spk_0 Electrocution, it's a cool story.

spk_0 You know, it's a feel good story at the end.

spk_0 It wasn't going through it.

spk_0 But, you know, so round yourself with people better than you.

spk_0 And they'll definitely pull you out of them.

spk_0 I mean, it's a deficit of spare.

spk_0 I mean, it's an amazing story.

spk_0 At one point, I thought when you made the return to the skateboarding thing,

spk_0 I thought, oh, you're gonna start skateboarding again.

spk_0 You feel it almost, it almost kills you.

spk_0 And didn't even have trucks and wheels on the thing yet.

spk_0 Exactly.

spk_0 Oh, man.

spk_0 I'm gonna take a second to absorb all that.

spk_0 I was gonna ask you this later when we talk about, I began in DMT.

spk_0 And some of the emerging therapeutics were PTSD, substance abuse, and other things that veterans

spk_0 are really fully embracing now.

spk_0 And are making a clear march toward broader treatment of mental health issues.

spk_0 But I'll ask you now, and I'll probably ask you again later, at any point in this,

spk_0 or headed into this whole set of things, setbacks and comebacks,

spk_0 did you have feelings of higher power?

spk_0 I mean, I don't want to put you on the spot, but were you raised religious to believe in God?

spk_0 Any of that?

spk_0 I mean, you know, were it not for the fact that a very, very seriously scientifically educated friend of mine,

spk_0 or Stanford Medical School, Harvard Medical, who was a lifetime atheist, turned to me recently,

spk_0 and he said, you know, he said, in his words, I believe in miracles.

spk_0 And I said, miracle miracles are medical miracles, and he said, miracle miracles.

spk_0 He said, really you of all people?

spk_0 And he said, yeah, I believe in, and I said, how?

spk_0 And he said, because I don't want to be a hold this person is out of, you know, his right to talk about these things,

spk_0 but he said out, because of his math training, he said, you know, that some of the things he's seen and experienced

spk_0 have exceeded probability statistics that it's impossible for the, literally impossible for these things to happen.

spk_0 This isn't, you know, one in a trillion or one in ten trillion, that it, that some of these miracles go beyond what chance could provide intersecting chances.

spk_0 And so, you know, to hear a story like yours, people will come up with their own interpretations,

spk_0 and I'm a scientist, I believe in science, I do happen to believe in God, but it's an individual choice for everybody.

spk_0 But did you ever step back and wonder whether or not, in addition to Vernon, in addition to Maddie,

spk_0 in addition to your teammates, in addition to your wife, whose father happened to be a team guy?

spk_0 I mean, there's some things around Virginia Beach, they could have predicted that perhaps, but did you ever pause and just go, yeah, maybe there are forces beyond everything I can see that are watching out.

spk_0 Not for me, because you've had a number of second, third, fourth chances that starting to sound miraculous.

spk_0 They are. We didn't grow up religious at all. I was always spiritual, always.

spk_0 And I mean, you experience things in life that can't be, can't be explained.

spk_0 And then when you see religious people, well, that's a miracle. Is it a miracle? Am I just lucky?

spk_0 You start to look at them, and then you do five and me, you know, DMT, and you realize, yeah, yeah, it's got to be, it's got to be real.

spk_0 Like there has to be a higher power. There has to be something that's pulling the strings. It's making this happen.

spk_0 Like, divining invention. There's no reason I should be here after that. After this, this, you add up all these things, like, this is not a chance.

spk_0 Like, why? Like, what am I supposed to be doing here? How am I supposed to pay that forward?

spk_0 Like, if somebody's pulling the strings to make sure I'm setting this seat, what am I doing to make sure I'm not wasting this opportunity?

spk_0 But I mean, it definitely makes you question. I mean, I definitely see why guys get, I don't say hung up on religion, but when they, they really buy it, they really turn the page, you know, like, how much of that is just for TV?

spk_0 None of it with that guy. Right? Like, he felt it. He saw the change and, I mean, I've seen too many miracles happen.

spk_0 I'm going to believe that somebody's not blind. Some things not blind.

spk_0 Yeah, appreciate you sharing that. I realize that, especially on a science health podcast, and we talk about other things, but it's talked about it more and more recently.

spk_0 Just, I mean, I can't help but be a curious human being and wonder about these things.

spk_0 Whatever the case may be, you made it through. You retired. You didn't imagine. If your wife had heard that you were not going to retire, I mean, I like to think that nothing can break your guys' marriage.

spk_0 But man, that's got that's a lot to bear. She was over it. Yeah, with the kids seeing this.

spk_0 Yeah, you know, and I had turned myself into something that I was, I wasn't proud of.

spk_0 You know, I talk about dials, not switches. Be able to power down, power it up, power it off. I never did that.

spk_0 So she got to see the transition from being at Silteen 10 and then going into the Tier 1 organization and what that does with you.

spk_0 The pressure to perform, the performance on demand, it changed you. It has to. You can't be the same person you were at 17, 19, 20, and then do that job. You can't. You have to be able to change.

spk_0 And I think a lot of that, it was just, it was wearing her down. I mean, I was going so much and a lot of that. I try to explain to the guys now, like, don't do what I did.

spk_0 I would go on every single trip I could because I was living these multiple different lots. Like I would go out to Arizona and I would skydive for months on end.

spk_0 I mean, I think I did almost 4,000 jumps in seven years. Like we went, we turned the page and that's deploying. That's every other training trip. That's just sacrificing every weekend and making big pushes out there.

spk_0 But when you go, no one knows who you are. They don't know what you do for a job. They just think you're a normal Scott ever. Like we're doing these big way for nations and, you know, trying out for world records and doing all this stuff and it's amazing.

spk_0 But it just takes you so far away from that person I have to be in Virginia Beach and become addicted to it. And then when I go here, I can be someone else completely. No one knows who I am. I go in this trip. No one knows who I am. You don't talk about the job. You do. You make of a line.

spk_0 I'll throw them out there and it'll make them all mad. We tell everybody you're part of the Red Bull Air Force. Red Bull Air Force. Yeah. Like we skydive with all the boys. We know them all. And because you skydive enough, you can speak to Lingo. Like they see you out all the drop zones. They see.

spk_0 You can fake that really, really well. Some guys will be a hot air balloon pilot. You'll be an MMA fighter. You'll be a hockey team where we had real long hair.

spk_0 You can adopt these different personas. And I think a lot of that is just trying to compartmentalize what you have back home.

spk_0 Just where I don't have to think about it. Because you'll literally, I mean, your buddies will tell you you'll be sitting on the couch at two o'clock in the afternoon. And when that pager goes off, you're gone. Right now.

spk_0 Like you got 30 minutes. There's no goodbye. There's no, oh, let me swim by work. A quick and give you one kiss. You don't go in fishing. Jumping a car and you're gone. And you got to be able to shut it off.

spk_0 It's very, very hard to do when you're so obsessed with being the best husband and the best father.

spk_0 You can't shut that off. The whole flight in. Just think about it. If this happens, this happens. How my daughter is going to react like, oh my God, they're going to come here. What point of the day? She's going to get the news. How?

spk_0 What do they get me? I'm not going to be there for the marriage. I can be here for this. This. You start to think about everything you're going to miss. Cloud your judgment. And it makes you hesitate at that moment.

spk_0 You can't. You can't hesitate, especially when no one else does and you paint that in your mind. Nobody else in here is thinking about being a full-time dad or a full-time husband right now.

spk_0 Nobody cares if I'm a 63% husband. Nobody cares. They need me to do this job at 100% because that's what this craft deserves.

spk_0 But it turns you into something you don't want to be long term. It's hard, man. But she was done. She was begging for me to hang it up.

spk_0 Because all of our friends are dying. And then all the guys that transition now, they started doing contract and job. They're getting killed. They're getting shot. We're picking them from the hospital.

spk_0 What else are you going to do? There's no retirement club. You don't know work at home depot. What are you going to do? I only know how to do this one thing. And that was a play. And I was going to retire and start contracting with one of the government agencies. And essentially do the same job I do now. Just make a little bit better money, a little bit better schedule. And one thing led to another and ended up not doing it.

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spk_0 I want to talk about I began DMT mental health, but first I want to talk a little bit about posture.

spk_0 Recently, I heard you talking about physical posture in the gym literally form and how upright one is with their stance or squat and how that translates to mental posture.

spk_0 It was the first time I've ever heard anyone talk about translating the physical into the mental in this way.

spk_0 So if you don't mind, how do you think about mental posture and physical posture and how the two intersect?

spk_0 I think in that analogy, the metaphor I used physical posture, if you think if I stay in feet shoulder with the park and I put a barbell on me, you slide on 45s.

spk_0 I'm strong. Two more 45s. I'm strong. You could load up 800, 900 pounds and I could sit there and hold it.

spk_0 Or if you put 315 pounds on it, I can drop but the floor and I can squat it. If I hold it at 90 degrees and you add on a 45, it feels like a ton.

spk_0 You start adding on tens, everything starts to quiver. I used the same thing as my mental health.

spk_0 If I wake up in the morning, I've set my morning routine and I'm firing on all-aid cylinders. You can stack on everything on top of me because I'm in an optimal state.

spk_0 I can take it just like I'm in a full posture. Just keep giving it to me. Keep giving it to me. If I wake up my morning routine is not there, I start reading some hateful stuff in the morning.

spk_0 Don't have a good input with my wife first thing. I'm stuck behind the school bus, late my first meeting. Now you hand me a parking ticket. It feels like the world is collapsing on top of me and I can't do anything for it.

spk_0 So throughout the entire day, that's the whole purpose of the micro-win kind of formula.

spk_0 Stack up as many wins to put yourself in an optimal headspace because reality isn't going to know. It's going to smack you either way.

spk_0 If I keep myself blocking everything that's externally toxic to me, when something does get put on me that I have to wear, I'm in a good posture to put it on.

spk_0 That jacket, my weight, 55 pounds, I put it on and I'm still strong because I've been dropping off everything that I don't need to wear all day long.

spk_0 But yeah, I mean, but you'll see it. I know you say it, it analyzes people all day long. When people are in a negative headspace, their posture changes, their head drops, their shoulders roll forward, they're always looking at the ground. They're never up processing information.

spk_0 It's because they're dragging whatever just happened all day long. Now you add in one more thing. Your mom's got cancer.

spk_0 You're always going to leave you. Your kids are so, everything just starts to weigh down. It feels like something you'll never get past. Insurmountable, it's at some point.

spk_0 That's all because you'll start to let it slowly but surely chip away at you. It's like control of things you can control. The things you can control, you either avoid them completely or you take them as, that's the reality you have to live through right now.

spk_0 I don't know why you have cancer but you do and you got to get through it.

spk_0 Okay. What positive things do I have? Great relationship with my wife, great relationship with my kids, great relationship with my friends, my social circle is shrunk. Everyone around me is better than me and they want me to be better.

spk_0 Okay. Well, I can take on a whole lot if I don't have a tight circle, no relationship with my wife, ostracized my kids, everything.

spk_0 Now you start to add on that external stress, it cripples me really, really fast and I know I'm not the only one.

spk_0 So when I say it to everybody, whatever you have going on right now, whatever is absorbing all you're bandwidth, it's us too.

spk_0 But you're choosing to wear that jacket all day. You're putting on another one and then another one.

spk_0 And then you had the external pressure of having to provide for a family and be, you know, that emotionally stable, fit your for the household.

spk_0 It's hard to do all day long and a lot of people lose sight of it. And I think that's why so many people close their chapter early.

spk_0 They offer suicide because they think there's no way I can write this ship.

spk_0 It's gone too far right now and I don't want to have to sit here and rebuild it and they close the chapter out.

spk_0 It's like if we could have eliminated all those things and given yourself a breath of fresh air, would you have done the same thing?

spk_0 If I would have grabbed you right before the moment, like this isn't permanent, you can fix this right now.

spk_0 You just have to change these aspects they would.

spk_0 In the moment though, and I've been there, you don't have the clarity, you don't have the vision and a guy told me a long time ago he was, I think a lot of people want to hit the reset button on the Nintendo.

spk_0 Chichang restart, restart the game. You're not restarting the game. It's over forever.

spk_0 And I hate seeing people do it. I think now, you know, after I've come out of the medicine, I've done a bunch of therapy and cut out a lot of toxicity out of my life.

spk_0 I've gotten that breath of fresh air and I'm just, I told Mark's name, the Capone when I came out of the treatment.

spk_0 I'm going to jump on the nearest building. I'm going to shout it from the rooftops like this will help.

spk_0 There is a way out of this funk. It's just one step further than you've currently gone.

spk_0 There's light at the end of that tunnel, just one step further, one step further.

spk_0 And just continuously go and it'll get better.

spk_0 But yeah, for me posture is a huge thing. In combat, it's a huge thing and process and information. It's a huge thing.

spk_0 In dealing with stress, it's a huge thing. I can't let myself collapse.

spk_0 Because once you start adding another pound of me, it hits me to the floor really fast.

spk_0 So control the things you can't control. And a lot of it is just your posture and your perspective.

spk_0 Great message. Would you agree that lying down in bed on one's phone on social media is a very dangerous posture?

spk_0 Because I would argue that. And I also tell guys, if you are going to lay in a fetal position and tweet out how bad your mental health is, stop.

spk_0 Go to Starbucks, go to Whole Foods, walk around and see normal human interaction and tell a stranger yourself and from mental health.

spk_0 They don't do it. You're just going to sit there in a fetal position, feel and sorry for yourself and you think it'll get better tomorrow.

spk_0 It won't. I've already lived that life. I've already painted the picture for you.

spk_0 I've played you the move. You've watched it. It's not going to work.

spk_0 You're going to have to get out of that bed and you're going to have to do something every single day that brings you out of that dark depression.

spk_0 And for me, it's physical movement. If you have the ability to move, move. Go lay in that bed.

spk_0 Don't just sit there and scroll. You know, Vernon says it. You're diets important. Now what you eat, but what you consume visually audio.

spk_0 The music you listen to. We all know there's some music you listen to that just changed you ever so slightly is that the person I need to be walking to the store.

spk_0 Do I need to blur mega depth right now? No, I need to play Ludovico. That's what I need. I need to walk into this room at a hundred percent full capacity and just receive whatever energy is in the room right now.

spk_0 It's hard to do if I'm in the depths of despair right now. So yeah, I try to put myself in a position where I have optimal posture all day.

spk_0 You mentioned Marcus and Amber Capone. Now's probably a good time for us to just reference who they are and the work that you guys have been doing and and anytime I sort of plug something or mention something I want to be very clear.

spk_0 I don't have any formal affiliation to this upcoming Netflix show movie. Is it what film? Excuse me to this upcoming Netflix film.

spk_0 But it's going to be an incredible film. I know this because I've seen bits of it. Maybe just mentioned who Marcus and Amber Capone are and what they've been doing in the film.

spk_0 I do think this is something everyone should see. I'm definitely going to see it and I'll just say that I think their organization veteran solutions is one I've been paying attention to and trying to support in ways I can over the last gosh it's been three, four years and so maybe tell us about Marcus and Amber and the film.

spk_0 So Marcus joined the seal teams right pre 9 11.

spk_0 Mary Amber had a baby right now in the seal teams got station on the East Coast me at silt 10 and you could watch him change throughout the years like everybody else but because he's such a big polarizing figure he's hard to miss me. He's probably six, five, two, five.

spk_0 He's a big guy and he was extremely intimidating, but he always had a light in his eyes. He always seemed like a dude you wanted to be around.

spk_0 And after the conflicts in a multiple deployments mean you see him out in town and his eyes got jet black and he would be a guy that if you were walking on a street and you saw him come out just the way he looked at you you would cross the street.

spk_0 And he became one of those guys I gave the analogy walking to the SPCA and you see that pit bull ears been shaved off their scars all over his face you're not going to put your hand in that cage.

spk_0 Marcus components like that.

spk_0 He leads the seal teams has a very rocky transition gets job and finance moves around and you hear it through the room or know about how bad he's doing.

spk_0 Dranking just not the person you wanted him to be and definitely not the transition you wanted for him and then it got so bad you know suicide was definitely on the table circling the drain drinking way too much just toxic in every way you can imagine.

spk_0 And Amber being the angel that she is starting to research different solutions he did my meditation yoga talk therapy drugs that everything you could and she found I began in five in the DMT and convinced him to go down there.

spk_0 And it was one of those things much like mine you're going to go do this treatment and this is our last attempt and if this doesn't work I'm leaving you.

spk_0 And for a team wife to throw in the towel after the careers over that let you know how bad it is because they have combatted that entire thing we were in the heart of NSW in the heart of the G what and buried more friends you ever count care to count.

spk_0 And after all of that she's finally going to throw in the towel that's how bad he's gotten.

spk_0 And you know you hear that he came back and you wouldn't even recognize him you won't believe what Marcus Capone looks like and I hadn't seen him but you got to understand come from the East Coast and I'm an idealist like I'm a true believer and when you hear that Marcus left the East Coast and went to the West Coast and now he's doing yoga meditation in smoking toad venom you're like West Coast typical I knew you turn him and then you say I'm like that's the best version of Marcus.

spk_0 I've ever seen and he's not a pacifist he can still roll that dial all the way over but he has full control over you know 20 years old flick the Navy seal switch and just live that life till the fullest never had a balance point never needed one never try to adopt one.

spk_0 So during my whole transition.

spk_0 I'll say when he got out they said the woman on that medication for a while because it was so out there and you didn't want to shock the culture didn't want to shock the community and it's taboo doing psychedelics it's not a thing that Navy seals do and I began as a 22 hour psychedelic it's a very

spk_0 yes so terror most people have heard of psilocybin or even LSD or MDMAs and DMT I mean it's a this is as far out there as you possibly can go I'm sure someone sitting there is like another some chemical made in you know but that this it's extreme.

spk_0 It is just like to seal teams you do everything to the extreme and that's where you go.

spk_0 And I was going to a similar thing.

spk_0 But when they came out one of his very good friends Chad Wilkinson committed suicide and I think enough was enough and that was one of his best friends and crippled him and when you see him get the news you can watch at this.

spk_0 I got my trance cry.

spk_0 You can watch that loss affect him in a way that nobody else will understand and he knew he was holding on to the secret like this saved my life in a favor to give him that he'd still be here and I know it.

spk_0 What am I going to do.

spk_0 I got to start a 5 1 C 3 and I got to start saving as many people as humanly possible and selfishly I'm going to save as many seals as humanly possible.

spk_0 And once you saved one save 2 3 4 5 Army Rangers Green Brace fighter pilots they'll just start pouring in here.

spk_0 It's the same trauma doesn't matter how you got it.

spk_0 You're at the brink of it you're going to close this chapter out in this medicine is going to give you that breath it's going to give you that relief to not do it.

spk_0 And they made this little infomercial that was on social media talking about psychic deluxe and I'd heard about it and I kind of white washed it and my wife was at the same point.

spk_0 She was going to leave me and take the two kids and I can't do this anymore and we lay in bed one night and she watched it and she was crying and she leaned over and she made me watch it.

spk_0 I started bawling because I could see the difference the last time I saw Marcus in this market is very very different and she looked over and she goes if you love me you'll go.

spk_0 I'll go to psychedelics and my friends in Mexico sure I never thought it would do anything because I had messed up so much until that point.

spk_0 All the pharmaceuticals all the mistakes I had made the infidelity everything had led me up to that point and I had that secret inside me and I did not have the strength to tell her I didn't want to break her heart about all the things I messed up and for me if you think me going down the Mexico

spk_0 was going to save our marriage I will 100% do it but I never thought for a chance it would never and I went down there with a bunch of guys that were legends inside of the community and you know ambio Trevor Jose Jonathan Brianna everybody ambio life

spk_0 scientists they run the best facility I've ever been a part of in any facility that medicine is so strong and I think that's why guys get such relief it's the only thing stronger than your ego because you've turned yourself into this vessel you think represents the essence of what being a Navy

spk_0 is your heart you determine you'll never lose you'll sacrifice everything right now the group asked you to do it but you won't do it for yourself you'll never put your individual needs above the needs of the group and this is one point we have to you have to go for the good of the group

spk_0 I have to suck up my ego got to suck up my pride and I have to try to kill it right now and we went down there and took that medicine in

spk_0 I have to combat us instructor's names Tom Kair from Seattle touch group if you ever watched the movie the haunted with Denise the old Altoro the night fighting that's what they do when they are the best in the world and Tom Kair is a knowledge transfer specialist he's changed my life in mindset more than anybody else on a planet and he told me a quote the other day that it references this kind of and we were talking about experience he goes

spk_0 if you understand no explanations needed if you don't understand no explanation is possible and that came from Dave Joyce another say out to Cypher and it's the true thing I've ever heard

spk_0 unless you've done I began unless you've done psychedelics and a therapeutic setting you'll have no idea how powerful it is and when I woke up that next day everything I'd ever done negative positive erased everything negative every conversation every bad deed every time I've hurt anybody every time I've made my life

spk_0 cry every time I've not been present was in a forefront of my mind and I felt absolutely care I feel like a monster for everything I had done every time I had not been present every time I sacrificed them for this thing I didn't want to go home and at the same token it was the only time in my life I'd ever been homesick I wanted to teleport and go home and wrap my arms around those three

spk_0 but I was so embarrassed at everything that I had done just no way I can do it I can't go home and break their heart and you have the great day after you do I began I mean it feels like you had to hit by a freight rangers in your fields do to throw an up all day depending on how your experience is the next day you do five in me O DMT and that's the ego deaf you know comes a similar in desert to they milk out the poison glands and that's essentially what you're smoking it's pretty intimidating looks like you're

spk_0 smoking crack rock and that experience when you smoke that it must be like you were finding religion or dines like you almost died with the electrocution and we had a

spk_0 very accomplished neuroscientist on the podcast Christoff Korku talked about he's been saying consciousness for a long time he talked about his experiences on five in me O DMT told dissolution of self total dissolution of space and time but

spk_0 he described that he that the mind was still there but nothing else was there and again if someone hasn't done it I've never done it but if someone hasn't done I'm guessing that no description will will suffice I've heard it like from another team guy being described as being strapped to the shockwave of an atom bomb like you know I've heard a bunch of different descriptions sounds

spk_0 when you come out of that experience however how did that reframe the electrocution the loss of I mean we could spend three days talking about every single guy that you know that's been killed and still probably only touch on a small number of them sadly you know so how does all that get refrained coming out of an experience like that

spk_0 the biggest concern doing I've again was that you were going to be stuck inside of your own thoughts everybody you had lost you're just going to relive it you're going to be in the back of that helicopter you were just going to have to relive that for 24 straight hours and I will tell you that not a single person that I've ever done I've again with his ever had any military experience it's always been your childhood and then reflection of what you done to your wife and kids it gaps it's of done I've again four times I have never had a singular

spk_0 military experience ever nothing childhood childhood big time childhood and then in in the actual medicine it would allow me to relive past events with my father with my mother hard conversations you know blow ups arguments scream things you

spk_0 smash shot things I've forgotten things that were never on my conscious mind and non-reliven them and then it would shift and it would be me doing that exact same thing to my wife to my kids and then it'll put you

spk_0 in their position so when I'm screaming I'm projecting just this hate and this venomous shooting out of me I can be that seven year old little girl and I can feel how frightened she is by what she's watching her father turn into so real empathy that is what it is you become so empathetic to everyone and everything

spk_0 and it's the forefront of your mind like I don't want to go home because now I know what I've done I can't mask anymore there's no more compartmentalization I've done all those things I've said that terrible stuff

spk_0 and I'm never going to be able to re-earn my season table and it's one of those weird predicaments where I want to go home but I don't because I don't want to face that I actually did and said that it's like out of every good thing I've ever done it all got a race on that moment

spk_0 the only thing we're going to focus on is all the bad stuff you've ever done and said so when we came into five in me oh I did six rounds of five in me oh my first time down there every single one is the most painful thing you've ever been a part of

spk_0 it feels introvert says it beautifully down a day and be oh he said whatever's going to happen let it happen if you think you're going to explode explode you think you're going to die die

spk_0 if you think you're going to drown or blast off in the stratosphere do it don't try to control it that medicine will take you exactly where you need to go you just have to let it

spk_0 in every time I would I would start I would scream and then I would cry and convulse throw up and I'd wake up and I'd look around and he'd look at me again

spk_0 hit him again and I do it again and I do it again and it was the very last time I did five in me oh you get him to say I was super depressed

spk_0 and I was most certainly suicidal I did not want to come home in face reality and I took that last one and right before I did I can't remember if it was the nurse or because we said team guys would sit there and hold space for you not taking the medicine just they were there to basically safeguard the house so you could just focus on you

spk_0 because it's hard to be put under essentially anesthesia in a foreign country and you don't know what's going to happen to you so just come here and know and there's team guys around you

spk_0 and he was either the nurse or one of the team guys goes you want to kill yourself right I said yeah he goes and do it do it this right here and I changed my intention for the medicine and I told myself it was this pink toxin this purple toxin I'm going to inhale it I'm going to coat my entire body with this and I'm going to kill myself right here so I don't have to go home

spk_0 and that changed the entire experience for me everything shrunk down jet black in a single white pixel showed up and it exploded it it looked like it was star track taken off all the traces and everything it felt like your sternum broke open and your soul left your body and it was the true ego death and it went from screaming thrashing to complete bliss and love and affection and empathy and compassion and everything

spk_0 and I woke up and I looked at me and I could not believe the way I instantly I mean the most so you've ever been you're not on any medication not cannabis not not an adult nothing you can't be on any medication you go down there so this is true sobriety at its finest when you wake up it's exactly like the electrician

spk_0 everything is more vibrant the table edges are slick and clean like I can feel the taste and texture and I can feel the energy coming out of everybody and it's like I can tell her

spk_0 I can go home and I can confess everything right now because I understand that I have done more good than bad and she's going to see it she just has to see the new me and we went home and you know everything kind of unfolded and all my past and discussions came to life

spk_0 and it was it was the darkest moment for me because I didn't think she was going to take me back and she ends up pulling my sunglasses off she pulls them off and looks me and essentially collapse in my arms like I was back I'd been gone for 15 years and now I'm home

spk_0 and the greatest thing that's ever happened to me and if I wouldn't gone down to Mexico there was no talk therapy there was no meditation there was no cold plunge it was going to get me there it was something stronger than me

spk_0 and when you look back I've been building that physical vessel this mental resilient vessel this entire time so nothing could break me and I needed something stronger than that to break me and the moment it did my whole life changed everything changed

spk_0 and I really became an advocate for the medicine because I've been there I've been sitting in my guest room with that pistol in my lap staring around the ceiling wondering where my brain matter is going to go and what my wife's going to see and how she's going to clean it up and resell the house

spk_0 and just all the things I mean that's where you're at and that's where a lot of guys are and they don't believe they can get a breath of fresh air and that medicine give it to you

spk_0 it is not a cure all you mean you have to go back and restructure your entire life and cut out the toxicity and that was one of the most powerful things we did is I came back from that medicine I sit down the edge of that bed with my wife after we had gone through everything I had done and I went through my phone and we blocked and deleted about 150 people out of my life

spk_0 that's the thing I ever did you're never coming back in here I've been trying to foster and save that relationship the better part of a decade I'm not doing anymore you robbing bandwidth and you're robbing the little time I have left on this planet that I'm going to try to devote to my family because I have to re-er in this seat at the table every single day and it gave me the ability to do that and I came home started preaching about the medicine and then as I started to tell guys you'd see guys that were interesting

spk_0 they were like what it worked for him because I'm a true believer I'm devout and they're like if it worked for him it worked for me but they're scared to go so I was probably home maybe a month or two I went right back down and I essentially hosted one I'm cooking breakfast for the boys I'm cleaning it's not off of them I'm doing the whole thing just trying to push them in slow but surely you start saving guys 10 guys at a time over and over and you know that's really all because of Mark's the number if they would not have made that little infomercial

spk_0 airing out all their dirty laundry and how open and transparent he was like that is not the Navy see a way that is not how you're supposed to do it and when he did it it was so empowering to me I mean I looked up them I mean he was on his second

spk_0 deployment when I came in and you know Mark's larger than life to me so when you see that openness that transparent I can do that I can do that too and if I do that some kid going through the exact same thing as me that stuck in that island alone we'll see me and go if he can do it I can do it

spk_0 you got a one change and you have to put steps in in place to where you can live at a full value the morning routine I don't break it because I know what happens if I don't have it the worst I've ever been I wasn't living that morning routine I was still working out but it was chaotic it best right like my range wasn't there my combados wasn't there I slowly let it drift away to where I was the shell of myself once I got that breath of fresh air I am never going back I mean I just came back on Saturday

spk_0 I went back on again took a bunch of veterans a bunch of civilians that were down there and it's so interesting to see because you have fighter pilots that are down there you have normal housewives that have drinking problems toxic marriage sexual abuse all this different stuff and everybody's in the exact same spot we've tried everything we tried the drugs we tried the talk therapy the cold plunges the song is all that and it's helping but it's not getting us over the goal line and when those people wake up the very next day

spk_0 they are a total rock bottom and when they come out of that five in the DMT they their feet don't hit the ground for months you are on cloud nine and you cannot believe how good you feel I just want the world to be able to experience that doesn't matter what trauma you have going on it's not a navy seal medicine or medicine for special operation this is a medicine to save humanity and if you are at the bottom of the barrel right now they'll save you I mean I went on 60 pills a day I'm not on anything not a single pain med I mean I've got more screws me than home deep I'm not going to be able to do it.

spk_0 I know I feel like a million bucks but you know for me my family deserve it and if I have to go down there and go through all that trauma over a five day period to give them a better version of myself I'll do it every single time that juice is so worth the squeeze but it's scary man it is because you're afraid and when I talk to guys they're so afraid they're going to come out of it me a pacifist they're afraid they're going to lose the edge and like well what if you did that medicine why you were in the teams could you still do that job

spk_0 100% I just wouldn't have drug him home with me I could have done that job and empowered it off and I could have done my same routine now and I could have went home and been a full-time husband or full-time father I could still compartmentalize it when I went to work and I could just focus on work because I'm running on dials and not switches you can't just turn it on shut it off you can't you got to be able to back it off slowly

spk_0 and that's why you said drive and work every day I'm not thinking about my family in three to one all I'm thinking about is a lift because that's the only priority I have once a lift is done what's the piece of content we're shooting what's the training course we're doing who do I need to be when I walk to that threshold and that medicine really gave me the ability to navigate between those spaces better than anything else I've ever found and I'm so thankful for it I know it sounds hockey and I am not that guy you know yoga and you know I'm going to get a

spk_0 I'm not that dude.

spk_0 And it's very foo-fo.

spk_0 A lot of it is.

spk_0 And a lot of people practicing that stuff.

spk_0 They push it so far out and laughter you think that you're

spk_0 gonna do like one of the lost boys and run around the rain

spk_0 force with feathers hanging out of your hair.

spk_0 It's not like that.

spk_0 It's not like that at all.

spk_0 It's an amazing facility.

spk_0 It's an amazing program.

spk_0 And I'm just so thankful that they had the ability to share

spk_0 that message.

spk_0 If they wouldn't have, we'd be in the exact same position.

spk_0 I think they've put in, I think three or four thousand people

spk_0 through that medicine in the last, I think, three years.

spk_0 They're absolutely saving people's lives.

spk_0 It's been remarkable to see the growth of veteran solutions.

spk_0 Again, I have no formal affiliation.

spk_0 It's just something that I observed.

spk_0 And I really respect.

spk_0 And my colleague who's been a guest on this podcast

spk_0 and Dr. Nolan Williams, he's a triple board certified physician.

spk_0 He's my colleague at Stanford.

spk_0 And a couple of reflections that I think

spk_0 perhaps are also important for people listening to hear

spk_0 because you say, go down there.

spk_0 It's done in Mexico because it's still not legalized

spk_0 in the United States.

spk_0 It requires supervision.

spk_0 This is very different even then,

spk_0 psilocybin MDMA, LSD, that there's really no recreational use

spk_0 of these things that is reasonable or safe.

spk_0 So just, I'm not saying that just to protect myself.

spk_0 I'm saying that to protect people listening.

spk_0 That said, no one I've talked a lot about this.

spk_0 He's the one scanning guys that go down there and come back.

spk_0 And I think it's fair to say that pretty much

spk_0 every positive shift, whether it's an improvement

spk_0 or a cure from a mental health issue,

spk_0 is brain plasticity, something gets rewired.

spk_0 And these are tools to enable brain plasticity.

spk_0 And I think it's helpful perhaps for people to hear it

spk_0 that way because psychedelic sounds like tie dye sounds

spk_0 like kaleidoscope sounds like magic carpet sounds

spk_0 like the 60s sounds like people staring at the sun

spk_0 burning their eyes out and then talking about how they've

spk_0 seen God and everyone else needs to have the same experience,

spk_0 summer, love, dirty feet and all that.

spk_0

spk_0 It is amazing to me that the veterans community

spk_0 and a bipartisan effort, I will say,

spk_0 this is one of the few truly bipartisan efforts out there.

spk_0 Everything's so polarized.

spk_0 But former governor Rick Perry of Texas,

spk_0 who is self described, knuckle drug,

spk_0 dragging Republican, he said that.

spk_0 I'm not saying that about him.

spk_0 He says it every time as fully embraced,

spk_0 I've again, and what Hart medicine,

spk_0 it's sometimes called the MDMA therapies as well.

spk_0 And it's been really working with people on the democratic side

spk_0 of the aisle to try and get FDA approval for the stuff

spk_0 in the United States, first for the treatment of veterans

spk_0 and other people with substance use

spk_0 and severe trauma issues first.

spk_0 And then it will be explored how this could

spk_0 wick out into the broader population.

spk_0 But I just think of them as incredibly powerful tools

spk_0 for brain plasticity.

spk_0 And then maybe that just kind of softens

spk_0 for people in their minds a little bit of what,

spk_0 just how wild and crazy it is.

spk_0 I mean, the experiences are extreme,

spk_0 as you said, it's challenging to be in the IBA gang.

spk_0 For that from everyone who's done it.

spk_0 I haven't yet done IBA gang at someone I will,

spk_0 but I've certainly done therapeutic sessions

spk_0 with MDMA therapeutic and a hydro psilocybin.

spk_0 And it can be terrifying.

spk_0 And you need to be someone there to help guide you

spk_0 through it at times.

spk_0 But I'm so happy that Marcus and Amber

spk_0 undertook this project that you joined up with that project

spk_0 and the Netflix movie will provide a link to it

spk_0 if it's out otherwise.

spk_0 We'll just cue people to the fact

spk_0 that they should definitely watch this

spk_0 as an extremely compelling and important story

spk_0 for people to hear.

spk_0 I can't help but mention just because I've had the great

spk_0 experience of being able to interact

spk_0 with someone people around this.

spk_0 And the effort is so wholehearted

spk_0 and it's so deeply rooted in trying to help people.

spk_0 And I think that's really important

spk_0 for people to hear too,

spk_0 because anytime there's a business association

spk_0 with things people start to color that.

spk_0 It's just there's just so much pure intent in all of this.

spk_0 I also have gotten to know Sarah Wilkins in a little bit.

spk_0 She's amazing.

spk_0 She's amazing, Chad's wife.

spk_0 First through veteran solutions.

spk_0 And she's an amazing woman.

spk_0 And I think it's been challenging to see all these guys

spk_0 that he was friends with get better.

spk_0 And it's so tragic that someone has to take their own life

spk_0 for things like this to eventually get stimulated.

spk_0 But the amount of good that veteran solutions

spk_0 is catalyzing is really spectacular.

spk_0 And I'm glad we're taking some time to talk about it.

spk_0 I think it's been discussed on other podcasts.

spk_0 I think this movement's just going to grow.

spk_0 I think it's broken through now.

spk_0 And hopefully this will continue to help it break through.

spk_0 When the whole thing first started,

spk_0 John Shank and Bonnie Cohen reached out

spk_0 about doing the film in Ways and Ward.

spk_0 They actually kind of tricked me to be a part of it.

spk_0 They told me that Mark Zanamber were spearheading this project.

spk_0 So I was like, if Mark Zanamber and I'm in,

spk_0 I owe them anyway, they saved me.

spk_0 I'm into it.

spk_0 That wasn't really the case.

spk_0 They spearheaded me.

spk_0 I'm on board and then they convinced Mark Zanamber

spk_0 to join on board.

spk_0 And now it's essentially his whole story unfiltered, unbiased.

spk_0 My whole story and then us going back for my buddy, Maddie.

spk_0 And how all our lives are entangled in teams

spk_0 and just all the trauma we all share

spk_0 and how we're all getting through it.

spk_0 But it kills addiction in one shot, which is crazy.

spk_0 And people addicted to heroin.

spk_0 Like I dipped Copenhagen for 17 years.

spk_0 Never wanted to quit.

spk_0 And I woke up the very next morning from my beginning.

spk_0 I've never had a dip, son.

spk_0 It's so wild.

spk_0 And I want to dip.

spk_0 Like I miss it.

spk_0 And as soon as I smell it, I can't do it.

spk_0 It's like I didn't drink coffee for six months.

spk_0 It's like I want to drink coffee.

spk_0 And then I have no desire.

spk_0 My energy levels are through the roof.

spk_0 Like everything is better.

spk_0 I kind of just want to be normal again.

spk_0 It's like slow but surely introduce coffee and whatever else.

spk_0 But you have no addictions.

spk_0 And I was at the bottom of the barrel.

spk_0 I mean, I was taking extreme doses of gabapentin,

spk_0 tramadol, twerdol, everything else.

spk_0 And tramadol's not had the forming.

spk_0 Yeah, take it for 12 years until it's not.

spk_0 But it most certainly is.

spk_0 And to be able to whitewash all of that gone in one shot,

spk_0 I mean, the doctor's, I was never getting off those meds.

spk_0 Never.

spk_0 Like if you want a function in society,

spk_0 you have to take these medications for the rest of your life.

spk_0 And I was fine with it.

spk_0 I'm totally good.

spk_0 And then on the backside, you see that it doesn't matter

spk_0 if I was drinking a 12 pack a day or if I was just popping

spk_0 these 60 pills, I was under the influence of something

spk_0 all day, every day for 15 years.

spk_0 That's not how I want to be.

spk_0 It's not how I want to live my next 40 years.

spk_0 It's like it's really put me in a position

spk_0 where I'm so hyper aware everything that I input

spk_0 and then everything that I output.

spk_0 But it gives you the, it gives you complete control.

spk_0 And I think some guys just need to,

spk_0 they need that breath of fresh air.

spk_0 They need that instant relief to go.

spk_0 Okay.

spk_0 I could live with this now.

spk_0 And if you just keep living that positive lifestyle,

spk_0 it'll become your new norm.

spk_0 Right.

spk_0 But you have to really want to change it.

spk_0 For me, I've never found anything that powerful in my life.

spk_0 And because a lot of guys are scared,

spk_0 they're scared about going down to Mexico and whatever it is.

spk_0 There's a 25 person staff in that house with you.

spk_0 Three paramedics, three RNs, they got cardiac cert,

spk_0 they have everybody in there, the chefs in there

spk_0 are amazing.

spk_0 Michelin star quality, the food you eat,

spk_0 and there's indoor swimming pools,

spk_0 there's a raky lady in there

spk_0 that will crack your soul open in 15 seconds flat.

spk_0 I never thought Raky was a thing

spk_0 until she puts her hands on you.

spk_0 The massage therapy, the breath work,

spk_0 I mean, it's a whole holistic approach.

spk_0 But because you've never,

spk_0 just, you've never allowed yourself to be vulnerable

spk_0 in that position.

spk_0 And once you are, they just start to unravel you so fast.

spk_0 And that medicine's really the catalyst for the whole thing.

spk_0 And once you see what you can be,

spk_0 I can be the same guy that I was.

spk_0 Now I can just control him.

spk_0 I think that's what a lot of guys lose

spk_0 when they leave the team.

spk_0 So like, why have built myself into this?

spk_0 Because of that, well, I can't take that with me.

spk_0 So what do I do with this?

spk_0 My wife doesn't want this, I don't want this,

spk_0 my kids can't build a relationship with this.

spk_0 What am I supposed to do now?

spk_0 And that's when people make those rash decisions.

spk_0 They don't know where to go.

spk_0 And I think that's what's so powerful to medicine

spk_0 is that's the only thing stronger

spk_0 than the ego you've built up.

spk_0 Purpose built is that medicine.

spk_0 You have to change my life for sure.

spk_0 It's been great.

spk_0 Where my mind goes is, you know,

spk_0 people who aren't in the military,

spk_0 these days are also really struggling also,

spk_0 I didn't point out.

spk_0 And, you know, the United States in particular,

spk_0 like we're at a pretty dark moment.

spk_0 It took me a while to actually like really internalize that.

spk_0 I was like, man, like it like last week,

spk_0 the Charlie Kirk thing that same week

spk_0 or just a few days before that woman getting killed

spk_0 on the light rail, you got conflicts all over the world.

spk_0 You've got a ton of domestic unrest.

spk_0 And people have come on this podcast and argued

spk_0 that in the last century,

spk_0 there were a lot more deaths due to war

spk_0 and this kind of thing.

spk_0 You know, statistics are one thing and they're important,

spk_0 but seeing people murdered in cold blood

spk_0 in either very deliberate or in what seemed like almost

spk_0 kind of like random, like, okay,

spk_0 there was a person there so he killed her

spk_0 if there was someone else in my coat, maybe not.

spk_0 Who knows what the motivation was?

spk_0 You know, and to think about how trauma's like that,

spk_0 just the pain of the world can be lifted,

spk_0 it's hard to imagine it happening in mass, right?

spk_0 It's hard and yet I think we all deep down know

spk_0 that that has to happen.

spk_0 And I think an attention to what young people are exposed to

spk_0 and trying to save them is the best thing about our species,

spk_0 right?

spk_0 Protect our young, make them, put them into a world

spk_0 that's better than the way we found it.

spk_0 And at the same time, what you're describing is it's kind of

spk_0 it sounds like the medicine for lack of a better way to put it

spk_0 at that society and like this kind of global consciousness

spk_0 really needs.

spk_0 I've said before and I'll say it again,

spk_0 I think if you look at humans across history,

spk_0 we've always had conflict, we've always created trauma

spk_0 for each other, we've not ever really been perfect,

spk_0 ever, we're not perfect, we're flawed, we're all flawed.

spk_0 I think that's important to remember.

spk_0 And that things will improve over time, perhaps this can be

spk_0 like a sawtooth up until the right kind of graph,

spk_0 but you wonder if there was going to be a massive shift

spk_0 in collective consciousness and people were going to really

spk_0 heal their traumas and really start to see other people

spk_0 differently.

spk_0 That's going to require some very powerful tools.

spk_0 And I just can't help but think there is no magic solution,

spk_0 people have to want to change and on and on,

spk_0 but I began, sounds like a special tool,

spk_0 different than the other psychedelics,

spk_0 because of the amount of attention and detail that's required

spk_0 to keep people safe while they do it,

spk_0 heart monitoring and it's a medical treatment in many ways.

spk_0 I think we should probably talk about it

spk_0 and frame it that way going forward.

spk_0 It's a medical treatment.

spk_0 The word psychedelic is a very loaded phrase.

spk_0 And it's one of the things that I worry about

spk_0 in terms of trying to get,

spk_0 I began and other treatments implemented more broadly.

spk_0 In the same way that when about 10 years ago,

spk_0 we would think about breath work

spk_0 and I want to study respiration physiology in my lab,

spk_0 calling it respiration physiology,

spk_0 you know, we have a clinical trial that we publish on that.

spk_0 If we call it breath work, it's kind of wacky.

spk_0 You call it respiration physiology, which is also true.

spk_0 People are more willing to embrace it.

spk_0 So these, to me, are neuroplasticity tools

spk_0 to help rewire one's brain for the better.

spk_0 And I am very hopeful that what you've done,

spk_0 I mean, again, thank you.

spk_0 You know, it's like, you know, we always think people

spk_0 for their service, but here now you've got people

spk_0 that served who are now going into this highly novel,

spk_0 at least for Americans, a treatment

spk_0 to help cure trauma and addiction.

spk_0 And you guys are first in, and Marcus and Amber,

spk_0 you know, early and first in.

spk_0 And people will argue, you know,

spk_0 these things have been around for a long time

spk_0 in native cultures and in jungles.

spk_0 And I will say, just like meditation,

spk_0 just like yoga, Nidra, just like hydrotherapy,

spk_0 light therapy, it's exactly because it's been shrouded

spk_0 in complicated language that it isn't more broadly implemented.

spk_0 And I'm willing to say that a thousand times over,

spk_0 if we truly care about people,

spk_0 we don't care what it's called.

spk_0 Sure we want to pay respect to people

spk_0 that develop these things long ago,

spk_0 but enough is enough.

spk_0 Like it's not about getting credit,

spk_0 it's about getting it out there.

spk_0 And you're exactly right.

spk_0 When you say psychedelics,

spk_0 everybody automatically labels it a certain way.

spk_0 And one of the best quotes I've ever heard is,

spk_0 we gave, I've gained my buddy, Maddie,

spk_0 and he will come next day and he goes,

spk_0 there is nothing recreational about that.

spk_0 Nope, but there isn't.

spk_0 Terrifying.

spk_0 It can't be.

spk_0 Some people wake up and it's bliss the entire time.

spk_0 And I'm so glad you have that.

spk_0 But if you were laying in Stanford right now

spk_0 and you gave me I had gained,

spk_0 hooked up the Harae Moners,

spk_0 you were running a study, they wouldn't bat an eye.

spk_0 Like, oh yeah, it's the same thing.

spk_0 You have the same people around you,

spk_0 they're taking detailed notes, everything you say,

spk_0 I mean, this, you might as well be a clinic.

spk_0 You are.

spk_0 It's in a beautiful house, beautiful staff,

spk_0 and the entire thing, but that's what it is.

spk_0 This is a treatment.

spk_0 This is not a bunch of guys eating,

spk_0 smoking, doing whatever,

spk_0 peyote in the middle of the desert.

spk_0 It's not what that is.

spk_0 This is a very structured thing

spk_0 because you have some serious trauma.

spk_0 I think a lot of people label it like,

spk_0 oh, this is for guys with PTSD.

spk_0 I didn't go down there for PTSD.

spk_0 I went down there for whatever had,

spk_0 I've turned into, I was trying to get rid of that.

spk_0 And I'll tell you before,

spk_0 nothing in my military career has ever come up.

spk_0 None of it.

spk_0 That's not what haunts me.

spk_0 It's not what plagues me a knight.

spk_0 It's not what keeps me up till two, three in the morning.

spk_0 That's not that.

spk_0 And I've resolved all the things that was troubling me.

spk_0 And it's because that medicine's so powerful.

spk_0 I just hope more people will get a hold of it.

spk_0 And I think if we had the right people,

spk_0 putting out the right message on the right platforms,

spk_0 people, they get a hold of it.

spk_0 So many people wanna hear hate speech.

spk_0 Like negativity goes a lot more than positivity

spk_0 a lot of the times because people hang onto that.

spk_0 It's like, I read something they were talking about,

spk_0 the best public speakers in human history

spk_0 and Hitler was in top five.

spk_0 And they're like, well, just imagine if he was preaching

spk_0 positivity, he could have turned that entire country

spk_0 and really given him something to hang onto.

spk_0 He just didn't.

spk_0 And you wish that he would have been preaching

spk_0 the gospel.

spk_0 You wish he would have been preaching,

spk_0 loving, kindness for all of humanity.

spk_0 And then what would have happened in World War II

spk_0 wouldn't happen.

spk_0 Yeah, humans have an appetite for that anger.

spk_0 There's a famous experiment by a guy named Robert Heath.

spk_0 He was a neuroscientist and neurosurgeon

spk_0 and very controversial guy for all sorts of reasons.

spk_0 But he ran an experiment on humans

spk_0 where he was in the brain stimulating

spk_0 different brain areas.

spk_0 And he would implant little electrodes in humans.

spk_0 And people had the opportunity then

spk_0 layer to stimulate different brain areas

spk_0 and different brain areas when stimulated

spk_0 evoke different subjective experiences.

spk_0 So they'd hit a lever, they'd feel kind of drunk.

spk_0 Hit another lever, they'd feel sexual rouse,

spk_0 they'll hit another lever, they'd feel laughter,

spk_0 others they'd feel less well.

spk_0 Do you know the number one brain area?

spk_0 There weren't many subjects in this

spk_0 as difficult experiment to do,

spk_0 but the number one brain area that these subjects

spk_0 all wanted to hit again and again and again

spk_0 was an area of what's called the midline thalamus

spk_0 that evokes feelings of mild anger and frustration.

spk_0 It's linked to the dopamine system

spk_0 and it's associated with drive.

spk_0 And it's what we learn if we're adaptive

spk_0 to funnel into creating things, building things,

spk_0 doing things, but it's very clear that we are hard wired

spk_0 to be pulled into environments and discourses

spk_0 that evoke anger.

spk_0 I feel like anger and numbing out

spk_0 are the two most dangerous things.

spk_0 And look, I love social media,

spk_0 teach on social media, but being online

spk_0 makes it very easy to feel anger and to numb out.

spk_0 And it's the ultimate drug really to offer that

spk_0 in my opinion.

spk_0 And then there's this other lane of life,

spk_0 which is harder to access where the real richness is,

spk_0 where the real stuff is, where real meaning comes from,

spk_0 where time doesn't just disappear

spk_0 and where you build things that are lasting

spk_0 and that, if I die in 10 seconds,

spk_0 I'll know that I'd spent some time in that lane

spk_0 and enough to know that that's where the really good stuff is.

spk_0 And it's a bit more difficult or a lot more difficult

spk_0 to access, but that's real life.

spk_0 And the rest is a game that's being played on us

spk_0 that takes advantage of some hard wiring

spk_0 that I wish didn't exist, but exist in all of us.

spk_0 I think if we knew that that existed

spk_0 and all of us, just like we have an appetite for sugar,

spk_0 you know, it's hardwired that we would make better choices.

spk_0 So I'm so glad that you've done,

spk_0 I began NDMT in that setting

spk_0 and that you guys are getting the message out there.

spk_0 And I don't know what the broader implementation looks like,

spk_0 but I like to think that with collaboration with Nolan,

spk_0 what's how we veteran solutions,

spk_0 Ambio and other clinics like it,

spk_0 and really good for once, really good politicians

spk_0 on both sides of the aisle arguing for this.

spk_0 I'm hopeful.

spk_0 I fully support my tax dollars going to the expansion of this.

spk_0 I really do.

spk_0 They've been spending a lot of time in the beltway,

spk_0 getting funding, you know, clinical trials, research,

spk_0 doing the entire thing.

spk_0 And they've got a whole coalition now,

spk_0 Navy Seal Foundation stepped up.

spk_0 Green Bray Foundation, I think,

spk_0 might be the recon foundation in Wounded Warrior Project.

spk_0 They all came to a coalition.

spk_0 They're all going to get behind this

spk_0 and all kind of push the exact same message.

spk_0 Let's get to funding, let's get to research,

spk_0 let's prove that it works and hopefully bring it to the US.

spk_0 Like we have to start with the veterans

spk_0 because it's smaller population,

spk_0 less than 1% of population, let's target them,

spk_0 let's get first responders,

spk_0 and let's open this thing up.

spk_0 And you know, Marx is doing a lot to really beat that war drum.

spk_0 And I'm just so thankful.

spk_0 One of the things he said we went down there

spk_0 because you don't realize how palpable toxicity is.

spk_0 Like you want to be hateful sometimes.

spk_0 And they're like hurt people, hurt people.

spk_0 You've been hurt and now you want someone else

spk_0 to feel that exact same thing.

spk_0 So you see something hateful on social media.

spk_0 What's the first thing you do?

spk_0 You go to the comment section, you read.

spk_0 Yep, I feel like too.

spk_0 I like that comment, I'm a comment underneath it.

spk_0 Yep, yep.

spk_0 You just start to project that hate over and over and over again.

spk_0 If I say look at it, I'm not gonna get involved in that.

spk_0 Actually, I'm just gonna unfollow this person

spk_0 because every time I see you're saying something hateful,

spk_0 slow but sure that it's getting out that toxicity,

spk_0 it allows the best form of you to continue to go forward.

spk_0 But yeah, I mean, you have to get a protector piece.

spk_0 You gotta surround yourself with positive people

spk_0 that are better than you that want to try to drag you

spk_0 up that hill.

spk_0 Thank God for people like that.

spk_0 Cause man, I mean, if you haven't been there,

spk_0 if you have not been that only guy on the island alone,

spk_0 just,

spk_0 just me.

spk_0 I often say, I was the first guy in the SEAL team

spk_0 to suffer depression, anxiety and suicide ideation

spk_0 because I'd never heard of it before, right?

spk_0 Cause I'm in my living room,

spk_0 just my wife's not there and we talk about dogs.

spk_0 One of the number one reasons I never did it was

spk_0 when I would get to the point where I made up my mind

spk_0 that dog would walk in that room

spk_0 and drop his head on my lap and look at me.

spk_0 Oh,

spk_0 not today.

spk_0 I get up and I go on a walk with the dog.

spk_0 As you, Japanese master.

spk_0 Amazing breed folks.

spk_0 I just learned about it today.

spk_0 I absolutely want one of these.

spk_0 What is the proper name?

spk_0 Tosa, you knew they are beautiful.

spk_0 They, they're amazing.

spk_0 Yeah, so my wife first husband, Danny,

spk_0 they had a Japanese master

spk_0 for an old English bulldog.

spk_0 So when he passed, I met Patsy three years later,

spk_0 that was the dog sign inherited

spk_0 and you couldn't pick a better dog grid.

spk_0 It was the most beautiful dog I've ever seen in my,

spk_0 look, a bangled tiger.

spk_0 200 pounds, but a gentle giant.

spk_0 One of the things when you walk in the house

spk_0 and that thing sees you,

spk_0 your heart just goes to 180.

spk_0 You're like, I'm so happy to be home

spk_0 and see this dog right now.

spk_0 It pulls you out of a depression.

spk_0 And therapy dogs are a real thing

spk_0 and you know, shout out to the Red Cross.

spk_0 I didn't know what the Red Cross did in, you know, 2020.

spk_0 Like what do you do?

spk_0 They bring in dogs in hospital beds,

spk_0 what they do for sure.

spk_0 They did it for me.

spk_0 And there's nothing like laying in a hospital bed

spk_0 even throwing up for a week.

spk_0 And you're just, you don't have yourself on,

spk_0 you can't call your wife and they bring in some giant

spk_0 St. Bernard, the jumps into bed with you.

spk_0 And it is heaven on earth.

spk_0 It is.

spk_0 It's like that little bit gets you through the hump.

spk_0 Would you bring me tomorrow?

spk_0 We get some Cocker Spanel's like, bring him in here.

spk_0 But I don't care what it is now.

spk_0 It's like, I just need, I need a dog.

spk_0 I need something that makes me feel better.

spk_0 Yeah.

spk_0 Dogs are amazing.

spk_0 They are.

spk_0 And old English Bulldog, just like Costello, I mean,

spk_0 that's, that's, that's, those are my people,

spk_0 my, my creatures.

spk_0 I just might get a Japanese master.

spk_0 I'm sure.

spk_0 I'd like to talk about your standards.

spk_0 I've heard you say worst situation is being a big fish

spk_0 in a small pond.

spk_0 Not many people say that.

spk_0 Let's talk about standards.

spk_0 First starting with physical standards.

spk_0 And let's actually get back to the program just briefly.

spk_0 You mentioned the five day week program.

spk_0 Well, a while ago I saw you put out, it's a fit test, basically,

spk_0 that's designed to be done any time.

spk_0 No preparation after you've done, it's GBRS is your program.

spk_0 I'm going to sign up for this.

spk_0 This is not a promotional.

spk_0 I'm just going to do it.

spk_0 I'm going to pay full price.

spk_0 I'm going to insist on paying full price like everyone else.

spk_0 And doing this because I turned 50 in about a week and I want to stay fit going forward.

spk_0 And let me see if I got this right.

spk_0 It involves a broad jump.

spk_0 Some pull ups, some push ups.

spk_0 Would you walk us through what the test is?

spk_0 And what the program actually provides, because I know a lot of people listening are already exercising

spk_0 and are attached to their program.

spk_0 Right, guys are like they want more lower buys at rear delts stuff.

spk_0 But this is different.

spk_0 This is about all around functional fitness at any age, men or women.

spk_0 So what's the program?

spk_0 So we sort of that program is like a recovery from injury, right?

spk_0 I'm just trying to maintain a high standard.

spk_0 I've had a high standard physically since I was 17.

spk_0 I've gotten better.

spk_0 I've had really, really high points and blow points come back from injury.

spk_0 But I wanted something to be able to maintain a high standard.

spk_0 And we got out.

spk_0 You start working with SWAT teams, SEAL teams, every team in between, firemen and everybody

spk_0 else.

spk_0 And it's such a physical component that cannot be ignored.

spk_0 But so many people in the 80s and 90s, even in early 2000s, like good is good enough.

spk_0 Like you ever seen a show rescue me?

spk_0 I think in this lyrics, a bunch of guys, a bunch of firemen in New York and they had the

spk_0 fat firemen, big handle bar moustaches.

spk_0 You had to young guys and you see all this stuff.

spk_0 And now if you look at the majority of firemen, they look like professional.

spk_0 They look like crossfitters.

spk_0 Like they're in shape because they understand we've got so much data on human potential and

spk_0 how to get their nutrition, sleep, recovery, training protocols.

spk_0 And they realize that you are your first lifeline.

spk_0 Your physical vessel is the thing.

spk_0 You can get in the airport through TSA.

spk_0 I can get in the White House.

spk_0 I don't need to bring any tools with me.

spk_0 This is a really, really good tool and it's always with me if I keep it at a high level.

spk_0 So we're going through here and the majority of the military screen test and SWAT teams,

spk_0 it's all body weight.

spk_0 Pushups, pullups, running, SEAL teams and special operations, swim test.

spk_0 And that's about it.

spk_0 You'll do O courses and some other stuff, but the majority of it, that's just what it is.

spk_0 Well, it's not reality.

spk_0 You don't walk around.

spk_0 There's no way in.

spk_0 You don't walk in and a pair of board shorts and weigh in.

spk_0 You're wearing body armor helmets.

spk_0 You know, panonite vision.

spk_0 It's a lot of heavy stuff.

spk_0 You have to carry.

spk_0 So you're always under an extreme load.

spk_0 But the physical standard was so high as a tier one level.

spk_0 I mean, then the entire forces, but you have to maintain such a high level because everybody

spk_0 else is around you.

spk_0 So when I'm looking at all these guys, SWAT team guys, if you had a physical standard

spk_0 every SWAT team in a country held, if the lowest dude on team could pass this test,

spk_0 the top guys are at the super elite level.

spk_0 You're so well-rounded, you can solve anything physically.

spk_0 And that's one of the big things in the military.

spk_0 You never want to have to say no.

spk_0 Can you 25 guys get up over this mountain in a Saltide target by 0-4 in the morning?

spk_0 If it can be done physically, we can do it.

spk_0 No matter what, we'll find a way.

spk_0 Move heaven and earth will get it done.

spk_0 It's really, really hard to make a good decision on the backside when you are so physically

spk_0 taxed.

spk_0 Because no decision you're ever going to make is without being under extreme duress.

spk_0 If we elevate the physical standard, we can make better mental.

spk_0 I mean, we can't.

spk_0 We can make better decisions through mental clarity when we're not just sucking wind.

spk_0 Also true, very much so in civilian life.

spk_0 Everywhere.

spk_0 Like ENTs, business, on new teachers, school teachers, everybody.

spk_0 If you're not physically labored, you can make better decisions.

spk_0 So that's the whole goal.

spk_0 I don't care if you're a 45-year-old fireman that has an extra 35 pounds of weight on you,

spk_0 or if you're a 19-year-old kid who's in their prime.

spk_0 If you have to run up 10 flights of stairs carrying that hose, when you get to the top, execute

spk_0 a good decision.

spk_0 The guy who's hard weight isn't in 180, he's going to make a better decision.

spk_0 They just are.

spk_0 And we all know it.

spk_0 So let's set a standard that, you know, I don't care if it's Wednesday, if it's two

spk_0 o'clock in the morning on a Saturday, if you spring out of bed and take this test,

spk_0 you should be able to pass it no matter what.

spk_0 Now, what level are we trying to adhere?

spk_0 It's highest humanly possible.

spk_0 If I hit the elite standard right now in three weeks, I should hit the elite again.

spk_0 If I start to taper off, why?

spk_0 Like a sleigh, poor nutrition, you know, just really crazy opt-tempo.

spk_0 I'm in the red the whole time.

spk_0 Okay, maybe I needed to a couple days off, get back on my training plan to maintain that

spk_0 high level, but we do a broad jump.

spk_0 So power output on the floor, in a dynamic fashion, landing, cropper reception.

spk_0 So just have people stand on a line jump as far forward as they possibly can.

spk_0 And that's the lowest standard is your height, right?

spk_0 So if I'm six foot tall, I should be able to broad jump past six foot.

spk_0 What's the next level up from that?

spk_0 One foot.

spk_0 One foot past your height.

spk_0 Yep.

spk_0 So seven feet would be, you know, middle of the road.

spk_0 Okay.

spk_0 If I can jump eight feet, that's really the standard.

spk_0 Like for me, I'm trying to get to a 10 foot broad jump.

spk_0 Like, I want to hit 10 feet and I want to hold that as long as humanly possible.

spk_0 And you can swing your arms.

spk_0 Yeah.

spk_0 No running start, but you just swing your arms forward, jump.

spk_0 Jump feet lower the ground, dynamic fashion.

spk_0 And I always tell the guys, in reality, you are not going to have time to negotiate the

spk_0 obstacle.

spk_0 You are not going to be able to run up to the ditch and stop and look at and go, okay,

spk_0 I need to get, I need to back it up a little bit.

spk_0 You're going to have to go as a cop chasing this kid down this city park.

spk_0 You're going to have to scale that eight foot fence right now, not look for a step stool,

spk_0 not.

spk_0 What can I climb on to get over this?

spk_0 You're going to have to hit that thing at full value and go up and over it.

spk_0 You should have the physical ability to do that.

spk_0 So we have a broad jump in a lot of people, Vernon has a really good thing about monkey

spk_0 bars.

spk_0 Like everybody was swinging on monkey bars from your kid in a certain point in adulthood.

spk_0 You stopped doing it, but you'll look at your kid nine years old, swing on a monkey

spk_0 bar.

spk_0 You're like, oh, you're doing it wrong.

spk_0 Do it this way.

spk_0 Jump up there and show them.

spk_0 If you haven't been on monkey bars in 40 years, expect to be humbled really, really fast.

spk_0 It's like lose it.

spk_0 Use it to lose it.

spk_0 It's going to happen.

spk_0 So we're always trying to test ourselves like what is going to make me a dynamic participant

spk_0 throughout the whole process.

spk_0 Broad jumps are really good expression.

spk_0 We have that in the seal teams.

spk_0 We had a legacy test.

spk_0 It was a bodyweight bench press in FL to 225 bench press.

spk_0 It's not fair for me to give 225 to a kid that weighs 160 pounds or 140 pound woman or

spk_0 50 pound woman.

spk_0 Yeah.

spk_0 Your bodyweight though, and we owe minimum standard 10 repetitions.

spk_0 10 repetition singles set with your bodyweight.

spk_0 That's minimum standard.

spk_0 15, next level up, 20 pluses of weight.

spk_0 If you can bench press your bodyweight 20 times, you are in top tier.

spk_0 This is full range movement.

spk_0 Bar touches your chest, you press your nut all the way to straight arm.

spk_0 All the way.

spk_0 20 reps on that.

spk_0 Pull ups with no weight.

spk_0 We do that because so many guys have so many injuries, so many shoulder injuries.

spk_0 If your technique isn't there and you're dropping out of the hole, I don't want

spk_0 you to dislocate and jam up a shoulder.

spk_0 So pull ups are in there.

spk_0 We have a farmer's carry.

spk_0 How many pull ups are the 10, 15 and 20 pluses?

spk_0 So 10 with your bodyweight 15 is the next level up and then 20 pluses elite.

spk_0 Okay.

spk_0 In a perfect word, we do it with weight in the seal teams.

spk_0 We add weight to it.

spk_0 For everybody, if you can do 20 straight dead hang pull ups, you're at the top physical

spk_0 game.

spk_0 There's less than.

spk_0 No Kip.

spk_0 Chain clears the bar.

spk_0 Yeah.

spk_0 We do a farmer's carry.

spk_0 So with your bodyweight, so if you weigh 200 pounds, you have 100 pound dumbbell in

spk_0 each hand, you get up and you walk it as far as you can.

spk_0 I'd have to look at the exact feet measurement, but I think the elite is almost 300 feet, 275

spk_0 and 250 somewhere around there.

spk_0 And it's not an easy thing to do, but we work so much grip for the pull ups and everything

spk_0 else.

spk_0 Like grip matters.

spk_0 We say that a lot.

spk_0 It's very hard to climb up a caving ladder on the side of a cruise ship when it's underway.

spk_0 And your grip's the only thing that's going to get you there.

spk_0 So we really put a lot of focus on gripping fire.

spk_0 We need it, it cops meaded.

spk_0 If I'm trying to, if I'm trying to manipulate a full grown man through time and space against

spk_0 their will, your grip is a key factor in that.

spk_0 Yeah.

spk_0 It's going to be a few grapples.

spk_0 When so many who grapples and you know how to use it, grabs a hold of you.

spk_0 You instantly know you're in a world heart.

spk_0 You grab some NCAA wrestling.

spk_0 He grabs a hold of you.

spk_0 The first thing you feel is his hands.

spk_0 Oh, no.

spk_0 I'm just going to hold it a grizzly bear right now.

spk_0 This is not going to be good.

spk_0 We need everybody to have that same strength.

spk_0 Also, someone's got to open the pickle jar.

spk_0 Exactly.

spk_0 You've got to be able to open the pickle jar, but when you pick up that weight, everything's

spk_0 in your core scenario.

spk_0 Your posture really matters upright.

spk_0 I've got to be able to control my breathing, ocular focus.

spk_0 Where am I looking?

spk_0 And then how long can I hold on to this?

spk_0 I've got to keep a rigid frame.

spk_0 I can't lean over and let it take control of me.

spk_0 I can't lean back.

spk_0 I've got to be present throughout the entire movement.

spk_0 And then just push.

spk_0 So we've got that.

spk_0 We've got a trap bar deadlift.

spk_0 We used to trap bar because the majority of guys in that career, they've already got some

spk_0 injuries stacked up.

spk_0 And we actually put 45-pound bumper plates to pull from a little bit of an elevation,

spk_0 because I've got a really long torso.

spk_0 And the big thing we push in that program is we want you to be able to train 52 weeks

spk_0 out of the year.

spk_0 There is no offseason for a fireman.

spk_0 There's no offseason for a SWAT team guy.

spk_0 There's no offseason for an Army Ranger.

spk_0 And if you get jammed up in the gym, and I've done it really bad, the mission doesn't

spk_0 care.

spk_0 You have to go anyway.

spk_0 And now you're not at 100%.

spk_0 And the entire patrol line, you're thinking about your lower back.

spk_0 And if you're going to be able to perform on target, we can't have that.

spk_0 We're trying to increase your confidence, never decrease it.

spk_0 So that's why we pull from that.

spk_0 That is one and a half times your body weight is a minimum standard for how many repetitions?

spk_0 Five.

spk_0 One and a half times your body weight.

spk_0 And then two times your body weight, and I think it's two and a half times your body

spk_0 weight is the elite.

spk_0 Per set of five.

spk_0 You can obviously do more.

spk_0 I think I did a set of 12 in that video.

spk_0 But it's just, can I pick up double body weight under control without slamming on the

spk_0 ground, proper form, and control the entire time.

spk_0 So we added all those.

spk_0 So the broad jump, the farmer's carry, the body weight bench, the pull ups, the trap bar

spk_0 deadlift, and we have an 800 meter run.

spk_0 We also have a plank for time.

spk_0 So a minute and a half, two minutes, no, it's two minutes, two and a half minutes and

spk_0 three minutes.

spk_0 Just in the form.

spk_0

spk_0 Yeah, planking.

spk_0 How are we going to hold it?

spk_0 And we were going to do sit-ups originally, but sit-ups is such a hip flexor dominant position

spk_0 because I have that long torso.

spk_0 If I don't anchor my feet, 50 sit-ups is really, really hard for me.

spk_0 And how do you gauge it?

spk_0 Are your hands in your lock behind your back?

spk_0 There's a whole bunch of ways to cheat it.

spk_0 It's very hard to cheat a plank, but your core is so important.

spk_0 And that's something that Vernon got me doing.

spk_0 I had a lot of lower back injuries.

spk_0 As we all do, I started walking around with my core at like 40 to 50 percent flexed all

spk_0 day every day.

spk_0 My lower back issues went away instantly.

spk_0 So I walk around with a little bit of tension all day long.

spk_0 I just imagine walking around the pole you're shirt off, a little bit of tension in your

spk_0 abs, and it protects my lower back.

spk_0 So we always say be an active participant throughout the entire movement.

spk_0 I'm never going to let my core go to Jello because of my lower back spasm.

spk_0 Everything is locked in, everything is in control.

spk_0 My intensity is there, my focus is there, and I've blocked out all the straight voltage.

spk_0 So we get through that, and then we do an 800 meter run.

spk_0 I wanted to do 400 meter repeats.

spk_0 Do a 400 stop as long as it took you to run, execute another one in the same amount

spk_0 of time.

spk_0 Well, the SWAT team, they have an 800 meter run.

spk_0 Well, since you already do it, I don't need a guy that can run a marathon.

spk_0 I need a guy that can throw a 200 pound guy over his shoulders to run him up 10 flights

spk_0 of stairs and make a good decision.

spk_0 So being a marathon runner, while it might be great for you, it doesn't really give me

spk_0 everything I need.

spk_0 I really need that hybrid athlete in that 800 meter.

spk_0 I didn't realize, and then I talked to everybody who's a distance runner.

spk_0 The 800 is brutal.

spk_0 It's too fast to fully sprint, and you can't slow down.

spk_0 Because that time metric, I think, is 315, 3 minutes and 245 to be the elite.

spk_0 So I think I'm in like the 240 range right now, but I haven't ran it since I snapped my

spk_0 hip.

spk_0 Other than sprints, I don't dis and run because it hurts my hip too bad.

spk_0 But I'm able to get through it.

spk_0 I've got a laundry list of injuries, and we did that entire test cold-bore.

spk_0 We basically wrote it down, and the whole thing when I sit down with Vernon, it was like,

spk_0 I need something to drive to.

spk_0 I do better when there's a target goal on the wall.

spk_0 Two years ago, it was a 400-pound bench press.

spk_0 I have never been able to bench press 400 pounds.

spk_0 I've missed it every time.

spk_0 My shoulders are all blown out.

spk_0 And I was like, with all the injuries, I want to press 400 pounds one time before I

spk_0 hang it up forever.

spk_0 Retrain the entire year, hit 407, re-racted.

spk_0 Now what?

spk_0 I need to hold a high standard.

spk_0 What is it?

spk_0 Well, if I was on a seal team or a SWAT team, and every dude could pass that test, we

spk_0 have a physical dynasty, because not everyone can.

spk_0 But it gives you something you'd look at me and say, I've got a laundry list of injuries.

spk_0 Dude, I'm on the wrong side of 40 right now.

spk_0 I've never taken my foot off the gas.

spk_0 And neither should you.

spk_0 You're 22 years old.

spk_0 You should be running circles around me.

spk_0 And if you're not, just because you don't care enough.

spk_0 Like no one has slapped you.

spk_0 That's the whole concept to be a pro.

spk_0 Everything I'm doing is putting me in position to be the best version of myself because

spk_0 the team deserves it.

spk_0 Everything I do, everything I say, everything I represent should be put in place.

spk_0 Putting the group in a better position.

spk_0 And for us, because it's such a dangerous job, your physical readiness, it can't be ignored.

spk_0 That is the one thing that everyone should be able to count on.

spk_0 And they should look at you.

spk_0 Well, I know John cares.

spk_0 Look at him.

spk_0 Like, you can't wake up like that.

spk_0 That dude is in the gym five days a week because he wants to be the best farming he can

spk_0 possibly be.

spk_0 And that's where we push out.

spk_0 And the standards have been great.

spk_0 A lot of guys get super humbled by him and you know, some guys lie because I see their

spk_0 numbers like, there's no way you did that.

spk_0 But it keeps them honest.

spk_0 Yeah, and it's tough.

spk_0 I mean, I looked at those numbers.

spk_0 I mean, I think most people who've been training regularly will find that maybe two or

spk_0 three of the things come naturally to them and others are difficult because everyone's

spk_0 got different.

spk_0 Like I have a really short torso, long arms.

spk_0 So certain things are easier, certain things are harder.

spk_0 Like, I think that's what I really like about it.

spk_0 It's spread out across the table so that no one person can dominate just by virtue of

spk_0 some, you know, previous sport history or natural proclivity based on body shape or

spk_0 something.

spk_0 How often are you having people self test on this?

spk_0 We tell the guys whenever they're ready, we did a 12 week block on it.

spk_0 I've been traveling a lot so I haven't really been able to retest.

spk_0 We're coming up on it maybe next two weeks or so.

spk_0 Mm-hmm.

spk_0 You're going to retest just to see where it's at.

spk_0 That was the interesting thing is I call back to the command door strength conditioning

spk_0 coaches and I pulled out all my scores from a test.

spk_0 It's very, very similar.

spk_0 Bodyweight bench, max pull ups, did the whole thing.

spk_0 My numbers now, 15 years later, some are better than they were when I was in my 20s.

spk_0 Awesome.

spk_0 And it's like, I'm not training for that.

spk_0 This is just the program.

spk_0 It keeps me at a super high level.

spk_0 We had a doctor from Duke University come down and do some CQB testing on me and we had

spk_0 to test VO2 max.

spk_0 I haven't trained for VO2 max in 20 years and my VO2 max is still on the top of 0, 0,

spk_0 0, 1% of the earth.

spk_0 All of the athletes, I don't train VO2 max and my breathing is so inefficient and that's

spk_0 what he laughed about.

spk_0 You're ultrasound, you might die a frame and he's like, you're breathing terrible.

spk_0 But it translates to where your VO2 max is awesome.

spk_0 He's like, you can live forever.

spk_0 That's how we determine how long you're going to live for is VO2 max and your VO2 max

spk_0 is still a roof.

spk_0 I don't train it.

spk_0 If you just do the program, maintain it consistently.

spk_0 It'll give you such a well-rounded approach to everything.

spk_0 That's a big thing.

spk_0 I don't want to have to say no.

spk_0 Can you pick that up?

spk_0 Can you jump over that?

spk_0 Can you move that all the way?

spk_0 Can you move him through time and space?

spk_0 Also, because you have kids and they swim in, playing, running around.

spk_0 I've been setting a high standard within family.

spk_0 I think there are always two sides to the fitness nutrition conversation.

spk_0 One is, I'll just say it.

spk_0 I feel like the standards in the United States have drifted so far in terms of what we consider

spk_0 healthy, what we're willing to accept.

spk_0 My dad, who is a first-generation immigrant here, I'll never forget.

spk_0 I think it was in the mid-90s or something.

spk_0 He said to me, he said, today, he was talking about himself.

spk_0 He said, I went to the movies and I saw people in pajamas.

spk_0 I was like, what do you mean?

spk_0 People go to the movies now as if they just woke up and they're slippers in pajamas.

spk_0 I said, yeah, and he said, this is the beginning of the end.

spk_0 He said, because when that slips, then pretty soon it's like you're willing to tolerate

spk_0 things on the street.

spk_0 Then people aren't weeding their lawns and then pretty soon it just breeds this general

spk_0 disinterest in taking care of things.

spk_0 Then I can't link it directly to people going to the movies in their pajamas.

spk_0 Everyone likes to be comfortable.

spk_0 I don't think he was saying everyone should avoid wearing sweatpants, but I think what

spk_0 he was saying is etiquette and self-care and self-respect is projected outward.

spk_0 That's one side of it.

spk_0 We have a 35% of the United States's obese, not just overweight, but obese.

spk_0 On the other side is the opportunity.

spk_0 It's always good to think about the opportunity.

spk_0 The program that you're offering it clearly is great for first responders and people

spk_0 high-intensity, high-demand work.

spk_0 The reason I'm interested in it is because I want to be fit for the next 50 years.

spk_0 I'm going to try it because I want to train to be able to do these things when I'm 70

spk_0 or 80 or not.

spk_0 If I get out that far, it's kind of like how could I possibly do it then?

spk_0 Well, by doing it every day until then, right?

spk_0 That's obvious.

spk_0 The solution is obvious.

spk_0 Is this a program that women, men, and anyone could do?

spk_0 The training doesn't just center around these movements.

spk_0 It centers around the five-day-week program.

spk_0 My understanding is there's tutorial in there.

spk_0 You get some support because I think this is really what's missing for most online programs.

spk_0 Anyone can go to YouTube or look online and go, what's the...

spk_0 We even have a foundational fitness protocol.

spk_0 It's what I've been doing for the last 30-something years and starting to modify that now based

spk_0 on the GBRS and this fit test.

spk_0 But it's a whole other thing to have support and have people work in with you because this

spk_0 is about not being the only fish in the pond.

spk_0 One of the things that program does better than anything else I've ever seen is there's

spk_0 probably 800 to a thousand movement tutorials.

spk_0 They're either guided by me with Vernon doing all the coaching cues, big toe down, feel

spk_0 this, roll this hip over, you'll feel this.

spk_0 He navigates it so well verbally.

spk_0 And physically, you can watch him.

spk_0 He'll manipulate me demonstrating exactly what you'll feel and touch.

spk_0 Didn't a message board on the backside.

spk_0 So when you finish the workout, everybody else who's done that workout, all thousands of

spk_0 people, they comment on how they're feeling and he'll read them.

spk_0 He's like, hey guys, looks like everybody's getting a little fatigued after last couple

spk_0 weeks after this power block we just did.

spk_0 Hey, we're going to tape off the next five days.

spk_0 We're going to regroup and following Monday, we're going to push and this is what we're

spk_0 going to do.

spk_0 So he'll sprinkle in more running.

spk_0 You know, when summertime comes around, we'll start to add in a little bit more, but we

spk_0 add in 20 minute walks every day.

spk_0 So everybody gets them right after you leave.

spk_0 I still a bunch of stuff from you.

spk_0 Like, shick in sunglasses.

spk_0 Let's get some vitamin D straight in the eyes first thing in the morning, set circadian

spk_0 rhythm.

spk_0 I do the same thing at night.

spk_0 They've all been saying the same thing, man.

spk_0 Like if you just make it part of your routine and Swords and Acres says it too, like,

spk_0 hey, do you workout usually?

spk_0 Uh huh.

spk_0 I'm going to workout tomorrow and the next day.

spk_0 I brush my teeth twice a day too.

spk_0 I'm going to continue doing it.

spk_0 It's part of my routine and I'm not going to miss it.

spk_0 I've been doing this in a heavy missed session for six years and I am not going to miss

spk_0 one tomorrow.

spk_0 Why would I?

spk_0 You're saying what it's doing for me.

spk_0 I mean, I've got a laundry list of injuries and I'm still able to perform at a super high

spk_0 level because I'm not taking my foot off the gas.

spk_0 There's nothing magical about me.

spk_0 I'm a, on the most normal dude you'll ever meet.

spk_0 But you mean, we have 65, seven year olds on that program.

spk_0 And if you can't do one, if you have a limitation, so do we.

spk_0 You can do a drop down menu and there'll be 40 different exercises picked from.

spk_0 So if I go to a hotel gym, I don't have it.

spk_0 Very first thing I do.

spk_0 I walk down, I scan the whole thing, I sent a Vernon.

spk_0 He's like, oh, only dumbbells to 50, huh?

spk_0 I was like, yeah.

spk_0 And he'll send me a workout or I'll just drop down the menu like, okay, well, because today's

spk_0 my leg day, I'm actually going to do Fridays workout and I'll shift Thursday because I'll

spk_0 be home my home gym.

spk_0 I'll do Thursday's workout on Friday.

spk_0 It's flexible.

spk_0 Oh, it's flexible.

spk_0 Yeah, it's so important.

spk_0 I mean, I think really, I mean, standards are what we all need for ourselves and standards

spk_0 are what, honestly, I think this country needs.

spk_0 And it's tricky because within this new administration, you know, the whole notion

spk_0 of Maha quickly got kind of stained by the, by the politicizing of like the motives

spk_0 and all that.

spk_0 Like, it, the M people need to eat better, train better.

spk_0 And they're real medical issues out there.

spk_0 People are, are contending with, but just imagine if people actually started to take their

spk_0 physical body seriously.

spk_0 Yeah, this is something I really want to, I'm going to say it again later, but I want

spk_0 to say it now very clearly.

spk_0 One thing that I think is so absolutely clear from everything you said about your backstory

spk_0 where you're at now, the eye-began work, your care for first responders, your care for

spk_0 your teammates, your family is that you take yourself seriously.

spk_0 So for you, it's a, yeah, I think most people take their feelings seriously.

spk_0 They take their responses to what's going on in their life seriously.

spk_0 You know, the, at the center of our consciousness, a previous guest said, you know, is our ego,

spk_0 the, the, us, the me that we're all like that to some extent.

spk_0 But taking oneself seriously as a form of self-respect and building up one's ability to support

spk_0 others and to do important things for other people in our life, our family and for the

spk_0 world is so key.

spk_0 And I feel like taking oneself seriously is the cornerstone of everything I've heard

spk_0 you say today and everything you're doing that it, it's not taking a feeling in a moment

spk_0 seriously.

spk_0 In fact, sometimes it's about doing that and sometimes it's about going, no, I'm going

spk_0 to push that side and I'm going to brush my teeth and I'm going to not do what I prefer

spk_0 to do in the moment so that I can really show up.

spk_0 But that we need to take ourselves seriously.

spk_0 You do.

spk_0 And you have to.

spk_0 And I have to speak thing I do.

spk_0 I begin to have to do a lot of motivational speaking lately and a lot of that.

spk_0 And I tell this story about a kid that grows up, want to be a fireman and how he got inspired

spk_0 by a fireman because that guy was a physical representation of what that kid thought a fireman

spk_0 would be.

spk_0 Looked apart, acted parties, he might as well put a red cape on this kid and sent him through

spk_0 the door.

spk_0 I mean, that's what it is.

spk_0 But that's you representing everything you think a fireman should be.

spk_0 Not just what you say, what you wear, how you speak, do everything.

spk_0 So for me, anybody who I meet, I'm giving you both barrels right now because I'm trying

spk_0 to live the actual life that I think I should be living that translates all the positive

spk_0 stuff I'm trying to put out.

spk_0 If you saw me and I was 50 pounds overweight at a bar drinking my 12 beer, talking about

spk_0 mental health, you wouldn't take me serious.

spk_0 Talking about how you were in ABC or back when that does nothing for them.

spk_0

spk_0 It's like, that's not how I identify.

spk_0 Yeah, I did that job and yeah, you think that gives me credibility.

spk_0 I don't care about that a bit.

spk_0 That doesn't give me credibility.

spk_0 The way I live my life now, my daily routine gives me the credibility.

spk_0 Because no matter who you are, you can adopt that same lifestyle.

spk_0 That same routine, you can grab it as a housewife.

spk_0 You can wake up early and go out and do a 20 minute walk every single morning before your

spk_0 kids wake up.

spk_0 You're just refusing to do it.

spk_0 I don't know why, but I promise you, if every single person ever watches this, you wake

spk_0 up and do a 20 minute walk in the morning in one after dinner and you do it for seven days

spk_0 on the eight day of the world doesn't fall apart.

spk_0 It only gets better the more you do it.

spk_0 Just well, people just don't want to put in the work.

spk_0 They want this quick fix.

spk_0 They want to be a little bit more specific.

spk_0 They want this.

spk_0 Or they're saying, and I hear this and it's trickier for me because I'm late to the game

spk_0 on kids and family, but I'll mark my words.

spk_0 But in your case, you've already had kids.

spk_0 You got a wife, you have a functioning family and a very busy, demanding career in a previous

spk_0 career that carries with it incredible experiences, but also challenges and that you resolve

spk_0 evolving now and you've resolved and you have a mission in the world.

spk_0 So a lot of times I'll hear people say, well, that's easy for you to say because you

spk_0 don't have kids and I'm muted at that moment.

spk_0 I want to respond and say, listen, when I was a graduate student, I worked 100 hours

spk_0 a week, but I was in my 20s and I didn't have kids.

spk_0 I have very little ammunition there.

spk_0 In your case, however, you have kids and you're getting up and you're doing two 20 minute

spk_0 walks.

spk_0 And you're including your family in these practices too.

spk_0 You said your evening walks with your wife or a crucial part of your connection.

spk_0 If anyone is struggling with building that bridge, especially guys' transition out of the

spk_0 military or career, you watch it with Tom Brady and everybody else, when they leave the

spk_0 thing, they were put on this earth to do, there was a fall from grace that can't be ignored.

spk_0 And most of the time that splits with the wife, right?

spk_0 Like the person you are now, she's not used to being home and now you don't have anything.

spk_0 If you were struggling to rebuild that connection with your wife, with your partner, that

spk_0 20 minute walk has saved my marriage.

spk_0 I have given it to thousands of people.

spk_0 That right there, if I could give everybody a gift, the power of that 20 minute walk.

spk_0 It's changed my whole life, man.

spk_0 That is the one constant thing I don't compromise on.

spk_0 I mean, even to the point where it's dumb as it may be when I'm walking through the Atlanta

spk_0 airport, I don't get on the little conveyor belt.

spk_0 I'm not doing that.

spk_0 I'll walk from terminal E all the way to terminal A because it's a 20 minute power push.

spk_0 I do it and I film it on social media.

spk_0 I'm getting my steps in no matter what.

spk_0 I'm not on my phone.

spk_0 I'm showing you you can find the time.

spk_0 Instead of sitting there at Starbucks for 45 minutes, wait on my flight.

spk_0 I'll just walk back and forth.

spk_0 I just got a 40 minute walk in straight.

spk_0 I'm good.

spk_0 So when I get back home, it's 2.30 in the morning.

spk_0 I don't feel guilty.

spk_0 I haven't done anything to this school today.

spk_0 I wake up in the morning, 5 a.m. and I get it up and I spin it again.

spk_0 You can find the time.

spk_0 Rarely, you have to make the time.

spk_0 If you're waiting for just a pop up, I'm like, oh, here's a free 20 minute block.

spk_0 You're not going to have it.

spk_0 And people just, that's the thing I can't get passed.

spk_0 Like, oh, I can't wake up that early.

spk_0 You have a thousand dollar smartphone that does anything.

spk_0 There's not a question you can ask.

spk_0 It doesn't have the answer to.

spk_0 And there's a clock on it.

spk_0 If you set it, it'll go off.

spk_0 When it goes off, get out of bed.

spk_0 Like, I've been doing it my whole life.

spk_0 I don't understand it.

spk_0 They just don't want to.

spk_0 They've never felt the power of being in control of the small things.

spk_0 Why stack it up to micro-wints?

spk_0 Lay out your clothes the night before.

spk_0 I mean, how many people wake up?

spk_0 You know, 20 minutes for the school to leave the door and just frown.

spk_0 And it's like, what's my black shirt?

spk_0 What's my black shirt?

spk_0 Who are my shoes?

spk_0 Where are my car keys?

spk_0 Like, that's a terrible way to start today.

spk_0 But you're the one who's doing that.

spk_0 If you've just been 10 minutes a night before, take your shower, lay out the clothes,

spk_0 put them in the logical order.

spk_0 You're about to get them dressed in the next morning and go.

spk_0 You'd be surprised how fast you're actually making a couple of coffee.

spk_0 Man, I did my entire morning routine and listened five minutes.

spk_0 What I do is my next 40, whatever you want.

spk_0 Do you 10 minutes of meditation?

spk_0 Sit there in a dark room and just tell yourself 10 things you're truly grateful for.

spk_0 I'm so glad I have my wife.

spk_0 I'm so glad I have two healthy kids.

spk_0 I'm so glad I have a company.

spk_0 I'm so glad I have two arms and two legs.

spk_0 I'm so glad I'm still alive.

spk_0 Cool.

spk_0 What are you going to do?

spk_0 I'm going to make the most out of it.

spk_0 Go to work and do that.

spk_0 People just don't want to make the time because they've never seen the example.

spk_0 So a lot of stuff we try to put out is,

spk_0 I'm trying to be a physical representation of what I'm trying to master.

spk_0 Physically strong, mentally resilient, capable, patriotic Americans.

spk_0 That's what I'm trying to do.

spk_0 I just want you to have accountability.

spk_0 I've accounted for all my failures, all my successes, and everything else in between.

spk_0 I'll show them exactly what happened when you do it wrong.

spk_0 I think I told a lot of people like the most about it.

spk_0 I will tell you all my deepest darkest secrets because you're going to learn a lot more from those

spk_0 than you are about climbing Everest.

spk_0

spk_0 Everybody wants to see the picture at the top of the mountain.

spk_0 They don't want to hear about how many sharpers you lost on the way to the top.

spk_0 They don't want to hear about that.

spk_0 I do. I want to hear about the real struggle.

spk_0 Like how hard is it to be you?

spk_0 Talk me through it.

spk_0 I can learn so much from the hardships of people.

spk_0 Just unfortunately we're in a place now where not too many people are willing to share it.

spk_0 Yeah.

spk_0 Just trying to help out as many people as possible before I hang this whole thing up and retire.

spk_0 Man, well, you are absolutely helping a ton of people.

spk_0 And today's discussion is just going to amplify that.

spk_0 I have to say, I'm immensely grateful for you.

spk_0 I felt a kinship with you from the very first time.

spk_0 I saw you on Sean's podcast because you mentioned the skateboarding thing.

spk_0 And I think I heard the words that you prefer dogs to people sometimes.

spk_0 I think you've embraced people as well.

spk_0 And your love of dogs, that was the hook.

spk_0 And then we have some common friends in the team's community.

spk_0 And that I respect very much some of whom have been guests.

spk_0 Others who are still behind the veil.

spk_0 But your message is so important.

spk_0 You have very high standards for yourself.

spk_0 And you meet those standards and you're constantly trying to meet and exceed those standards.

spk_0 And it's also very clear that you've learned,

spk_0 this is the sun-conscious genius part about maybe it's teams, maybe it's just some people in it.

spk_0 But it's clearly very alive in you.

spk_0 You learn to use physical decisions.

spk_0 Real world actionable, implementable decisions

spk_0 to create internal change so that you can engage with the world in more functional

spk_0 and more meaningful ways.

spk_0 It's like the waking up early thing.

spk_0 I confess I've been a week on the waking up early thing,

spk_0 prioritizing sleep and this kind of thing.

spk_0 There's also a strong antidepressant effect of waking up early that I've noticed

spk_0 and that exists in the literature.

spk_0 So I'm going to get back to that.

spk_0 I'm definitely going to do the GBRS program.

spk_0 I'm hoping other people will as well.

spk_0 Again, it's not a promotional for that.

spk_0 I think how amazing would it be if as a country people started to really take their physical body

spk_0 seriously, not expect some package to arrive on their doorstep

spk_0 if they were to take that pill or that thing.

spk_0 And suddenly they were going to be healthy.

spk_0 And instead to really just lean into these 20-minute walks sunlight.

spk_0 The GBRS programs, I'll say get awesome way to get all around fitness and to maintain that

spk_0 for a lifetime.

spk_0 I just want to thank you for everything you're doing.

spk_0 You've definitely opened up on an emotional level to the world.

spk_0 Today in elsewhere, you've opened up your protocols.

spk_0 You've made it very clear that you're human, that you're not perfect.

spk_0 And that despite all that, you're still going to keep striving, striving, striving.

spk_0 It's a magnificent example at every level.

spk_0 So I'm really, really grateful.

spk_0 I got someone to give you.

spk_0 For me?

spk_0 Yeah.

spk_0 Slide you those.

spk_0 Okay.

spk_0 So I'm going to tell you the backstory real quick.

spk_0 So we started doing in-house embroidery.

spk_0 And we wanted to do an American flag hat.

spk_0 But we sat down with Tyrone Ellicin.

spk_0 He runs all our stuff and we got an apprentice Sophia that does all our embroidery in-house.

spk_0 Six-head and embroidery machine.

spk_0 And we wanted to do an American flag hat.

spk_0 And I got so, I'm trying to get upset.

spk_0 I get so sick of people ordering American flag patches off Amazon from China.

spk_0 In border stitching them on hats.

spk_0 In letting that be a patriotic symbol.

spk_0 Is that how it's typically done?

spk_0 I mean, you can go to Amazon.

spk_0 I can buy 500 of those.

spk_0 And those are made in China.

spk_0 Yeah.

spk_0 And I can border stitch them on there.

spk_0 I can hot glue them on there.

spk_0 We've got this embroidered machine.

spk_0 And Tyler's a wizard with just embroidery files and everything else.

spk_0 And we were like, let's make the American flag hat.

spk_0 It's not going to be a border stitch.

spk_0 It's not going to be a patch we sew on this saying, like, what's it going to be?

spk_0 And he looked right at me and he goes, I can make you the hat.

spk_0 We are never going to make money on it.

spk_0 And I was like, I ain't about making money.

spk_0 And he's like, well, I can't mask producing me.

spk_0 There was like, the hat in the story I'm going to tell is not meant for mass production.

spk_0 So when you launch those hats, that hat is almost 24,000 individual stitches.

spk_0 It takes 60 minutes just to make the flag.

spk_0 The quality control that goes inside that if a single thread is pulled, rolled, anything,

spk_0 we cancel it, we toss it.

spk_0 But that hat, and I say it's actually stitched into the bag.

spk_0 No, it's not.

spk_0 I see what you're saying.

spk_0 It's not a patch stitch onto a hat.

spk_0 It is the hat.

spk_0 It is.

spk_0 Yeah.

spk_0 And got it.

spk_0 You know, when we first dropped those things, I told everybody I was like,

spk_0 this hat is for the people that get emotional when they hear the national anthem.

spk_0 This hat is for the people whose children say the pledge of allegiance with hand over heart.

spk_0 They go to the baseball games.

spk_0 They have a visceral response when they hear the national anthem play.

spk_0 They're not kneeling if football games and not playing all the left side and right side.

spk_0 They are patriotic Americans.

spk_0 And I told them, if you are going to wear this hat and let anything poison

spk_0 has come out of your mouth while you're wearing that hat, I will fly there and I'll snatch it off your head.

spk_0 Everything you're going to do needs to represent what you think the essence of America is.

spk_0 Everything that flows out of your mouth while you're wearing that hat,

spk_0 better be done with dignity and respect because a lot of brave men and women have sacrificed

spk_0 everything just for that little piece of cloth.

spk_0 So we don't mass produce and we drop them a couple times a year.

spk_0 We'll do it like a bee approach, drop a couple of different times.

spk_0 They fly like wildfire and it's so cool to see because of people that know they know.

spk_0 We have done so much for that flag and I hate seeing it being misrepresented in any way,

spk_0 shape or form.

spk_0 You do it such in a beautiful light.

spk_0 I would love for you to have those.

spk_0 So those came from the boys at GBRS and I know that when you wear them,

spk_0 you'll preach the gospel and you're representing American people in a beautiful way.

spk_0 But if you don't, I will fly out here and I'll snatch them off your head like I will anybody else.

spk_0 But I believe you.

spk_0 But those things, those represent we've got a bunch of patriots and a bunch of veterans

spk_0 who work inside with us.

spk_0 So every time we do that drop, the entire company, we're 40 something people strong now.

spk_0 When that hat comes out, everybody can feel it.

spk_0 Be in the wardrobe on just being a good patriot.

spk_0 I know I isolated for just Americans but the overall message is I want everyone to be a patriot.

spk_0 Everyone in the UK, Australia, New Zealand, Canada, France.

spk_0 If you have ownership and you are a patriot who where you come from,

spk_0 you represent it so much better than anyone else.

spk_0 If I've never met a person from Australia and I go there and I meet one person,

spk_0 it's a positive experience.

spk_0 For the rest of my days, I'll talk about that experience.

spk_0 So when I wear that hat, I try to represent what I want the American people to be like.

spk_0 So when somebody meets me from Zimbabwe and I'm wearing that hat,

spk_0 that interaction is going to be the best I can possibly be because it's a weight of that thing

spk_0 sitting on my head.

spk_0 When I came out here, I was telling the boys, I got to bring the Andrew to hat.

spk_0 They spun him up real quick.

spk_0 We don't drop those things still November but I wanted you to have the first one.

spk_0 So thank you for everything and thanks for having me on them.

spk_0 And thank you.

spk_0 I'm honored.

spk_0 I will wear it and I will meet and I will strive to exceed the standard that you describe.

spk_0 And I fully believe that if I don't, you'll come out here and kick my ass.

spk_0 That's part of the deal.

spk_0 We can also provide a link to where you guys make these.

spk_0 And yeah, again, I just really want to thank you.

spk_0 It's clear that quality and standards is in your DNA and it's more importantly,

spk_0 it's in everything you do right down to the hats.

spk_0 So thank you so much DJ.

spk_0 Come back again.

spk_0 I will.

spk_0 Thanks so much.

spk_0 Thank you.

spk_0 Thank you for joining me for today's discussion with DJ Shipley to find links to his website,

spk_0 as well as the links to the fitness program that we described,

spk_0 please see the show noteworthy.

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spk_0 consider for the Hubertman Lab podcast, please put those in the comments section on YouTube.

spk_0 I do read all the comments.

spk_0 For those of you that haven't heard, I have a new book coming out.

spk_0 It's my very first book.

spk_0 It's entitled Protocols and Operating Manual for the Human Body.

spk_0 This is a book that I've been working on for more than five years and that's based on more than

spk_0 30 years of research and experience.

spk_0 And it covers protocols for everything from sleep to exercise,

spk_0 to stress control protocols related to focus and motivation.

spk_0 And of course, I provide the scientific substantiation for the protocols that are included.

spk_0 The book is now available by pre-sale at protocolsbook.com.

spk_0 There you can find links to various vendors.

spk_0 You can pick the one that you like best.

spk_0 Again, the book is called Protocols and Operating Manual for the Human Body.

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spk_0 I am Hubertman Lab on all social media platforms.

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spk_0 some of which overlaps with the content of the Hubertman Lab podcast,

spk_0 but much of which is distinct from the information on the Hubertman Lab podcast.

spk_0 Again, it's Hubertman Lab on all social media platforms.

spk_0 And if you haven't already subscribed to our neural network newsletter,

spk_0 the neural network newsletter is a zero-cost monthly newsletter that includes podcast summaries,

spk_0 as well as what we call protocols in the form of one to three-page PDFs that cover everything

spk_0 from how to optimize your sleep, how to optimize dopamine, deliberate cold exposure.

spk_0 We have a foundational fitness protocol that covers cardiovascular training and resistance training.

spk_0 All of that is available completely zero cost.

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spk_0 Thank you once again for joining me for today's discussion with DJ Shipley.

spk_0 And last but certainly not least, thank you for your interest in science.

How to Make Yourself Unbreakable | DJ Shipley

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